Opinions after a year of concealed carry

flightline

New member
So it's been a little over a year since I got my CHL (Concealed Handgun License, it's what they call it here in NC) and I thought I'd share some things that I've changed my mind about since I started carrying, and some things I haven't. A lot of this has been said before, but anyway, in no particular order:

1. People are really oblivious. I used to worry a lot about printing, and making it absolutely impossible to tell that I was carrying a weapon. However, even if you're printing like a madman, the only people likely to notice are other CC'ers, who aren't likely to care. In NC, open carry is legal, so I've stopped worrying so much that someone might notice.

2. Size matters more that weight. With a good belt and holster you'll hardly notice even a midsize all-steel gun, or at least not to the extent that it will become uncomfortable. I think weight is actually a benefit, as it helps to tame recoil a bit and aid shot placement. Some people seem to have the macho opinion that "recoil isn't a problem for me" or something similar, but it's not a binary thing; less recoil is better as far as getting back on target quickly.

3. Calibre matters. Admittedly, this is something that one can't really form an opinion on by experience, but the guiding principle that, from a terminal ballistics perspective, bigger, heavier and faster is better. I've heard people say things like, 'calibre isn't important, just choose something you can shoot well.' However it's pretty obvious that this isn't quite true; .22 BB is obviously inadequate for a defensive gun even if you shoot it perfectly well. There is a compromise that has to be made between terminal performance and the recoil, size and weight of the gun. I don't claim to be able to dictate where this "sweet spot" is for anyone else, but I think for most it probably lies somewhere between .380 ACP and 10mm.

4. Make convenience a priority. The adage that a gun you have with you is better than the one left at home couldn't be more true. Between NC's gun laws and school, I find that I very frequently have to disarm myself throughout the day. My first holster was a Comp-Tac CTAC with the C style clips. For disarming, I would either remove the gun, drop the magazine, rack the slide, reseat the magazine, and put it in my glove box along with the +1 round, OR, fiddle with the C-clips, loosen my belt, slide the whole holster out of the waistband and put it, with the gun still in it, into the glovebox. I now have normal clips for that holster, as well as a paddle style holster, also from comp-tac. That holster goes on and off much more easily, and as a result, I find I'm much more likely to put it back on later. For example, I pull up at the bank (banned for CC in NC) and take the holster off. After coming back out, if I have to drop by the grocery store before heading home, I would be much more likely to say screw it and leave the gun in the car with the IWB holster than with the paddle.

In the end the primary rig I've settled on is an MK40 in a comp-tac paddle, loaded with 165 gr PDX1. I'm considering something slightly larger for OWB carry, but haven't decided anything yet.

I'm interested to hear about things you've changed your mind about since you started carrying, and any progressions in gun or holster you've made.
 
I live in FL .I use galco triton iwb kydex holsters for my mp 40c or sw m60 .Easy on & off .Use a galco iwb for my sp101 in leather wish they would make a triton I would carry one in a heart beat.
 
I started with an all steel, full size Springfield GI 1911, 8+1, extra mag, IWB.

Moved up to a stainless Springer, 8+1, extra mag, IWB.

Moved to an RIA, 8+1, extra mag, IWB.

Experimented with an XD, 12+1, extra mag, IWB, . . . ugh!

On and off, . . . Colt Det. Spec. .38, . . . Ruger P89, . . . Bersa .380, . . . etc.

Moved to an ATI commander size, 8+1, extra mag, IWB.

It is just hard to beat an all steel 1911 in my world.

May God bless,
Dwight
 
Good summary flightline. The biggest think I learned after a few months of carry was that people really are oblivious to any thing that goes on around them.
 
More than a decade and a half of concealed carry has led me in the opposite direction as far as caliber goes. I used to carry a Colt Commander 45ACP. Too heavy and very difficult to carry in the hot summer months while wearing athletic shorts and flip flops. I down sized to a Sig P230. Nice gun but again, quite heavy for my lifestyle. So for the past ten years I exclusively carry a 38SPL Colt Detective. I am more than convinced that caliber actually doesn't matter...as a legally armed citizen, I am only interested in stopping an attack. I would be very comfortable carrying a so-called "mouse gun" because every criminal I have ever met is definitely not interested in being on the receiving end of even one or two or three shots from even 25ACP. In fact, for over a decade, my wife has confidently carried a 5.6mm (22LR) Walther PPK which she can shoot a ragged hole with from the hip.
 
