POA/POI issues with M&P9c

G

Georgian

New member
Hey yall. I've been carrying a M&P9 2.0 compact (small grip and I believe 3.6" barrel) for approximately a year now. I have owned several M&P's, from the standard M&P9 (GEN 1) to the new 2.0 5 inch. I currently own the M&P9c and a full size M&P9. The 9c is my first compact size handgun that I have used for carry, and am extremely pleased with it. The only issue I have noticed, is that when shooting it, my groups are always consistently to the left of my POA, and the farther the target distance, the farther to the left the shots group (approximately 2-3 inches at 10-15 yards and 4-5 inches at 25 yards, give or take). I am using Ameriglo Hackathorn sights.

When I use the grip adapter and a full size magazine, providing a full size M&P grip, the groups move roughly back to center, but I carry the gun with the short 12 round magazine. Also, when shooting my standard M&P, my groups are always POA/POI. My trigger control/press is the same for the compact and full size. My only solution other than aiming slightly more to the right with the compact, is to drift the rear sight slightly to the right. Has anyone else had this sort of issue with there compact handguns that have smaller grips?

(Also, I am using the longer factory pinky extension)
 
I have a gen 1 M&P40c, great line of pistols. Are you right or left handed?

Possible Causes
1. Pushing the trigger, moving it and the gun to the left.
2. Poor sight alignment: front sight alignment is off to the left.
3. Applying extra pressure with fingertips and/or pinkie.
4.Increasing grip pressure while shot breaks, bending wrist to left.
5. Relaxing elbow while the shot breaks.
 
I have an M+P 9C . I like it. I did something you may or may not prefer to do.

I found small places on the polymer frame that had a little too much pressure on the meat of my hand. I'm not talking about pain or discomfort. Just maybe a corner slightly too square,etc.
One problem area I slightly relieved is the frame to he rear of the trigger guard.
I'm talking about the surface my trigger finger tended to rest on the side of the frame.
As I did my trigger pull thing,the trigger finger between my palm and the first joint was transferring motion to the frame.
I pretty much slightly "inletted" my trigger finger into the frame to relieve the pressure point. I doubt I took more than 1/32 in off about a 3/4 in wide area.

Its a subtle blend thing,not hogging.

The tool I used is a scraper made from about a 2 in length of roughly .025 thickness feeler gauge. I grind a gentle arc across the end,letting the grinding wheel leave a burr. I just drag that burr where I want to scrape a little off. Scrape and try. It does not take much. Its not visually noticable.

I also slightly softened the corner radius on the grip that was annoying the bone of my thumb.

Without narrowing the bow of the trigger guard,or making it less effective,I scraped some chamfer on the inside edge,where my fingernail was catching as I moved my trigger finger from outside the guard to the trigger..I have to keep that nail trimmed close!!.
Of course,I maintain right/left hand symmetry when I do this.

It may not be the answer for you,but my hand finds a home when I grip my gun, and my trigger squeeze does not transfer to the gun.
 
Shoot the pistol at 25 yards sitting at a bench with your wrists rested on something relatively soft- bags, range bag, rolled up jacket or whatever. Pay careful attention to proper sight alignment and pressing the trigger straight back. Shoot a couple of 3-5 shot groups and see where it prints. If necessary, drift the sights. You have to know the pistol is zeroed before you worry about anything else.

https://www.thesixgunjournal.net/the-importance-of-zero/
 
Thanks for the input.....it also probably doesn't help that I'm right handed and left eye dominant, however that doesn't affect my POA/POI with full size handguns. I have in the neighborhood of 5-600 rounds through the subcompact, and I enjoy shooting it more than my full size M&P, as does my wife. I have large hands, and my initial hypothesis was that due to the large amount of open space left of the bottom of my gun hand somehow contributed to my groupings shifting to the left.
 
Jet,I agree . Obviously,adjusting the sights is the first solution.

The OP said this

When I use the grip adapter and a full size magazine, providing a full size M&P grip, the groups move roughly back to center, but I carry the gun with the short 12 round magazine.
Click to expand...

So the POI changes with a mag change. The 12 round for carry and a 15 round for mag change introduces a problem a simple sight adjustment does not fix.

For myself,the 15 rd mag is much better hold for shooting.

The difference is the interface between the hand and the gun with the different magazines.

Maybe trying the different grip inserts will help. Maybe a change in grip technique will help.

In my case,trigger finger muscle pressure was pressing on the side of the gun. I relieved it like relieving a tight spot in a rifle barrel channel.

Georgian will have to figure out what it is about a mag change that moves the POI
 
When I use the grip adapter and a full size magazine, providing a full size M&P grip, the groups move roughly back to center, but I carry the gun with the short 12 round magazine.
Click to expand...
There's considerable evidence that most civilian defensive encounters occur at very close range...some suggest that's well inside 7 yds. In your case, the gun is shooting left by 2-3" at 10-15 yds, and that equates to 1-2" inside 5-7 yds...a miniscule deviation for a defensive encounter.

I'd accept that offset of POI for the carry mag, and zero the gun for the back up mag. I base this recommendation on the premise that you'd be seeking distance from attackers as well as better cover, and the better accuracy necessary for that add'l distance needs a solid zero.

Too, without knowing your experience level, you may be able to find a grip that's instantly obtainable through training, that will correct the POA discrepancies.

Defensive courses I've attended over the years have all stressed obtaining a 'firing grip' while the gun is still in the holster. Whatever grip you train for (to correct your POI), should be one that follows that admonition.

Just one man's opinion...YMMv, Best Regards, Rod
 
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You have to know the pistol is zeroed before you worry about anything else.
Click to expand...

As Sarge advised, you have to be absolutely certain where the gun is shooting before you determine where you are shooting. This can only be done by isolating the gun from human involvement as much as is possible/practical, usually with firing the gun from a rest and carefully squeezing off well-aimed shots; measuring the group and assessing the poi vs the poa.
This determinate "sighting-in" procedure can't be stressed too much. As sarge said, only after verifying how the gun is shooting in terms of its inherent zero should you move the sight(s) if needed.
Good luck! Keep us informed as to how things go.
 
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