New shooter - how many and which guns?

J

Jeff Thomas

New member
OK ... I don't want to blow this. Tomorrow I'll take my former college professor out shooting. He has never before fired a gun, but nevertheless is a supporter of the RKBA.

Of course, I'm ready to take out as many guns as possible so he can shoot the gamut. My wife cautioned that that is probably not a good idea. As usual, she's right. ;)

So, between what I have and what I can borrow, here is my current list, in the order I will introduce them to him:

1. Ruger 10/22 with 4x scope - .22LR
2. AR-15 - .223
3. Ruger Security Six - .38 Special
4. Sig 228 - 9mm

Decided against the shotgun, though it is tempting to take it in case he wants to try it as well. I'd like to take a .22 revolver, and start him off even easier on handguns, but ...

I figured I'd try to keep it down to 1 to 1 1/2 hours so I don't wear out his trigger finger, etc. We'll start with about 15 minutes of safety info / discussion.

Your ideas and advice are greatly appreciated. I want to handle this as well as possible. Thanks.
 
I do this often. I would recommend this: .22 rifle and .22 handgun at first -- make sure the target is close and that all hits in the scoring area count the same (i.e. a sihouette or Barney target as opposed to 10-ring type). Put it close enough for him to hit well and to see bullet holes.

Then I'd recommend .38 or .357 with mildest wadcutter .38 ammo you can find (I handload just for that). I would leave AR15, P228 till the second range visit, unless he really wants to try them. I know that you'd rather give him variety, but you might also induce flinching and fear of the report+recoil.

I can shoot .357 mag now, but even 9x19 in a Glock was waaaaay too much at first. Ditto for AR15 and 20 gauge. Kept me away from centerfire arms for years afterwards.
 
Two suggestions:

1) Provide the best possible hearing protection. I've found that removing the "bark" of a gun makes its "bite" seem much milder.

2) Set up some sort of reactive targets. The instant feedback of seeing something fall/break/spin when shot makes shooting much more entertaining.
 
I don't know what kind of range situation you have. If it's possible to set up some kind of "reactive targets," it sure makes shooting more fun for beginners (after they've mastered the basics) and old fogeys like me too. A reactive target can be as simple as an orange hit at 15 yds with a high vel .22 hollowpoint from a rifle. Charcoal will work well too, I've heard.

Best wishes in your endeavor!
 
maybe a bolt action .22 rifle or "light" centerfire (.223, .222, .243, 6mmRem) would work well too.

I would suggest manually cocked guns rather than semi-autos at first for
1. SAFETY
2. To help prof. better understand how the firearm operates.
3. Also once he sees how a bolt gun works, it will help him understand that a semi-auto AR-15 is NOT an assault weapon. Merely a self loader. one pull of trigger, one round fired.


IT WOULD BE NICE FOR AN ACADEMIC TO ACTUALLY FIRE A WEAPON BEFORE TRYING TO BAN THEM.
I know you said your guy is an RKBA guy but 95% of the professors out there are ban em all people.

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK


my $.02
 
For reactive targets, balloons are great for first-timers. A forumite helped me get my fiancee into shooting just that way and she loves it (thanks Scott!) He also decided to go with your variety theory and I think (check that, now she's on the phone so I know) :) she really liked to be able to try something different. We shot a 10/22, a Browning Buckmark semi-auto, and a .44 special that night and she really liked being able to try the .44 even though she decided she liked the .22s better. Just my .02.
 
I think 10/22's are great, BUT every time I put a new shooter on one they can't figure out the little button thing to release the bolt. Also, for safety, I tell them to make sure the bolt is open when done firing, so again, the little button becomes an issue. I think a bolt action would be better to learn first, or an easier to use 22. my .02.

Oh, EVERYONE loves to shoot a shotgun. Just give 'em a light load, and watch the smiles.

Have fun!!!
 
Jeff, I've been thinking about this "strange isn't it" an would agree that a 22 bolt gun would be a better choice than the 10 22. Take as many guns as you want but let Doc proceed at his or her own pace.

Start with safety and stay with safety. Start with the least complicated firearm you have.
A break action single shot 12 Ga shotgun would be preferable to a 10 22 IMHO. Just a shot or two, you are right in not wearing your friend out. Then progress the more interesting stuff! Bolt action 22 loaded one roung at the time fills the bill for starters.

For pistols a good starting target is a paper grocery bag stapled up at 10 yds. A hit on the bag is a score! Play with this for a while before putting a target paster on the bag etc.

