Officer Livewell shot by partner (Philly)

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Gusgus

New member
A few weeks back, Philadelphia was in the national spotlight, over the arrest of Thomas, a car jacking suspect. It was reported that Thomas had shot Officer Livewell during the attempted arrest. Philadelphia LEOs responded with 46 shots, hitting Thomas 8 times as he fled in a police cruiser. After he was finally stopped, he was beaten by over a dozen officers, before being lead away in a chock hold (with 8 bullets in his body). Many TFLers defended the police, stating that Thomas "got what he deserved".

This morning, the Philadelphia Police released the findings of their investigation.

1) Thomas was UNARMED!
2) Officer Livewell was shot by an AD by his partner!

Because the police THOUGHT that Thomas had shot Livewell, they proceeded to shoot up a neighborhood full of children (46 shots), and then severely beat a critically wounded suspect. Yet many on these boards defended this "revenge" driven action.

It is also now being reported by experts reviewing the video tape, that Thomas was in a "fetal position" during the beating, and not offering any resistance.

Don't get me wrong - Thomas is career "scum", that should spend the rest of his life in prison, but no US Citizen is deserving of police administered "street justice".

When we condone this type of action, we are putting our own lives and freedom in jeopardy. Maybe someday, one of us that carries in a state that does not permit CCW, will have an officer's Glock emptied into us, because he saw our concealed gun, and FELT threatened. I'm sure the Sheeple would find the officer's actions "justified".
 
Gusgus, interesting post. I would be interested in knowing where you got your information. I haven't seen anything about this in the news.

Something specific that I see in your post is akin to the types of logic the antis use in order to support their claims of guns being bad. It is called an appeal to pity. Specifically, you noted that the officers proceeded to shoot up a neighborhood full of children. Here you are playing on the sentiments of your readers that by implying that a horrible thing was done to children who were undeserving of being exposed to such an atrocity. Think of the poor, innocent children! By bringing up children, you introduce a "what if" worst case scenario that was completely hypothetical because not of the children were shot.

Whether or not there were children in the neighborhood is not really relevant to whether or not the officers wrongly treated Thomas. What is relevant was that there were other "people" in the neighborhood, old and young and that any of them could have been hurt since apparently at least 38 of the 46 shots did not hit Thomas.

Just a side note, when the story broke originally, but no footage made it to TV, I was amazed at how fast two minority civil rights groups were to comment on the fact that Thomas was not a white person and how the Philadelphia PD that is mostly white tended to brutalize African Americans and other people of color. It was amazing how quickly these people shut up once the footage revealed that at least one black officer directly engaged in beating Thomas and at least two others were there who did not try to intervene. It was nothing but an appeal to pity that turned out to be based on ignorance.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gopher .45:
Gusgus, interesting post. I would be interested in knowing where you got your information. I haven't seen anything about this in the news.[/quote]

Gopher,
I got the info from a televised press conference, held by Lynn Abraham, the Philadelphia DA. What I reported was the results of her investigation.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Something specific that I see in your post is akin to the types of logic the antis use in order to support their claims of guns being bad. It is called an appeal to pity. Specifically, you noted that the officers proceeded to shoot up a neighborhood full of children. Here you are playing on the sentiments of your readers that by implying that a horrible thing was done to children who were undeserving of being exposed to such an atrocity. Think of the poor, innocent children! By bringing up children, you introduce a "what if" worst case scenario that was completely hypothetical because not of the children were shot.[/quote]

You are absolutely correct, and for this I apologize. Maybe the Antis are effecting us in more ways than we realize. I just annoys me, that all an LEO had to do is yell "I've been shot", and all hell breaks loose.

What if you or I where walking down the street with a loved one, and during an altercation with a criminal, our loved yells that they "have been shot". Would we be justified in firing 46 shots, on a crowded street, at the fleeing BG? Of course not, that would be just plain reckless. But I'm sure the officers that fired those shots felt justified in doing so, and I'm sure the officers that beat Thomas felt justified in their revenge. Would they have reacted this way if a Citizen had been shot? I highly doubt it. But since it was an LEO, all sanity goes out the window.

Just another example of the growing mentality that LEOs are somehow, much more important and valuable, than the Citizens they are paid to "Protect and Serve".

Of course I have to place a disclaimer that I'm not referring to the LEOs on this board. Come on guys (and gals), you should know by not that I'm not talking about you. ;)
 
maybe livewell needs to be arrested, brought under control, and then stomped on out of revenge. seemed like a lot of folks were hunk dory with it the first time around anyway.

it actually happened in philly once with a mistaken identity of a black undercover cop. a white cop and two black cops beat him so bad that he couldn't return to work. the white cop was fired. the black ones reassigned.

[This message has been edited by cuerno de chivo (edited August 08, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>the white cop was fired. the black ones reassigned.[/quote]

They were probably too afraid that Jesse Jackson(Rev. Racist) would come harass them about the firing. So those too a-holes get to be cops still and the other a-hole gets fired. That's just crap, but what do you expect from a society that will go so far in the fight against racism as to start hating white people for the color of their skin. I know he got a lot of crap for it, but Rodney King really did have a point with the whole "can't we just all get along?" statement. Funny that a junkie and repeat offender can recognize simple facts like how stupid all the bickering is.

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I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist

The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me
 
I hope the Philly police get taken for a bundle on this one!
 
It's a little known fact that LEOs are often in more danger from their cohorts than from the bad guys. I kept score on gunshot injuries to LEOs in my area for a while and over half were from 'mistakes' like this one. I was always very nervous about cluster**** drug raids with ad hoc 'teams', most of whose members had never seen one another before and were dressed differently. Some of these operations can really get FUBAR.

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