"Only the police and the military should have weapons."

PEA SHOOTER

New member
This statement implies that police officers and soldiers are a privileged class; they can be issued, and trusted with, weapons while ordinary citizens cannot. If you're a police officer or a member of the Armed Forces, think again. Throughout history, governments have issued weapons to slaves so they can serve the government. The right to own weapons is the mark of citizenship. If, for example, you're an 18 year-old American, you can enlist in the Armed Forces, and you might be issued an M-16 assault rifle. When you go home on leave, though, the likes of Senator Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) and Senator Charles Schumer (D-NY) don't think you should be able to buy or even possess a handgun for personal use- whether for self-protection or for making holes in targets. The Feinsteins and Schumers are willing to issue sidearms to police officers, but they don't want police who retire or change to civilian careers to own weapons.

Police and Military Slaves
Egypt's Mamelukes were slaves; they were owned by the government. Their skill at arms and their role in society, however, gave them status. Few if any thought of rebelling or escaping because they were not only content, but proud, to be Mamelukes. Ancient Athens' police force consisted of state-owned Scythian archers. Greeks were indifferent archers at best, and the use of slaves as police made it unnecessary for any Athenian citizen to arrest another. The Scythians' duties included rounding up negligent citizens for jury duty; not much has changed in 2500-odd years!
Athens' army, like those of other Greek city-states, consisted entirely of citizens who supplied their own armor and weapons. Service in a Greek army was as much a right and privilege as it was a duty; citizens who could not afford costly bronze armor could not be hoplites, or heavy-armed infantry. The "equestrian" social class consisted of citizens who could afford horses and who could thus serve as cavalry. Roman citizens also had the right to own arms, and the Roman Army consisted originally of citizen-soldiers who campaigned at their own expense. (See John Keegan, A History of Warfare, for more about the Mamelukes and the citizen armies of Greece and Rome.)
Ancient Greece and Republican Rome did begin to issue weapons to soldiers, and to pay them. By 440 BCE, Athens was paying its galley crews (Greek rowers were citizens, not slaves) and overseas garrisons. Rome began paying its legions in the 4th century BCE. Obviously, issuing weapons and equipment allowed the creation of bigger armies, since service was no longer limited to the middle and upper classes. State-issued equipment also resulted in standardization, which was probably necessary to the well-drilled formations that the Romans and Macedonians favored. (It was probably a good idea to have everyone's shield be the same size, for example.) Nonetheless, citizens could still own arms and, in Rome, service in the legions was a right and privilege of citizens. Noncitizens could earn pay (and possibly citizenship) as auxiliaries, but no auxiliary unit had the prestige of a legion.
Today, of course, military equipment is so expensive and complicated that the idea of citizen-soldiers who supply their own weapons is impractical. Armed citizens, however, still play an important role in defending their country. A foreign terrorist who would think nothing of gunning down unarmed Europeans like sheep, for example, is likely to think twice about trying this in the United States- at least in places where the Schumers and Feinsteins haven't left their mark- where any self-owning American man or woman could conceivably draw a weapon and shoot him. One thing hasn't changed in 2500 or more years:

Slaves are issued weapons. Citizens can own them
 
I believe we can inquire of Mr. Volk regarding his firsthand experiences of the end result of a State deciding that only its' official representatives may bear (State-issued) arms. You'll note his somewhat, er, rigid stance on RKBA issues. I'm inclined to accept his judgements in that arena, as I have no desire to acquire the experiences necessary to form my own opinion on life in a totalitarian state.
I had a hard enough time with teachers writing "Tamara seems to have problems with authority figures" in the 'conduct' area of every report card of my educational career...

------------------
"..but never ever Fear. Fear is for the enemy. Fear and Bullets."
10mm: It's not the size of the Dawg in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog!
 
Note that fascist Italy issued submachine guns and carbines to high schoolers. The idea was to have competent young adults available as volunteers or draftees. The overall view was that the indoctrination made these people "safe" to the regime. USSR/Russia included basic military training (AKM maintenance, for example) into high school cirriculum but, again, did not permit arms except for very tightly controlled hunting shoulder arms in weak calibers.

------------------
Oleg "peacemonger" Volk


[This message has been edited by Oleg Volk (edited May 16, 2000).]
 
Actually, Russia's gun laws are a lot less strict than Australia's, perhaps you should ask HS :)

Seriously, though, don't think the US is THAT much better - most good stuff has been banned (discount grandfathered hardware and there isn't much left - especially for NJersey/Maryland/New Yorkers.

And yer teetering on the brink on losing what little there is left.

Battler.
 
Peashooter: most cops I know believe in the RKBA. It's mostly political administrators (chiefs) who are appointed or politically movitated sheriffs who are anti-guns. The vast majority of rank and file police and military believe as we do and are equally frustrated with Feinstein, Schumer, et al.
 
Gary
I as well agree to "some" of the LEO's
beleive in RKBA, "Except the Lt!!Lol! "Friend o'mine!"
It was just submitted for your edification.
PS
 
Slaves are issued weapons, and then again, while i was in kuwait last year we ddin't even have enough ar's to give to ever one, so all the E-4's and below had to go to security to receive training in case of a attack, I though to myself, if we were attacked there would be more friendly fire deaths do to that fact, cause I know if I were ordered to hand over my weapon during a attack one of 3 things would happen, high ranking would be

1: ignored
2: saluted (due to the fact that the enemy loves officers)
3: shot

I know this isnt the greatest additude to have but when you put people in a situation like that, that is what is going to happen...
 
Back
Top