Thanks for sharing your experience and opinions.

I have no idea how concealed carry is going to shape up here in Illinois but I can forsee having to leave the weapon in the car when going to the library, my kid's school, and possibly other places.

That makes me lean toward a pocket pistol that I can just put in a lock box. Easy to get in and out of a pocket. But that's just my thinking.

I was thinking about the Kahr MK9, it's smaller than the PM9 or CM9 but heavier because it's an all-steel pistol. I thought the extra mass would help with recoil but wondered about the weight being bothersome.

I have to argue with you about your third point though. Your experience with carrying doesn't translate into knowledge about caliber. Maybe if you'd been in a shootout or something, but that's not the case.

You can have your opinions on caliber - but the fact that you've carried a pistol around for a while doesn't make those opinions about caliber any more valid.

I appreciate your thread. I don't have a whole lot of money to try three or four different kinds of carry pistols, I pretty much have to get it right on the first try, so thanks for sharing your experience.
 
C0untZer0, I think you'll like the MK9. Excellent fit and finish, and there's something you just have to love about an all-steel gun.

About calibre, I agree that no amount of experience can really inform that decision very well. What we're left with is a hodgepodge of data from various sources, and dubious conclusions about how much gun is 'enough.' The truth that no one likes to admit is that handguns aren't very effective weapons, and there are really no guarantees of their effectiveness, regardless of firepower. There was an incident a few years ago in which a suspect got into a gunfight with a police officer, and took 11 rounds of .40 S&W to center mass, then, after both were out of ammo, got in his truck and drove off before dying a few hundred yards later and crashing into a fence. Any gun is better than none, and given identical shot placement, bigger is better. Of course, shot placement largely depends on the calibre (due to the effects of recoil) so this is a compromise that you have to decide on for yourself. I didn't mean to imply that my experience has uniquely prepared me to decide what calibre weapon you should carry, but my opinion on this has become more nuanced after shooting a variety of different guns. If I thought calibre didn't matter at all, I would probably carry my Ruger Mk. II, because it has practically no recoil to speak of anyway and I'm damn accurate with it. But I can shoot the MK40 pretty well too, and to me it's worth the slight loss in accuracy and low recoil to have a round with a much higher terminal effect.

I couldn't argue with a statement that calibre doesn't matter much, but it clearly matters some
 
I've heard people say things like, 'calibre isn't important, just choose something you can shoot well.'
The best advice I ever heard was "Carry the largest caliber you can shoot well."
Over my seven-plus-year Search for the Perfect CHL, I spent too much time looking for what was easiest to carry. I wasted a lot of time, money, effort and ammo on j-frames, Kel-Tecs, etc.
These days I carry a 4" 1911 or a 4" N-frame, both in "a caliber that starts with a 4".

I shoot both well, and I have faith in those cartridges.
 
I agree that most people are pretty oblivious to their surroundings, so printing really isn't that much of an issue. I spent months stressing out about it, until I realized this.

As for caliber, yes. I say carry the largest caliber firearm you feel comfortable with and can shoot well. Focus more on practicing with it to be proficient as possible and work on your situational awareness as well.

I started carrying a Charter Arms Undercover (original 70's model with exposed ejector rod) in an old Safariland leather IWB holster with a belt clip and thumb strap and reinforced lip. Damn comfy. Carried that for a few years until I could afford better, then I moved up to an HK USP40c which I also carried IWB in various holsters. Carried that for a few years, then changed to a Glock 23 which I've carried on and off ever since. Occasionally I'll switch up and carry something different, but always seem to come back to the Glock. For me, the combination of size, weight, reliability, affordability, accuracy and simple manual of arms makes it tough to beat.
 
I also became aware of how oblivious people are. I also came to understand NC's open carry situation more clearly. Now I'm not so worried about printing. In certain places I like to keep it very discreet. If I'm out shopping I don't mind showing a little bit of clip or holster when reaching for something.