You never know until you try in these matters. I once saw what I thought was going to turn out terrible. One of the local TV stations had been going around to some private ranges because some neighbors had been making complaints. At one of these ranges the complaints were valid. The same reporter was making all of the news stories.
Our range was hosting a DCM shoot and, as we were expecting over 300 participants had done quite a bit of planning. The fact that this
reporter{ short, liberal, female, African American} would show up at the shoot was discussed and all agreed to try to be as nice to her as we possibly could. Sure enough she and her crew showed up early and started talking with folks and asking questions. A few of the crew figured out what a DCM match was all about and wanted to know when the next one was. We had 5 or six points on the range hot with officers in place to allow folks to sight in and to give training on the Garrand. My jaw dropped when I saw two of our members, both brothers, and the reporter at the line with an M16. Both of these guys are great shooters but shot matches with M1A's.
I knew that the only M16 between the brothers belonged to the older one and it was a class 3 M16. I was fixing to run down there when she put the rifle to work! She turned her head with the rifle pointing down range with the biggest smile I have ever seen! She was looking towards her camera man and in our general direction as we were talking to the rest of the crew. A short clip of her going rock and roll appeared on the evening news with a nice report about the large turn out we had for our match! I think that she and some of her crew and the producer of that evenings news probably had some flack from the general management over that one!

She is still with the station 15 or so years later and we still get some local news when the NRA National Police Shooting Competition is going on!

Jeff, you never know! You got a Ma Duce?

Have fun,
Hank
 
I'd recomend starting to shoot at the closest range possible. If you start out with the pistol 5-10 yards wouldn't be too close. Seeing the bullets hitting in the center of the bullseye inspires confidence.

When switching to a rifle start out shooting off a bench using a scope, again at close range. All to make sure that the bullseye/target get hit.

I have seen numerous people starting out shooting and missing the target(s), after a while they just get frustrated and give it up. By ensuring they hit the target with the first shot you are setting them up for success and they'll be much more receptive to shoot more.

Of course eventually they'll miss one or many, but so what. They now know that they can hit the target and and just need more practice.

The gun I always start new shooters out with is a Ruger MKII with a Tasco Red dot scope. Targets are set up at 15 feet or so. When questioned about the target being too close I tell 'em that this is just to initially become familiar with the shooting characteristics of the gun (Obviously you don't wanna imply that they couldn't hit the target farther out). Of course most hit the black at this range and I soon move the target out at about 5 foot intervals.

Rob


RKBA!

------------------
It's amazing what a large group of stupid people can accomplish.
-----------------
 
Listen, the only reason to keep the prof away from your AR is the noise. As long as you have good hearing protection, the gun is so surprisingly mild (deceptively?) that most people REALLY start wondering why it's so demonized.

I think your choices are perfect. I'd go with rifles first (easier to supervise) followed by pistolas once a modicum of safety awareness is apparent.
 
Jeff,- I also have to agree with those that said use a .22 in rifle and handgun. I also start those I've tought over the years close up shooting, and concentration on the sight picture. I usually get them on target with the handgun at 10 to 15 feet. I know what your going to say, It's too close. Thats what most of the people I've trained over the years also say, until they see that at any longer distance the groups get much larger, and causes them to get discouraged. I place a 1/2" red dot on the target so they have a point to aim at, instead of just a large black area. Also it's easier to concentrate on all aspects of sighting when set up like that.

With rifles I do the same except starting distance is 50 feet. I teach both with scope and iron sights. Although I teach iron first.

I hope you and your friend the best and a safe training session. Franz
 
Thanks for all the great ideas. I called a friend, and borrowed another firearm. Don't have time to get a bolt action, but we'll make do with the semi's, and just load one at a time at first. Will start with the .22 rifle, and then play it by ear. Unfortunately the range won't allow reactive targets. Next time we go out I'll make sure we go to an informal range for a change (watching security as well, I know), and use some reactive targets like balloons (great idea), fruit, plastic jugs and hopefully some actual steel targets.

We'll use the 10/22, AR, S&W .22 revolver and a Kahr K9.

With any luck, my friend will join us. He is an author (of a gun law book) and attorney, so he can assist me in helping the prof further see the logic of his gut feelings on this issue.

Up until now I have always tried to make sure any firearm acquisition was first suited to defense. This exercise will encourage me to broaden my 'safety equipment' selection a bit more.

Thank you for all of your kind assistance. Regards from AZ
 
I thought that starting people on the AR-15 wasn't a good idea until I didn't it.
I took 2 girls out and first thing they shot was teh AR-15. the each put about 150-200 rds through it. and one girl absolutely fell in love with the black rifle. the other one then went to shoot my 1911 clone, a ruger mark II and a S&W revovler in 357. and now wants a revolver. go figure. my point is that I don't think it matters what you start them on. if you allow them to shoot in a no pressure, fun atmosphere, they will comeback for more

------------------
It ain't mah fault. did I do dat?
 
Jeff,
In case you check in for a last thought. Make sure you allow time after shooting also. Your Prof friend is going to be on a "Smokeless High" and want to ask a lot of questions. Maybe a stop for lunch/dinner/whatever after the range. Like the starting out light idea of using a small caliber to begin with, try to keep the conversation recoil sensitive too. He's going to want to know what to buy, where to shoot, what he needs in the way of equipment. He may not care to debate 1911 vs DAO, light and fast vs Hal-like (slow and heavy)in detail.

------------------
CCW for Ohio action site.
http:/www.ofcc.net
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top