Picked up a VZ 24 action yesterday

T

That Guy From Texas

Inactive
So i picked this up yesterday for $30, thought it'd be a neat project rifle. i wanted to learn how to work on rifles, do headspacing, parkerizing, the whole thing.

i blurred the serial numbers on the rifle, but none of them match.

the bottom metal isn't original as far as i can tell, you know: stainless, only has 2 screws rather than the original 4, no serial number. however it's long enough for a 30-06

everything looks solid and works proper as far as i can figure, no cracks that i can see (still probably going to take it to a smith to be sure)

my main question is: what should i do? should i try to rebuild the original? parts are cheap enough. or should i do what i want with it? "sporterize" it since it has no matching numbers to speak of?

i already have a 30-06, so i was wondering about fitting it with a smaller bullet, similar to a 243, but it's also a long action and would prefer to not try to get the long action to feed short rounds if it might cause feeding issues or not even work in the long magazine.
 

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here's a few more pictures

having a hard time making out the service acceptance stamp
 

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Before you even start work on a rebarrel, the action needs to be inspected for suitability...especially lug setback.

Recommend you get this:

https://www.amazon.com/Mauser-M91-t...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=WB538XW8Q0EX6D94XE8Y


A lot of tooling will be required...action wrench, barrel vise, reamer and extension (for short-chambered barrels), headspace gauges...list goes on. You'll pay far more to DIY than a smith, but if the objective is to learn and do more beyond this one and you're willing to make the investment...

If you're going to scope it, there's cocking piece/safety modification required, drilling/tapping of the scope mount and bent bolt mod. If no scope, you'll need to outfit with open sights.

Invest in Kuhnhausen's manual first to see if this is something for which you have the equipment, abilities and budget before taking the plunge. JMO....
 
Thanks!

that's very helpful, i didn't actually think about the vise and other specialized tools i would need. i knew i would need to do headspacing, truing the bolt face, redoing the finish, and such as that.

i would like to do it to learn, just maybe down the road, after i get moved into an actual house :D

i still think it'd be a good one to start out on. i'll get the book and go through it and see what all it entails. i do have a bit of skill in the shop, mostly making knives when i was growing up and on and off when i can go back to work in his shop.

though, when the time comes (or if i get impatient or change my mind and have the smith do it) what direction should i take it? i would enjoy an open sight rifle but it'd be nice to have a forward mount scope as well.
 
"no cracks that i can see "
You won't see them until it blows up.

"i was wondering about fitting it with a smaller bullet, similar to a 243,"
Look at the 257 Roberts. Similar case shape and length to the original 8x57 so no problems with magazine function and a darned good cartridge(better than a 243 but ammo selection is thin).
 
I really can't use a microscope of some power to see minor fractures? I guess it'd be stress on the steel depending on how hard it was used before I got it.

How hard is it to get 257? I've heard of it but hadn't deliberately looked for it before. Is there a more common round if that one is hard to come by?

Are the at home video courses any good?
 
That Guy From Texas said:
Are the at home video courses any good?
Click to expand...

You'll learn something from the video courses. However, what you don't get is hands on instruction and access to equipment you can't afford for building just one rifle. Again it'll be more expensive than paying a Smith to build you a rifle, but you'll walk away with knowledge and skills you can build upon.

.257 Roberts isn't commonly found in stores, but pretty easy to get online. .25-06 is a lot more common than the .257 Roberts making it easier to find locally. .270 Win is another good choice if you want ammo availability, but it's really close in performance and recoil to the .30-06.
 
The way to find out if a metal item is cracked is to have it magnafluxed (magnetic testing). You don't see a lot of M98 actions that have cracked because they are carburized (a case hardening process) and are only hard on the surface. If they are subjected to abuse or overpressure, the harder surface yields and the softer interior deforms to aborb the damage. So, have it inspected by someone who really knows what they are doing (it seems intuitive, but many people will take these old actions to some guy down the street who may have never even seen one before and ask that person what they should do. Check the action for straightness and lug setback. Have it drilled, tapped, attach a new bolt handle, choose a different safety, then send it to a heat-treater to be carburized again (there are some that are experienced with military actions). After it comes back from heat treat, finish polish the action and start the rebarreling process.
 
There are many ways to look at it.I've built most of my rifles. All of the steps Scorch mentioned are sound reasoning. Good,safe practice.
I have not had any heat treating or even MagnaFluxing done. That's not advice.
A mil restoration? Just buy a military Mauser and be done.

