http://enquirer.com/editions/2000/07/18/loc_ohios_gun_laws_being.html
Ohio's gun laws being challenged by four workers
Goal: OK to carry concealed weapon
By Dan Horn
The Cincinnati Enquirer
A hairdresser, a personal trainer, a deliveryman and a private investigator will ask a judge today to let them carry guns on the job.
All four are part of a Hamilton County lawsuit that was filed Monday in hopes of overturning Ohio's concealed weapons law.
The lawsuit argues that the law is unconstitutional because it does not distinguish between criminals and people who carry guns for their own protection.
“We're trying to get the attention of the state legislature,” said Chuck Klein, a Cincinnati private investigator who is part of the lawsuit.
“If they don't want us to carry guns, they've got to change the Constitution to stop us.”
His attorneys, Tim Smith and William Gustavson, will ask Judge Robert Ruehlman to issue an order today allowing Mr. Klein and the others to carry guns on the job. They say their clients need the guns because they are physically unable to defend themselves or because they keep large amounts of cash with them.
The lawyers also have asked for a trial date so they can argue for throwing out the concealed weapons law altogether. They argue that the law is unfair because it conflicts with the Ohio and U.S. constitutions.
On one hand, they say, Ohio's Constitution allows carrying a gun to protect life and property. On the other, state law bars people from carrying a concealed weapon under any circumstances.
Mr. Klein said the only way a person can find out if he is breaking the law is to get arrested, go to court and hope a judge finds in his favor. “That's totally unfair,” Mr. Klein said.
The same argument came up in May when a pizza deliveryman, Patrick Feely, won the right to carry a gun for protection.
The lawsuit names Hamilton County Sheriff Simon L. Leis and Cincinnati Police Chief Thomas Streicher as defendants because they are responsible for enforcing the law.
City attorneys say they will argue that the state law is a proper way to protect police and citizens. “There is no fundamental constitutional right to carry a concealed weapon,” said Richard Ganulin, an assistant city solicitor.
Judge Ruehlman will decide today whether the four people who filed the lawsuit should be allowed to carry guns pending a trial.
Judge Ruehlman already has ruled on one major case involving gun control. Last year, he threw out the city of Cincinnati's lawsuit against gun manufacturers. The judge said the misuse of firearms is beyond the control of gun makers.
Copyright 1995-2000.
Ohio judge says it is OK to carry concealed weapons
The Associated Press
7/18/00 2:51 PM
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Four citizens who sued to challenge Ohio's ban on carrying concealed weapons won a judge's temporary order Tuesday to carry hidden guns in the Cincinnati area.
Hamilton County Common Pleas Judge Robert P. Ruehlman's order forbids city police and county sheriff's officers to cite people for carrying concealed weapons. The order is in effect within the county, which includes Cincinnati, until Ruehlman conducts an Aug. 11 hearing on the lawsuit.
At least 41 states have a permit process that allows people to carry concealed weapons. A bill to allow Ohioans to carry concealed weapons has stalled before the General Assembly.
Ruehlman is the same judge who in October threw out Cincinnati's lawsuit that demanded damages from gun manufacturers to recover the costs of crime violence.
The citizens sued the two police agencies Monday to question the constitutionality of Ohio's concealed weapon statute.
The plaintiffs said Ohio's law is unconstitutional because it does not establish a process for permits to carry a concealed weapon, and the person arrested has to prove his innocence -- instead of the state having to prove guilt.
Ohio's law doesn't allow citizens to carry a concealed weapon in a car or on their person. If arrested, a person has to prove in court that the gun was needed for protection or as part of a job.
Those who sued say they have jobs that require them to carry large sums of money or expose themselves to danger.
"No matter what you do, you will be arrested for a crime and charged with a crime," said Timothy Smith, lawyer for the citizens who sued. "There's no way to find out in advance if you fit into one of those categories. You have to be arrested first."
Lawyers for Cincinnati, Hamilton County and the Ohio attorney general argued that the law doesn't deal with the right to bear arms. They argued that it deals only with the concealing of those weapons.
In May, another Hamilton County judge concluded that Ohio's law is unfair. Common Pleas Judge Thomas Crush said it treats law-abiding citizens like criminals, in that they must be arrested first before getting a chance to prove they should be allowed to carry a concealed weapon. In that case, Crush threw out a charge against a pizza deliveryman who was cited for carrying a handgun.
Copyright 2000 Associated Press. All rights reserved.
Ohio's gun laws being challenged by four workers
Goal: OK to carry concealed weapon
By Dan Horn
The Cincinnati Enquirer
A hairdresser, a personal trainer, a deliveryman and a private investigator will ask a judge today to let them carry guns on the job.
