People who post YouTube "open cary" videos?

What's your opinion on the people who post "open carry" videos to YouTube?

  • They're civil rights activists, and have a positive impact. Keep it up.

    Votes: 10 22.2%

  • They're just after atention, and have a negavite impact. Enough.

    Votes: 35 77.8%
  • Total voters
    45
  • Poll closed .
D

dayman

New member
Are the posters championing civil rights, or just being intentionally abrasive so they can get some attention?


A post was recently shut down in the handgun forum, but it got me thinking.

Personally, while I am 100% for having legal open carry, I tend to find the endless stream of "police harassment" videos annoying.
I don't think it's unreasonable for police to question people wandering around showing a gun, and it seems like everyone's day would go a lot smoother if they were a little more cooperative. Most of the cops I know are pro 2a guys, but their job is to make people feel safe, and if they see someone walking around with a gun (or someone else calls it in) it seems like it's within their job description to check things out.

The image of gun owners that gun control advocates try to project is a bunch of paranoids who don't fit in to modern society very well.
And videotaping yourself walking around with a gun until the police show up, and then proceeding to compare them to the gestapo and quote fragments of the constitution kind of plays into that stereotype. The only people who are going to be impressed are people who already completely agree with you, and not even all of us.
Open carry has it's uses, and in areas/places where it's socially acceptable I'm all for it, but since every state now allows concealed carry, I simply don't see the purpose of carrying openly in areas where you know it's going to cause problems.

Anyway, that's my opinion. I'm sure there are others.
I'm honestly curious to see what the results of the poll are.
 
First off, I live in an OC/CC state, and will OC sometimes, depending on who I am around, where I'm going, and what I'm wearing. I am more likely to OC going to the grocery store after work in my suit and tie than I am to go to the local movie theater, etc.

Second, I have nothing against people recording police interactions. It's a matter of documentation, and it can help you remember details in case the police action requires further action.

If you're gonna OC, just carry. Feel free to record the conversation, but there's no reason to be a prick about it. If the incident doesn't move you to file a formal complaint and/or sue the officer and department, then it apparently wasn't that big a deal to you. If you do pursue legal action, then save the video for evidence.
 
It does seem like some of the posters are provoking a response to make a point. I've seen a few where the "cops" were more tolerant than I would have been.
Ps Dayman, you might want to edit out what you compared them too, or you thread may and will be shut down. I speak from experience!
 
Youtube Yo-Yos....

I'm not a big fan of the Youtubers or "activists" who feel they need to engage LE officers in petty disputes or attend political rallys with rifles/ARs & get media attention-crowd reactions.
Some of these people really need a new hobby or a girlfriend, IMO :D .

That said, I do like the "Every 2nd Counts" concept & would OC on the 2nd of every month if the laws/statues allowed it in my area. I first heard of the political movement on Yankee Marshal's Youtube channel.
He also advised gun owners/2A supporters to carry empty holsters to show support but that's not a concept I could support.
I've seen uniformed security guards that do it & it is highly unprofessional in my view.
It makes some in the general public think; does that person own a real firearm? Did they lose it or misplace it? Are they able to defend themselves without a firearm?

I've stated in the past on TFL that guns are not fashion accessories or political statements but the "every 2nd counts" concept has merit to me(where legal or allowed).
I would add that any gun owner or license holder should be a mature adult & not make "let's pester the local PD" videos just to stir up a confrontation.
That for the record, includes sworn LE officers who sometimes lose their cool in these events(see the Sydney Nebraska police officer who flips out on a young couple). Even the patrol officer's supervisor has to step in & calm him down.
 
Idaho is an OC state. People will call 911 if they see somebody walking around toting a rifle or shotgun. Handguns don't seem to draw all that much attention. I've never had any issues with any OC activists. But then I understand the law and I can communicate with them. I have encountered a few who are hardcore Sovereign Citizen types and they have tried to get me fired up. I've just ended the encounter by wishing them a good day.

One guy then stood there glaring at me. I advised him that we were now in a funny situation because his philosophy/doctrine doesn't recognize my legal authority and that made things awkward because he was free to go. I asked him if we were going to spend all day looking at each other which would make for a real unproductive day. I was smiling, but I kept wondering of he was going to reach down to the pistol on his hip. He finally turned around and walked off. That was probably the most tense situation that I've ever dealt with when it comes to an OC activist.
 
Here's your sign !!!

Unless it's educational, it's just another opportunity for folks to say;
"Look at me, look at me."

Be Safe !!!
 
I support the open-carriers. As far as the utoob videos go; I cringe when the guy has a debate with the cops and they come to arguing in circles. Better to keep one's mouth shut and let the cop make all the mistakes, ie. demanding to see an ID without explaining why, or arresting the guy when he won't comply with those demands.
If these $23,500 lawsuits keep occuring, I believe that police departments and 911 dispatchers will inform 'concerned' callers that someone with a holstered handgun is not breaking any laws.
 
