Please Help Debate on PVP Forums!

PaladinX13

New member
PvPonline.com is one of the funniest websites with a huge community. A firearms debate is going on here:
http://www.pvponline.com/community/Forum1/HTML/003321.html

Unfortuately, I think it's heating up real quick and the good arguments are going to be lost in the flames. I'm not eloquent and I'd probably get heated up so could someone from this forum put some cool and logical (and short) arguments join in?

Long time lurker away!
 
Oh yeah, there are spin-off threads developing there too so check around. I don't mean to recruit anyone who doesn't want to go... just some people like to advocate when they have the opportunity, others like to debate (like this Xian character who seems somewhat cold to guns in general but debates pro-gun hotly).

btw, yeah, I know I could simply edit but I want a few posts under my belt. ;)
 
Recent post, go there and argue against him!

Not to prove him wrong but to prevent the propogation of myths, distortions, and anti sentiment!
---
Pro-Gun http://www.lizmichael.com/ninemyth.htm
Pro-Gun Control http://www.ncjrs.org/txtfiles/redyouth.txt

Gun Violence in the United States

There are more than 211 million firearms in the possession of private citizens in the United States, 71 million of which are handguns.2
In 1994, nearly 40% of NYC youths between the ages of 12 and 21 admitted to having carried a gun at some point in their lives.3
Black youths ages 15 to 19 are 50% more likely to be victims of murder than white youths. Firearms are the leading cause of homicidal death among black teens in this country.3
About 500 children and adolescents are killed in firearms accidents each year, many with their parents' guns.4

The Los Angeles Police Department indicates that in 1996, 386 of the 9,975 guns confiscated were "Saturday Night Specials." This figure is up from 1995 when 92 of the 11,023 guns
confiscated were "Saturday Night Specials." There are no figures available for 1997. Elected officials and the Los Angeles Police Department credit their "zero tolerance" policy toward
guns--which the "Saturday Night Special" sales ban is a part of--with the precipitous decrease in the number of gun dealers in the city. Because of city, state and federal legislation aimed at
more tightly regulating gun sales, the number of city-licenced gun dealers has dropped from 105 to 91 from 1994 to the present, while the number of federally licenced dealers has dropped
from 1,400 to 400.(12)
Other gun violence legislation being considered in Los Angeles includes an ordinance requiring that trigger locks be sold with guns, and an ordinance requiring a licence and background
check for the purchase of ammunition.

A series of gun violence incidents and increasing gun crime spurred a conference on gun violence prevention in July of 1996 in the east San Francisco Bay area. Between 1991 and 1993 six
out of every eight homicides in Alameda County (in which Oakland is located) involved a firearm, which is about 15% higher than the national average. The group that worked to develop the
conference and increase local gun violence prevention efforts included fifteen cities in the east San Francisco Bay area, the counties, school districts and law enforcement agencies. It was
their belief that a regional effort was needed to stop the violence that spills from one jurisdiction to another. Additionally, many at the conference voiced concern over the lack of assistance
they have received from the federal and state levels in achieving legislative solutions.(27) In their efforts to reduce gun violence through legislation, each city has introduced (and most have
passed) a package of ordinances addressing the following issues 28)

------------------------------------------------ http://www.stpaul.gov/council/circ/reports/gunrpt.html

Often, guns are the focus of concern over the
mayhem in our streets, and the statistics on gun
violence are indeed frightening. The FBI reports
that of the 21,597 murders in 1995, roughly
seven out of every ten were caused by firearms.
Handguns served as the weapon of choice close
to 60 percent of the time. But it's not just
firearms that breed violence. People are killing
each other with knives, clubs, fists, fire and
other means.

A firearm was the weapon used in about
7 out of 10 murders in the United States
in 1995. (11)

---------------------------------------------------- http://www.insync.net/~tagvhou/press.htm

(Washington, D.C.) A new analysis of FBI crime statistics for the first five years of the Brady Law presents compelling evidence that the lives of more than 9,000 people were saved because guns were
less available to criminals. The report, Saving Lives by Taking Guns out of Crime, was released today by the Center to Prevent Handgun Violence.

In 1997, two eminent criminologists, Frank Zimring and Gordon Hawkins, identified the "use of firearms in assault and robbery as the single environmental feature of American society that is most clearly
linked to the extraordinary death rate from interpersonal violence in the United States." Saving Lives documents the decline in violent crime committed with guns between 1994 and 1998, as well as the
precipitous increase in violent gun crime that preceded the Brady Law's passage, from 1990 to 1993. Since assaults and robberies committed with guns result in a higher death rate, the pre-Brady years
saw a larger number of murdered crime victims than could be accounted for by the crime rate. In the post-Brady years, the trend reversed itself; from 1994 though 1998 an estimated 9,368 fewer people
died than "expected" as a result of the significant decline in the proportion of violent crimes committed with guns.

