Old Calibers for new men

H

Harry Bonar

New member
Shooters:
As you all know I've been building some German and other large calibers.
I'm restricted by cash to use the Mauser action - VZ24s. and Turkish 38s.
I've found these actions suitable for some good large calibers like the 9.3X62, 9.3X64 and 416 Taylor (458 necked to 416!) I can't understand why U.S. shooters don't take advantage of these calibers. Granted, the 9.3X64 brass is hard to get but if you handload it's no problem.
These calibers are easy on your shoulder, accurate, load with canister powders and, boy, can they shoot!
On deer and such game they open up so little that there is little meat loss and if you ever hunt brown bear and such they've got the moxie to really get the job done!
In Africa, they're all legal in some provinces for the "big-five."
The 9.3X64 is the equal of the 375 H&H and the 9.3X62 not far behind.
The 416 Taylor, (John Pondoro Taylor - late african hunter) is another story , easy loading to 416 Rigby velocity, easy of the shoulder it is a great gun on the Mauser action.
Why not try one, guys?
Harry B.
 
Heh heh! Think I'll stick with the little ol' 375 for now...once I've become comfortable with that, maybe a step up will be in order. :D Would love to have a true big bore one day.
 
"...brass is hard to get but if you handload it's no problem..." How's that? It's hard to load ammo if you have trouble getting the brass.
9.3 x 62 brass is expensive too. Midway wants a minimum of $78.99 per 100 for brass. The least expensive bullet is a Speer 270 grain SP at $14.99 per 50.
 
old calibers

Dear Sirs:
Yes, brass is expensive - we paid $100.00 for 40 A-Square cases!
Yet we could get RWS cases for about $1.75 per case. The 9.3X62 is slightly less than this. 416 Taylor is cheap by forming 458 Win Mag. cases in your 416 die!
Since I'm a handloader it's no problem because I'll get 20 reloads by properly caring for my brass.
As you all know, these are DGR rifles and you won't benchrest these guns much, except to sight them in.
The A-Square Shooters Manual - Any Shot You Want, inspired me to build these rifles. These guys are the A-Team of heavy African guns and hunting.
I guess I've progressed (?) towards the larger calibers from some sort of an African "complex." Doc, may call someday and say, "Harry, let's go to Africa"! In which case we'll go.
I love these calibers. They're really easy on your shoulder due to the fine German case design. Maybe someday you fellas might want to try one.
The 9.3X62 is really the easiest to put in a standard 98 - no feeding alteration, just slick as snot!
Harry B.
 
Harry,

I'm still scouring the gun shows and local dealers for one good VZ or Turk. So far just finding junk, mostly shot out or really badly pitted barrels. Is it a forgone conclusion that a replacement barrel is normally required, even to stay with the original 8mm which ain't no slouch? Maybe I'm being too finicky. A gun show is coming up at the O.C. Fairgrounds in Feb. so maybe I'll get lucky. I just don't want to pay Mitchell's Mausers what they ask.
 
turks

Sir:
You can get Mausers for $69.00 from Southern Ohio Guns - others are slightly more. Yea, barrels are very bad and I just jerk them out and re-barrel. And, yes the 8X57JS is a great round when loaded to European pressures.
Harry B.
 
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I think you hit the mark when you said that the 9.3x62 and 9.3x64 are close to the .375. They're too similar, and the .375 is much more readily available and a lot more familiar to people.

.416 Taylor is a neat cartridge, but it's really needlessly overpowered for anything in the lower 48 with the exception of grizzly.

Were I to build up a rifle for myself from one of these actions, I'd probably get off the Continent and pick one of three cartridges...

.425 Westley Richards (If I thought I needed something that powerful), .333 Nitro, or .256 Gibbs.

Bullets and brass are a freak show, though.

And why those three?

Why not? :)
 
7x64 is also a great old cartridge,slightly more powerful than 270. There are also Euro magnums worth considering that fit 98action- "German powerhouse" 8x68, and 6.5x68-for those extra long shots;) .

Just my 0,02$

Cheers
 
Big 5 guns:

Hey Guys!
Yes, I'm kind of "fixated" on these guns, and, the others mentioned.
The Germans did a great job in their calibers - most of them were far ahead of their time. The 22 calibers were far ahead of their time - the seven milimeters - the 6.5 X 68 was a doozy.
I know some of these calibers are expensive to deal with - that's why I use the actions I do - the VZ24s. the Turkish 38s'.
You know, I've found EVERY Turkish 38 I've used to be hard right where hardness is needed!
Some Turkish 38s. have a bbl. thread of .980X12 and some have the narmal thread of 1.100X12! I can give no reason other than these Turks. were made for them by different makers!
i would have loved to been a little mouse in their factories! Amen!
I just got my Boyds JRS. stock and the fit is very good - I'll get it inletted fully and the BBl. inletted this week.
Have fun - I will.
Harry B.
 
Harry,
You've got my interest piqued again on a Mauser conversion. I had a beautiful K98 that my uncle somehow brought back from Germany. Then when he died, his wife and kids made an 800 mile drive to retrieve it believing it was worth thousands of dollars. Interesting, I chatted for about a half hour with a gun mag editor from Huntington Beach at their police/club/private range. The users are being forced to pay to clean it up and are having interminable meetings. I asked him what he thought of converting Mausers, or '03's. With all the commercial guns available, that will shoot as well or better, he saw no reason to spend time and money on a MILSURP. The Mauser and 03's that I have handled have bolts that slide as slick as glass. I've not owned a model 70 or 700 that was a slick as those. If I find some decent K-98's or Yugo's, I'm goling to buy six and sort out later what I want to do with 'em. Who do you prefer for barrels if they all need to be replaced?
 