Is their motivation civil activism or attention? Probably some of each.

Are their tactics effective? Not usually. People that agree with them might cheer them on, but I don't see those kind of displays being likely to change people's minds.
 
I agree with the OP wholeheartedly. The folks in those OC videos aren't the kind of shooters I have any interest in spending time with, and I loathe that they're visible faces of the shooting community to people who aren't gun people. Seems like a great way to turn people from neutral to anti-gun.
 
Lt. Skrumpledonk Ret said:
Better to keep one's mouth shut and let the cop make all the mistakes, ie. demanding to see an ID without explaining why, .
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I personally would have no problem showing my I'd to LE if asked. Although I would like to know why?
You have to put yourself in there place. You may look like or fit description of someone who has warrants or committed a crime. I would be willing to remove there suspicions.
 
Unfortunately the mainstream media doesn't portray gun owners very flatteringly. Unfortunately, these youtube videos don't either.
 
+1 dajowi
Freedom of expression and the press also means anyone is free to publicly fully exhibit their "cranial rectitus" abilities, not only for the world but now all eternity.
 
Just a little info folks. At least in terms of Idaho. Idaho is a single consent state when it comes to being recorded. As an officer I consent to being recorded which means I and my fellow officers all carry digital recorders in our pockets. Many now have cameras in their hand microphones and ,of course, there are cameras in the patrol cars.

You can pretty much bet that if you have any interaction with an officer with my agency he or she will be recording you so feel free to record it yourself. Personally I once had somebody accuse me of lying to them, making threats and other things. They were making dark hints of lawsuits and what not. So I played my audio for them (my little voice told me to save that audio) and my lieutenant at the same time. The Lt. listened, thanked me and excused me, but asked the citizen to stay. He had me close the door to his office on the way out.

Most of the time I just wave at the people with the cameras and smartphones. They usually wave back. Seems to throw them though.

One time I had a smartphone person walk right into the middle of a situation. I told them that they could keep recording, but if they try to interfere I would arrest them for Resist and Obstruct. I then ordered them to step back across the street for their safety and mine. She complied. I think she was hoping I would tell her to stop recording. Why? I was recording also.

Just a little FYI.
 
Personally, while I am 100% for having legal open carry, I tend to find the endless stream of "police harassment" videos annoying.
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They don't tend to be so annoying if you don't watch them. Seriously, you have to do a web search to bring them up. Yodeling annoys me, but I don't go doing youtube searches to hear people yodel...:rolleyes:
 
What's the big deal about showing ID? In the last two weeks I've had to show ID to purchase, cigarettes, alcohol, ammo, pvc cement, and childrens cold medicine. Showing ID to a cop is much less intrusive. I'd imagine that if the idiot behind the camera would just show his ID and ccw permit, that the cop would probably just send you on your way.

Most cops I've met have no problem with law abiding folks carrying guns, they just want to make sure you aren't breaking the law.

Don't most states have a requirement that if you carry, you have to present your permit to an LEO when requested? Here in Indiana we do.
 
Don't most states have a requirement that if you carry, you have to present your permit to an LEO when requested? Here in Indiana we do.
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That is going to vary from one state to the next. But if open carry is legal w/o a permit (it's not here), there is no requirement to carry any ID at all. You *might* still have to give the cop your name if he asks for it (Nevada) but you don't have to show him any papers.

On a more general note, if nobody pushes back the line gets redrawn.

Most cops I've met have no problem with law abiding folks carrying guns, they just want to make sure you aren't breaking the law.
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He needs reasonable articulable suspicion of a crime (based on specific facts) to detain you. Wearing a gun in a lawful manner does not rise to that level.
 
Even if they are actually civil rights activists, they aren't helping the pro 2A cause. Them scaring people does nothing but push them away. Inciting fear into the people you come in contact with while carrying in such a manner doesn't exactly go well for any of us, regardless of what any other 2A supporters think.

It is very important to remember that we aren't trying to convince ourselves of anything, but we need to sway fence sitters or people that aren't too far gone on the issue towards supporting us. That's impossible to do if their interactions with gun owners make them think we're all crazy.
 
I think that a lot of them are targeting the wrong audience, i.e., the police. The gun toter should be friendly and not antagonize the police. The police should be friendly and do everything to de-escalate the situation, meaning no lectures. They should do the minimum to ensure the person intends no harm and then let them be on their way.

I recently saw a video of a young man describing his incident of OC in Oregon. He was in a restaurant with his family and a patron called the sheriff. He was perfectly within his rights to OC. He went to a lawyer who drafted a warning letter to the other patron stating that calling 911 and falsely reporting a crime was a misdemeanor. Callers should be questioned as to what illegal activity is being displayed and if any threatening actions are being made. If not, then "have a nice day, thanks for your call. G'bye." Or perhaps they tell the caller that they will check it out and if it's a false report the police will be charging them with the cost of the deployment.
 
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