---------------------------------------------------- http://www.umdnj.edu/vinjweb/stats.html

read it!


In 1995, 83 percent of 12- to 17-year-old homicide victims were murdered with a firearm.[5]

During the 1996-97 school year, 21 percent of high school principals in the United States reported one or more serious crimes (murder, rape or other type of sexual battery, suicide, physical
attack or fight with a weapon, or robbery) and 77 percent reported to the police at least one incident of crime/violence (theft, vandalism, fights or assaults without a weapon).[3] In per capita
terms, 0.1 percent of high school students reportedly committed a serious violent crime and 1.8 percent reportedly committed a less seriously classified crime.

In 1997, 7.7 percent of New Jersey high school students - and 8.5 percent of high school students in the United States - reported that they had carried a weapon (such as a gun, knife or club) on school property during the past 30 days.[1]

---------------------------------------------------- http://ojjdp.ncjrs.org/action/sec3.htm

During the period 1976 to 1991, firearms were used by 65 percent of juvenile homicide offenders (44 percent used handguns). Firearms were used in nearly 8 out of 10 juvenile homicides in 1991, compared with 6 out of 10 in 1976.2
Young black males have the most elevated homicide victimization rate of any race or gender group. Homicides involving firearms have been the leading cause of death for black males ages
15 to 19 since 1969, and the rates more than doubled in the decade from 1979 (40 deaths per 100,000) to 1989 (85 deaths per 100,000).3 Teenage boys in all racial and ethnic groups are
more likely to die from gunshot wounds than from all natural causes combined.4
Between 1979 and 1991, the rate of suicide among youth ages 15 to 19 increased 31 percent. In 1991, 1,899 youth ages 15 to 19 committed suicide, a rate of 11 per 100,000 youth in this age group. Firearms were used in 6 out of 10 suicides among youth ages 15 to 19 in 1989.5

---------------------------------------------------- http://www.lib.msu.edu/harris23/crimjust/guncont.htm http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/press/facov.pr

--Among state prison inmates with a prior adult criminal
record who possessed handguns, 23 percent said they bought the
weapon from a retail store.
--An estimated 5,000 murderers who were serving time in a state
prison for committing a crime with a handgun had purchased their gun
in a store or gun shop despite having had a prior record.
--More than 50 percent of the prison inmates who obtained
a handgun illegally said they did so to avoid a background
check or a waiting period.

---------------------------------------------------- http://www.usatoday.com/news/ndsguns.htm

The 1999 figures brought the number of purchase rejections since the Brady
Act instituted background checks in February 1994 to 536,000 out of
almost 22.3 million applications, the department's Bureau of Justice
Statistics reported. That confirmed earlier estimates of more than 500,000
rejections.

The decline in the number of violent crimes committed with firearms nationwide has been even more dramatic than the drop in the overall crime rate. Between 1992 and 1998, Federal Bureau of
Investigation (FBI) Uniform Crime Report (UCR) data show that violent crimes committed with firearms decreased by over 35%. This decrease is depicted in the attached graph. See Attachment C. The
most recent UCR data also show that homicides dropped 7% during 1998, a decline apparently attributable entirely to a decrease in killings with firearms. At least one highly respected criminologist has
publicly attributed this decline in gun crime to efforts at controlling the availability of guns to young people and recent law enforcement strategies. See "FBI Study Finds Gun Use in Violent Crimes
Declining," New York Times, A16 (October 18, 1999), Attachment D

-------------------------------------------------- http://www.soros.org/crime/gunreport.htm

35 states have neither licensing nor registration for any type of gun. Only one state, Massachusetts,has both licensing and registration for all guns.
Consequently, Massachusetts is the only state where police have the ability to check and reconsider whether changing circumstances affect someone’s suitability to own guns.
Background checks
32 states require no background checks when a handgun is purchased from a private seller, whether over the back fence or at a gun show. Some states that do require background checks have no mech- anism for ensuring that they occur.
44 states require no background checks when a rifle or shotgun is bought from a private seller.
23 states require only the basic federal background checks when a handgun is purchased from a dealer.(The other 27 states require checks of state police records as well.)
Children
Seven states have no legal minimum age for a child buying rifles or shotguns from a private seller.18 states have no minimum age for possession of these guns, and 13 states have a minimum age between 12 and 16.
Six states have no legal minimum age for a child to possess handguns. Five states set the minimum age between 14 and 16. (Federal law stipulates a minimum age of 18 to possess handguns, but the survey found that state policy prevails in enforcement.)
Waiting periods
31 states have no waiting period for handgun purchases.12 states require more than three days.
43 states have no waiting period for purchase of rifles or shotguns.

-------------------------------------------------- http://www1.umn.edu/cvpc/linksviolence.html

--------------------------------------------------

With the number of resources available, I could theoretically go on for weeks. The quotes taken from these articles do not make up all of the good information in them.
 
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