98s.

MISSFIRE:
I like Douglas - they're the oldest barrel maker in the U. S.
As to 98s. I've had excellent use with the Turkish 38 Mauser and, of course, the VZ24s. I'm retired now but I still hobby around for myself.
Some Turk 38s. have a bbl. thread of 980X12 and some 1.100 X12!
The VZ24s are always 1.100 X12 and are most all good actions.
Southern Ohio Guns has Mausers out their kazoo! Good prices but I don't put much stock in their condition statements.
You can barrel to any cartridge that is current and fits the magazine - except the Weatherby and such. Pressure should be kept in the 50,000 cup range to 53,000 range and fit up CORRECTLY!
The Mauser action is the best in the world, in my humble opinion.
Give Fred Depoy a call at Douglas in Charlestown WVa - tell him you know me. Fred will help you - he's older and very knowledgeable.
Have fun with your Mausers - don't believe the "so-called" Mauser Experts!
Harry B.
 
Mr. Bonar,

Another kindred spirit. Just found this thread and loved reading every word of it. I love those Euro-metrics. I'm giving some serious thought to building a rifle chambered in 8x68S on a Mauser-style action (not a true Mauser - Montana 99 :rolleyes: ) this fall for my final project at Colorado School of Trades. (I'm going with a Pac-Nor barrel.) This has to be the greatest 8mm rifle cartridge ever developed and it's unfortunate that it did not garner more of a following here in the U.S.

You know, another interesting German metric is the 7x66 Vom Hofe (Super Express). It outperforms most of the other 7mm cartridges but without the needless belt.
 
metrics

PINTOGUYL
You're right on! I think the Germans developed the "high-rollers" long before we did.
All the calibers mentioned are great and I'm of the opinion now that all anyone needs is a metric - such as the 9.3X62 0r 9.3X64 - they will take care of anything from Impala to elephant and deer in between and not ruion tons of meat doing it.
The ranges of proper hunting, note I said PROPER hunting is (should'nt be) more than 300 yards and better 200! I have guys tell me they made a shot at 700 yards - it was probably 150!
Harry B.
 
9.3

Wildalaska:
I am glad to hear that. You know, I really think the 9.3X62 just may be all we need!
From your point of view, do you think it would be adequate for Brown bear?
I don't mean to stop up close charges from 20 feet (would anything be enough?) but at the 100 yard range - would it take the bear?
It's used in Africa on the "big five" - I can't see, other than on close charges on a hunter who is suprised by it why it wouldn't be adequate on Brown Bear - what is your personal opinion?
I've also built three 416 Taylors that I think I'd use personally knowing the tremendous tenacity these animals have! I know, accuracy and knowledge of anatomy are necessary but a charging brown needs to be hit with the biggest gun you can shoot well?
I think the 9.3X62 would do but personally I'd feel better with the 416.
Thanks Harry B.
 
I think 9.3x62 is enough for anyhting, shot placement etc being equal...

I know guys who have put 5 well placed rounds from a 375 into a bear and it didnt die right away. I know guys who have one shot kills on bears with 223.

WildheycaliberwarsAlaska
 
9,3 is certainly enough for brown bear. Wild boar,or red deer are much tougher than bear,and they tend to carry shots longer than bear. Up to 150 yards good old .30-06 with good bullet works just fine.



PS this may seem strange,but I've shot some big boars with 9,3x62(15g Norma Vulkan ammo),and they tend to go 10-30 yards-the blood trail is enormous though. My 06 with High energy Trophy bonded bear claw ammo seems to stop them better.

Just my 0,02$

Cheers
 
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30-06

Dear Sir:
There's nothing better than the old 06!
I'm not suprised at quick stops with the 06, the 9.3 bullets are made just that way - heavy jacket - like Col. Jeff saya: "lets alot of blood out and air in."
Glad you got him!
Harry B.
 
9.3x64 / 7x66 Combo

I have a Mauser 9.3x64 Obendorf rifle with an interchangeable barrel in 7x66. I bought the rifle off a hunting buddy without a whole lot of thought and now have the problem that most of this calibre owners have, where to get ammo/brass ???
Can anyone on the forum help !! Alternately, is there anyone out there who would be interested in buying the set and probably appreciate it more than I.
I have hunted, with great success, big plains game (Eland, Kudu, Gemsbok) as well as smaller game (Bushbuck, Springbok), well placed shots haven't required any follow up shots on all game. Gemsbok and Springbok are usually found in open plains, so shooting distances are vast 250 - 350 metres, this calibre is perfect for this. Meat damage is minimal.
 
9.3x64 / 7x66 Combo
I have a Mauser 9.3x64 Obendorf rifle with an interchangeable barrel in 7x66. I bought the rifle off a hunting buddy without a whole lot of thought and now have the problem that most of this calibre owners have, where to get ammo/brass ???
Can anyone on the forum help !! Alternately, is there anyone out there who would be interested in buying the set and probably appreciate it more than I.
I have hunted, with great success, big plains game (Eland, Kudu, Gemsbok) as well as smaller game (Bushbuck, Springbok), well placed shots haven't required any follow up shots on all game. Gemsbok and Springbok are usually found in open plains, so shooting distances are vast 250 - 350 metres, this calibre is perfect for this. Meat damage is minimal.
Click to expand...

Could you post some pics please? That 7x66 von Hofe is realy expensive! 9,3x64 is much more common but expensive
 
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