Poll: Intelligent Design Should be Taught in Science Classes?

What Should be Taught in Science Classes Re Origin of Life?

  • Evolution only

    Votes: 28 63.6%
  • Creationism only

    Votes: 1 2.3%
  • Intelligent Design only

    Votes: 2 4.5%
  • Evolution, Creationism, Intelligent Design, and all relevant explanations from all religions

    Votes: 8 18.2%
  • Some other option (specify)

    Votes: 5 11.4%

  • Total voters
    44
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CarbineCaleb

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In the news of late has been the issue of "Intelligent Design" - our fearless leader has himself stated that he thinks that both Intelligent Design and Evolution should be taught with equal weight as science in our schools. What do you think?
 
I haven't followed this debate at all. Don't even know what the intelligent design arguments are. Personally, I'm an evolution guy.
 
Science itself is fallible. Evolution is still a theory regardless of how much evidence backs it up. In fact, everything in science is considered a theory because with the exception of mathematics nothing can be proven, only disproven.

That being said, the theory of evolution is the only origin theory with any scientific backing. It's the only one that should be taught in public schools because it's the only one with evidence. "Intelligent design" is not a theory, it's a belief. Just saying "life is too complex to have happened accidentally" goes against the very principles of science. Christian creationism is simply right out. If you're going to teach that might as well teach the Aztek creation theory.


For more, watch The Daily Show's "Evolution Schmevolution" special going on this week. :D
 
Are you trying to make my job more difficult, Caleb? :p ;)

Keeping the topic of conversation on the legal and political aspects of what is taught in public schools will result in this thread remaining open. Anything else (like religious debate) will assure its closure.

-Dave
 
The Constitution theoretically prohibits any federal requirement that creationism be taught in public schools. Teaching students that a particular diety created life (and punishing them with poor grades if they fail to recite back that idea) is pretty clearly an act respecting an established religion. Even if creationism should be factually correct, it would still be prohibited from any federally-sponsored school curriculum.
 
I vote we take those responsible for this mess (both sides)... build a rocketship to send them on a journey to find God....

keep them busy for a while.
 
Even if creationism should be factually correct, it would still be prohibited from any federally-sponsored school curriculum.

Just to point this out, creationism and intelligent design are not the same thing. Granted, most supporters of intelligent design wholeheartedly believe that the "intelligent engineer" at work is indeed the christian god but that doesn't come out in their argument because it would then be shot down even faster. Either way, neither belief has any basis in science and I fully agree with your statement.
 
BluesMan

Are you trying to make my job more difficult, Caleb?
Uhhh, no! :p I didn't really even think of this as a question of religion, actually I thought of it as a question of science... and has been all over the news of late, particularly after Mr. Bush made some statements... I suppose you can view this as a religious debate, a scientific debate, an education debate, or a legal debate. It's an issue in the political arena (if not the most pressing there), in the school boards, and in the courts.

Your concern duely noted though!
 
Teaching only one would create problems

Teaching them all would be almost impossible
a quarter is 13 weeks long...class usually runs 45 minutes..

Kind of hard to fit all of that in there.
 
I make decisions based on evidence and competing theories might be taught if each has reasonable support. There are quite a few things in my discipline like that.

However, there is little or no strong evidence for intelligent design. The science proposed for support are really stretches to accommodate people's religions (and of a particular faith despite disclaimers of that).

Since the evidential base is so weak, intelligent design should not be taught.
 
Teaching only one would create problems
How?

I went to a quasi-Christian school. Not once was intelligent design or religion mentioned as a plausible theory in biology, chemistry, or physics.

We read a few parts of the Bible in western history, but that's it. The only other exposure to religion was in the weekly/biweekly short chapel services. (They were mandated by the school's charter, because the school board didn't have the guts to change it... there were plenty of students from other religions, and many were effectively atheist/agnostic.)

Science can never be proven. That is not the point of scientific theory. Its importance is that it offers predictive powers; we model reality based on experiments (tests) so that we can plan things in the future without relying on the hand of God, if there is one.

ID and Creationism, as tools to describe the world, offer no ability to predict physical phenomena. They are non-falsifiable (cannot be disproven), so they are semantically null (meaningless) as physical descriptions of the world.

They are interesting and useful when studied critically in philosophy, sociology, and history classes. Aside from that, if you're looking for a pulpit to indoctrinate children into Christianity or Islam or any other religion, there are already places for that. They're not school. Why aren't people satisfied with churches? Why is it necessary to partially turn schools into churches as well?
 
I went to an all out Roman Catholic school, and evolution was the only theory taught in science classes. That's how it should be. There isn't one shred of evidence for creationism or intelligent design that isn't explained by propper science.
 
Science only, in school please.

Save Creationism, Intelligent Design, Hairball of the Supreme Turtle, or whatever, for Sunday School.