I also came to the conclusion, having a small pocket 9 would be nice. I love my P-07 and carry it as much as is legal. However, I would like something smaller for when I'm taking my kid to day care or going out in layers of clothes. I don't want to try grabbing my gun while moving a shirt, over shirt, and coat. It seems like there is less chance of bumbling from the pocket.
 
After 36 years of carrying, I carry the smallest gun I'm comfortable with.
I've figured out the boogie man isn't out to get me. I always have a gun.
 
flightline wrote:
The truth that no one likes to admit is that handguns aren't very effective weapons

I completely disagree with your premise. You are surmising that a handgun's ability to kill is the single measure of it's effectiveness.

I believe that the true measure of of a handgun's effectiveness as a self-defense tool is the ability to stop an attack. I believe that when a criminal is suddenly facing an armed civilian, 99.99% of the time the criminal is dissuaded from continuing their attack. I would say that in this sense, ANY handgun is extremely effective in accomplishing this goal.
 
Don't Shoot Me

I think it would be really inconvenient to be shot with even a 22 or 25 so the sight of one would discourage me unless maybe I was in an altered state of mind and feeling really macho in which case I might do something really stupid like continue an attack. It would depend on the scenario, but I don't really think I want to depend on a 22 or 25 to stop an attack. I too am looking for that right cc gun, and weight and size matters to me. I don't want to lug around a 2 lb brick in my pocket. I am thinking S&W Airweight.
 
For as far as the handgun not being very effective; I agree and that's why troops on the battlefield carry long guns. However, civilian carry of long guns on America's streets is far from the societal norm, and wouldn't be realistic.

I started my LE career believing the .45 ACP was the way to go; esp in the 1911 platform. Nowadays, I'm very comfortable with a 9mm XD subcompact on my hip (as a detective it's permitted). Otherwise I'd carry my XDm40 3.8 compact. I can get three 9mm holes accurately into a target in the same space of time I can get two .40 or 45 holes placed.

Use the largest caliber pistol you are competant with and trust.
 
I too disagree that a hand gun is not an effective weapon. Just the sight of one in many cases will stop a person. How much more effective to you won't. That and any stopping power it might have make it a very effective weapon.
 
You are surmising that a handgun's ability to kill is the single measure of it's effectiveness.

Not at all. If there were some type of round that would immediately knock someone out with no lasting effects, I wouldn't bother to carry anything else. Like you, I think the measure of a round's effectiveness is it's ability to stop a fight immediately. Whether or not a round is lethal is beside the point, and in fact I would say a negative. But there are plenty of cases where even what are considered large and powerful calibres have failed to put people out of a fight, both in the case of criminals and police:
http://www.lawofficer.com/article/training/officer-down-peter-soulis-inci
This may be a fringe case, but when 22 rounds of .40 SXT, 17 of which were center mass, fail to take someone down, don't think that a few rounds of .380 are any kind of guarantee. Any gun is good, more is better.

I agree that any gun is a huge advantage and will very likely dissuade an attacker immediately. But if, as Skadoosh says, one will only be called upon to fire in 1 out of every 10000 times one is forced to draw, I think I would just carry a theatrical fake. After all, if that's the criterion of an effective weapon, than anything that looks like a gun is an "effective weapon."
 
You keep confusing the two. Caliber effectiveness and handgun used in self-defense are two very different subjects. Your next notion, based on something I never stated or implied -that "one will only be called upon to fire in 1 out of every 10000 times one is forced to draw", and thus a theatrical fake would fit the criterion of an effective weapon, is non sequitur. Stop moving the goal posts and, instead, provide factual data regarding the effectiveness of handgun use to prevent injury during the commission of actual reported and documented crimes (the real measure of a handgun's effectiveness in this forum)...and pay less attention to whether a particular caliber is an effective one-shot stopper.
 
^ 1 & 2 are opinions formed as a result of carrying for a time.

#3 is his opinion period, but I happen to agree with it. I personally wouldn't carry a caliber less than 380 Auto. I don't think i'd carry 380 given the small size of some of the micro-matics available now.
 
Back
Top