Your 30-06 length steel commercial guard is a prize. You do have some pitting that is a cosmetic issue. It does not hurt utility, but there is enough "sow's ear" to not try to make a silk purse.

You have a scoped 30-06 hunting rifle.

I'll offer a practical idea.The "Old School " bolt hunting rifle ,utility grade. There was a time when fewer rifles were scoped.The receiever peep was normal. The Lyman 48 or 57,the Redfields.E-bay

Good,solid adjustable sights. If your eyes work well,and you can shoot reasonably well, 200 yard deer shots are not a problem.Folks beat that considerably.
A non scoped rifle carries nice.Its handy.Its good in rain and snow.Its a great back up rifle.

Just two screws to drill and tap. No need to alter the bolt or safety.

I might just get a Lothar Walther pre-threaded short chambered barrel.They do well on Mauser barrels.

Bishop and Fajen have gone away with all the Missouri walnut. Boyds might sell you a precarved stock.I'd avoid the plywood.Its heavy. A Griffin and Howe sporter is a classic pattern with the righr comb for iron sights.

That's probably what I'd do,another 30-06.
UPDATE: I looked at all the pics.Thats a Brno VZ-24. Those were good ones.I'd have faith in it.( The diaphragm inside the receiver where the lugs bear looks pristine.) WRONG!! See Scorch below!
From what I can see you did very well.I'd build on it.
 
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The diaphragm inside the receiver where the lugs bear looks pristine.
Click to expand...
Except that is not where the lugs bear. That is where the barrel seats.

In my post, I did not mean to imply that every Mauser needs to be re-heat treated or Magnafluxed. Most are just fine without doing any of that. But you have to know what you are looking at.
 
6mm Remington and 257 Roberts both are offspring of the 57mm length case of the 7x57 and 8x57. Overall cartridge length will be shorter but I've not noticed this being a problem. I have a 257R on a 98 Mauser action that works fine.
 
I'm going to take it down the street to the smith at a local gun shop this evening (somebody who hopefully knows what they're doing, but they're just a guy down the street :D). hopefully they will be able to tell me more or less about whether to carburize or not, i'd like to put a nicer finish and work out some of the pits, so i'm sure that'd need carburizing after that's gone. unless that sounds like a bad idea of course.

i'll have it checked out today w/ lug setback, straightness, ect. it looks straight to me and cycles well, all the lugs look fine, have a little bit of room on the rear lug behind it, but it's probably to keep it from binding when it locks forward.

the bottom metal is a little rough, i'll probably give it a nice finish. it looks like somebody just took an in the white bottom metal and stuck it on there. i took most of the rust off the other night by soaking it in vinegar, now it has a bit of a patina, but it's not pitting for now. i'll probably parkerize them both when it comes time to finish it, that way i can get a nice dark black.

i actually have a CZ 550 FS for my hunting rifle, going to get QD rings for it since the irons are so nice so i can use both.

that being said, i love the idea of the old peep/aperture sights on there, which would make for a really fun rifle. Lyman sights would be perfect.

i was looking at boyds, they have a stock for a mauser 98 with the option for commercial floor plate and #1 barrel. i love walnut and don't like laminate, i had no idea there was a weight difference. guessing prairie hunter or varmint would give me the right comb. i think i'll get a bull barrel with lyman sights, i can contour the inside of the stock to take the bull barrel :D

since i have the 30-06 i think i'll go with something different maybe.
the 6mm Rem sounds nice. or maybe i'll do the 30 to keep from buying different types of ammo :confused:
 
The Classic or Platinum will work better with iron sights but still aren't ideal. The Varmint and Prairie hunter stock are designed for scopes. You need more drop in your comb to use sights or you'll have to raise them up like on an AR15 to compensate for the straight comb. For proper use with iron sights you need a stock more like this CZ527 Carbine. If you look at the shape of the stock it's designed to line your eye up with the sights on the rifle.
 
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The whole point of what you are doing is making what it is that YOU want.You do it your way.
I just threw out some ideas for your imagination.

You certainly can work on the cosmetics. I would not be concerned about reducing those little pits requiring a new heat treat. I do suggest a very minimal touch on the receiver ring. Not so much about strengrth,unless you went extreme,but that Brno crest is a good thing. That,and if you do scope it,its the foundation for the base.Its best if its as true as possible.

It will take some time and elbow grease,but I really like this stuff:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1006382085/formax-liquid-abrasive-sandpaper-1-quart

Take your pick,120 to 240 grit. Its milkshake thick. Make shapes of files out of a hard wood like hard maple. Put a heavy coat on.Hang to dry.It cuts pretty fast,it won't make deep scratches,it will break down some to conform,but your polishing will have definition.You won't wash things out. Good stuff.