~Dan
 
Teaching students that a particular diety created life (and punishing them with poor grades if they fail to recite back that idea) is pretty clearly an act respecting an established religion. Even if creationism should be factually correct, it would still be prohibited from any federally-sponsored school curriculum.
So even if we knew that it was the best science could offer, we couldn't teach it? And doesn't forcing students to recite that there is no creating deity establish a state atheism?

They are non-falsifiable (cannot be disproven), so they are semantically null (meaningless) as physical descriptions of the world.
Isn't the same true of Evolution?
 
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This sort of discussion sorta bugs me, but not for the reasons you’re probably thinking.

I don’t think that anybody would disagree that a fundamental element of science is observation of a phenomenon. I don’t think anybody can honestly say that any explanation for how the earth appeared is “science”, since to the best of my knowledge, there isn’t a person around that actually observed is appearance. None of the explanations for how we, or how the earth, appeared are “science”. Trying to claim that one version is based in scientific fact, while the other is based in “religion” or “faith” is sorta like the pot calling the kettle black. Personally, I don't care which version is taught in school, although I have my own (strong) views on which is correct.
 
I voted other... I don't believe in evolution, but other people do. I believe in creationism, and others don't. 'Science is falliable', and 'religeon is made up.' Etc, etc, etc.

I figure it this way... I've got freedom of religeon; evolution is against my religeon. Others have freedom of religeon, so creationism might be against their religeous beliefs.

Schools oughtta let the parents do the teaching in some cases... And this is one of them.

Wolfe.
 
So even if we knew that it was the best science could offer, we couldn't teach it? And doesn't forcing students to recite that there is no creating deity establish a state atheism?

Religion is not science. If you could scientifically prove the existence of a diety, it would no longer be a religion based on faith. Students aren't forced to learn that there is no diety; no textbook comes out and says "There is no god."

Students are supposed to be taught what is supported by science. Intelligent design has no grounding in science.

Isn't the same true of Evolution?

No because evolution can be disproven. Evidence can certainly be found that disproves evolution just as evidence was found that disproved the sun revolved around the earth. But in terms of religion nothing can be disproven because it all has to be based on faith. When creationism supporters are asked about the evidence that supports evolution, they claim it was planted there by god.

You can't disprove something that has no basis in the first place. It's like trying to disprove that Aslan was the savior of Narnia. Scientific evidence must be testable or observable. Evolution can be observed and tested. Intelligent design can't and thus is not science.

I don’t think that anybody would disagree that a fundamental element of science is observation of a phenomenon.

Or the experimentation of such phenomenon. You're right, no one was actually there to witness the event but we do have evidence that suggests it happened. Geology, astronomy, physics, chemistry, biology, and a slew of other fields all provide evidence of the theories that define the origin of our universe. Remember, everything in science is a theory but theories have to be backed up by evidence. By observing the evidence we can come to educated conclusions that give us the most likely scenario.

To claim that the theories of origin are not science makes about as much sense as claiming that an autopsy can't determine a cause of death because no one actually witnessed it.


I figure it this way... I've got freedom of religeon; evolution is against my religeon. Others have freedom of religeon, so creationism might be against their religeous beliefs.

Evolution may be against your religion but it's based in science. If your religion stated that the earth was flat would you denounce all evidence to the contrary? Yes, you and everyone else here has freedom of religion and that's why nothing but real science should be taught. Religion is based on faith, science is based on facts.

I should rephrase my comment. Science is not fallible. The only thing that's fallible is our interpretation of it. That's why everything is a theory. But theories require evidence; religion doesn't.
 
I thought we got past this when the Church apologized for killing Bruno back in the middle ages. But it keeps popping up again and again with rationale about as logical as that for universal gun control. This is like demanding that the philosophy of gun control be taught in all gunsmithing courses.

Religion is religion and science is science, just like apples are apples and oranges are oranges. Religion is relative to spiritual truths and sets of belief. Science is the result of observation and experiment.

With this in mind I checked the first option, evolution only although I'm easygoing and will agree with any other option which, within the context of experimentation and observation, can explain biodiversity. My personal favorite is the Kilgore Trout theory that life on earth is the result of garbage left behind by an ancient species of sentient cockroach which visited our planet. :p

Seriously though, I like the way the Jesuits teach it in their high schools. They have a biology class which teaches (guess what?) biology! And they have a religion class which teaches (guess what?) religion! For those folks who send their kids to public schools there is always the perfectly acceptable alternative they might want to teach them religion at home or at their local church or synagogue.
 
I don't think any of it is appropriate for science, only history. Science is studying what we know, ie provable facts and reasonable theories.
 
I dont think teaching it its appropriate. When I created earth, I wasnt very smart, and didnt do a good job. Maybe dumb design?

However the civilaztion I created on Beta Solaris IV in the 5th Magellanic Cloud is working real well. They can teach intelligent design if they want.

Got to go, anyone needs me just sacrifice a virgin

WildthegreatpumpkinAlaska
 
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