All four are part of a Hamilton County lawsuit that was filed Monday in hopes of overturning Ohio's concealed weapons law.
The lawsuit argues that the law is unconstitutional because it does not distinguish between criminals and people who carry guns for their own protection.
“We're trying to get the attention of the state legislature,” said Chuck Klein, a Cincinnati private investigator who is part of the lawsuit.
“If they don't want us to carry guns, they've got to change the Constitution to stop us.”
His attorneys, Tim Smith and William Gustavson, will ask Judge Robert Ruehlman to issue an order today allowing Mr. Klein and the others to carry guns on the job. They say their clients need the guns because they are physically unable to defend themselves or because they keep large amounts of cash with them.
The lawyers also have asked for a trial date so they can argue for throwing out the concealed weapons law altogether. They argue that the law is unfair because it conflicts with the Ohio and U.S. constitutions.
On one hand, they say, Ohio's Constitution allows carrying a gun to protect life and property. On the other, state law bars people from carrying a concealed weapon under any circumstances.
Mr. Klein said the only way a person can find out if he is breaking the law is to get arrested, go to court and hope a judge finds in his favor. “That's totally unfair,” Mr. Klein said.
The same argument came up in May when a pizza deliveryman, Patrick Feely, won the right to carry a gun for protection.
The lawsuit names Hamilton County Sheriff Simon L. Leis and Cincinnati Police Chief Thomas Streicher as defendants because they are responsible for enforcing the law.
City attorneys say they will argue that the state law is a proper way to protect police and citizens. “There is no fundamental constitutional right to carry a concealed weapon,” said Richard Ganulin, an assistant city solicitor.
Judge Ruehlman will decide today whether the four people who filed the lawsuit should be allowed to carry guns pending a trial.
Judge Ruehlman already has ruled on one major case involving gun control. Last year, he threw out the city of Cincinnati's lawsuit against gun manufacturers. The judge said the misuse of firearms is beyond the control of gun makers.
Copyright 1995-2000.
Ohio judge says it is OK to carry concealed weapons
The Associated Press
7/18/00 2:51 PM
CINCINNATI (AP) -- Four citizens who sued to challenge Ohio's ban on carrying concealed weapons won a judge's temporary order Tuesday to carry hidden guns in the Cincinnati area.
Hamilton County Common Pleas Judge Robert P. Ruehlman's order forbids city police and county sheriff's officers to cite people for carrying concealed weapons. The order is in effect within the county, which includes Cincinnati, until Ruehlman conducts an Aug. 11 hearing on the lawsuit.
At least 41 states have a permit process that allows people to carry concealed weapons. A bill to allow Ohioans to carry concealed weapons has stalled before the General Assembly.
Ruehlman is the same judge who in October threw out Cincinnati's lawsuit that demanded damages from gun manufacturers to recover the costs of crime violence.
The citizens sued the two police agencies Monday to question the constitutionality of Ohio's concealed weapon statute.
The plaintiffs said Ohio's law is unconstitutional because it does not establish a process for permits to carry a concealed weapon, and the person arrested has to prove his innocence -- instead of the state having to prove guilt.
Ohio's law doesn't allow citizens to carry a concealed weapon in a car or on their person. If arrested, a person has to prove in court that the gun was needed for protection or as part of a job.
Those who sued say they have jobs that require them to carry large sums of money or expose themselves to danger.
"No matter what you do, you will be arrested for a crime and charged with a crime," said Timothy Smith, lawyer for the citizens who sued. "There's no way to find out in advance if you fit into one of those categories. You have to be arrested first."
Lawyers for Cincinnati, Hamilton County and the Ohio attorney general argued that the law doesn't deal with the right to bear arms. They argued that it deals only with the concealing of those weapons.
In May, another Hamilton County judge concluded that Ohio's law is unfair. Common Pleas Judge Thomas Crush said it treats law-abiding citizens like criminals, in that they must be arrested first before getting a chance to prove they should be allowed to carry a concealed weapon. In that case, Crush threw out a charge against a pizza deliveryman who was cited for carrying a handgun.
Copyright 2000 Associated Press. All rights reserved.
). I live south of Cincinnati (down in KY where they trust us to walk around in public armed without shooting ourselves in the ass every time wwe holster our gun) and have heard him on the radio a few times. Generally a good guy who does support CCW. His slant was that they couldn't arrest anyone for just having a gun with them (like they do now). Now they will actually have to take the time to figure out if it is a good guy or not (