I suggested a receiver sight rifle because it saves a lot of work/money. A scope demands a scope safety,drill and tap,and an altered bolt handle.
The bolt handle has to be done right.

I'd suggest you make that decision before ordering a stock. An iron sight rifle is best with a lower comb. As I suggested,the Griffin and Howe is a good iron sight pattern.So is a pre-war M-70.

You mentioned a bull barrel.You might want to look at vintage NRA Hi-Power competition rifles for ideas.

If you want to scope it,then maybe a more coyote sort of 25-06 or ? ...Its up to you.Then a stock designed for scoped rifles is better. The M-70 pattern,IMO,is still a nice classic...Boyds...is not quite the outfits we used to have.I'll give it an "OK" I just don't know a better idea. Maybe if Numrich has a Mark 10 stock?Or some other commercial Mauser,it might work well.

If you have a "Smith down the street" see if he has the mandrel Brownell's sells to true the face of the receiver ring.It uses the threads inside the receiver.

The Military barrels did not use barrel shoulder on the face of the receiver. They just bottomed on that diaphragm .A very light cleanup facing cut helps give your barrel a foundation. That helps accuracy. Of course,if you get a pre-thread barrel,you have to make sure the barrel tenon length is right.

Keep us posted! These are a fun project.You will have questions,we already made most of the mistakes so you don't have to.



If you go smaller,I do agree,stay with the cartridges that came from the Mauser case,6mm,257 R.
 
"...find a local trade school that offers a gunsmithing course..." Yep. Or your local Community College.
This will be handy. The VZ 24 is a 'Large Ring' M98. Number 5 on the Action list.
http://www.hoosiergunworks.com/catalog/mauser_reference.html
"...and other specialized tools..." That list starts with a solid work bench with a 4" vise mounted on it. Said vise will need padding too. 8 ounce or thicker leather makes the padding.
 
Be advised, you will spend more for your "customizing" than a moderate priced factory rifle would cost. This is why I quit the Mauser habit 10 years back.
 
ah i see, that does make sense to have the stock that way. like the 'hog back' (if that's the term i'm looking for) on my CZ full stock. i like the look of the platinum for the raised cheek weld as my rifle has that as well.

i plan on doing what i want in that way, but i wasn't sure if i wanted to keep it military or completely do what i want. i like having ideas thrown my way, y'all may think of things i wouldn't, like the lyman sights for intance. i put aperture sights on my 10/22 because i liked those irons much better than the standard buckhorn sights.

yeah, i definitely want to keep the crest on there. i suppose i'll just use 0000 steel wool on the receiver and parkerize it. that's all you need for that isn't it? to have a fine finish bare steel?

i'll definitely need to refinish the bottom metal. i have no idea what it was like when it came from the factory but it looks like they sanded on it in odd directions to help fit it in the stock? not to mention neglect an in the white part and let it pit. it shouldn't be too bad, but that liquid abrasive sounds like it'll beat the hell out of having to use X number of sheets of wet/dry sand paper.

i oddly like the straight bolt handle so i'm going to stick with the peep sights most likely.

i went to the smith today and it turns out that he stopped taking orders and wasn't there. however there was a guy in the shop that said he went to trade school for it but they don't hire him for doing gun smith work. he looked it over, checked the lugs and everything. said it was just fine, one spot on a lug that looked odd, but was probably something in the finish. said he'd build on it.

i didn't bother asking about the tool to true the face of the receiver for obvious reasons. however i may try my hand at it, i've spent my fair share of time in the shop, i feel confident i won't screw up and take too much off. i could blueprint the action while i have it without a barrel and do the bolt face too.

that is a handy site, that hoosier gun works. i actually have a 4" vintage wilton vise sitting in the floor of my dad's shop waiting for me to get it a home.

i figured that it would be more expensive to do this, but it'll be a hobby for me more than anything. if i wanted a rifle to go shoot i'd just grab an entry level ruger or something. i honestly think this kinda stuff is a lot of fun.

i'll keep y'all updated. it'll be finishing the parts and blueprinting for now, doing everything i can before i have to buy a barrel and stock.

it'll probably be a while before it's completely finished, working on saving for a house as well, that way i can have my own shop. so in the meantime it's whenever i can get back to my dad's to use his or what i can do here.
the finished product will probably be in another post down the road.
 
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