New Progressive Press and Questions

T

Tony C

New member
All,

I upgraded (is that the right word?) from the single stage Hornady press that I have been using for six years to the Hornady LNL AP and finally set it up today.

I ran my first 100 rounds of 9mm through it and have a few questions for those that use a progressive press.

1. With my single stage, I never had powder scattered across my bench when I was done, it was clean and simple. With this press, I had some powder spillage, not in great volume, but a few bits here and there, and it adds up over 100 rounds. It seems set up correctly, is this something that is expected with a progressive press?

2. How do you know that the primer tube is empty outside of having the powder fall through the case primer hole because no primer was seated in the previous stage? Loading 100 primers into the tube, do you count each round so you don't miss? What is the trick here? I ended up, after about 80, taking the brass out after each round to check and that really slows down the process.

3. I found that metering the powder to get to my 5.1 grains was a serious hassle. With the single stage process, I would activate the handle on the powder tube, release the powder into my measure cup, weigh it, and do it again. With the powder in one of the press stages, when I would try and drop the powder into the measuring cup it splashed/bounced out the sides (Hodgdon HS-6), and so I turned to using a primed case for this, but again it slowed the process down. Is there a better way?

Thanks for the help you can give. I found that I was as nervous with the progressive as when I was learning with my single stage LNL Classic. I suppose I will get used to it, but it was more stressful and messy today than I expected.

Thanks again,
Tony C.
Newberg, OR
 
I load on a 550 Dillon and not really up on the LNL press but, with the Dillon I have a low primer buzzer. A rod goes on the primers and when the tube get low on primers the knob on top of the rod set off a buzzer. As for the powder spillage, I would guess you are loading pretty full cases and indexing them to fast and jerking or shaking powder out of them. Hope this helps you figure it out. One other thing, stick with Ball powders, stick powders do not measure as well.
 
I have a RCBS progressive and indexing the shell plate to fast and not smoothly will spill powder out of the shells.

And ball powder is the way to go, 3N37, autocomp, and CFE pistol meter quite well.
 
Tony,

I am new to reloading but I do have the LNL.
You should have gotten a fiberglass rod to stick in the primer tube, I inserted it when it was empty and marked a line with a sharpie to show the out mark.

I do get a little powder if I go to fast I would imagine it is more so with a less dense powder.

On the metering after 300 rounds it is still within .01 grain using Titegroup. So I can't help much there. Make sure it is very clean.

Tony
 
Hornady LNL AP

There are many videos by Bill Morgan (76Highboy) on

http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/forums/the-ammo-reloading-forum.19/

I suggest watching these first. Many tweaks to improve press operations. As for the priming, use the white rod and place it into the top of the primer tube. When the primers are empty, the rod will plug the primer seating hole and stop the press rotation. You can put a flag (wrap tape around the rod) at the last primer height and watch the flag as it gets closer and closer to the top of the primer tube. Make sure you use a lock washer on your shell plate to keep it from loosening. That will cause powder to spill. Above all, be smooth in rotating the shell plate and ensure your prongs are not causing the shell plate to jump.

Watch the videos, each one in order.
 
powder splash ...as the press auto indexes ...is often a matter of how smoothly the press operates. One solution is to make sure you are using "case lube" ...even with carbide dies...it really smooths out the press operation. On smaller volume cases ...if you are using a relatively bulky powder ...you might get more powder bouncing around than others...but no, you shouldn't see hardly any powder laying on benchtop usually.

Dillon 650's ...have a rod that goes into primer feed system...and as the number of primers gets to zero, it beeps an alarm telling you to refill it. I don't remember what the LNL has to do that..but check the manual.

Most progressive presses ...have a powder measure that is part of the press operation / so there is no dumping into any cups...powder is dispensed directly into each case. Adjusting it should not be that big a deal...but again, refer to your manual. My Dillon 650 press....(once I have it dialed in for powder drop / its not an issue and it will hold 0.1gr accuracy on most powders). I've always thought the Hornaday LNL had a pretty good powder measure as well.../ back to the manual again....
 
Owned one for five years.
I have only used it for centerfire rifle calibers, and not pistol, though.

1) Powder spillage- I'm a bit confused about this because of what you said in #3, but I will often place my index finger over the top of a bottleneck case when advancing the case from the powder drop to bullet seating because vibration can "shake" a few grains out of the top of the case. I imagine this could be even worse with a straight wall case filled to near capacity.

It is critical to have the proper bushing in the powder drop so that the case mates up tightly and the powder drops cleanly into the case and none leaks out the sides.

2) Primer count- you should have gotten a skinny little fiberglass stick with the press, that drops in from the top after you've filled the primer tube. Drop the stick into the primer tube when it's empty, and take a Sharpie and mark a line on it even with the top of the primer tube. When you put the stick back in after filling the tube with primers, you'll have a visual indication for when the tube is about to go empty as it rests on top of the primer stack and drops with the level of the primers. If they don't provide them anymore, it would be simple to make/use one, even with any very thin diameter dowel.

3) Number 3 is where you lost me- are you not using the case-activated powder drop- with the pistol rotor installed- after the primer station?
 
1. With my single stage, I never had powder scattered across my bench when I was done, it was clean and simple. With this press, I had some powder spillage, not in great volume, but a few bits here and there, and it adds up over 100 rounds. It seems set up correctly, is this something that is expected with a progressive press?
Click to expand...

You shouldn't have much spillage. Slow is smooth, smooth is fast - there is no need to jerk the operating handle as fast as you can or anything of that nature. Make sure your timing is right also - if the shell plate does not advance to the detents on each pull, there is a little bit of a jerking action that will sometimes spill powder on short pistol cases or on rifle cases that have high fill volumes.

2. How do you know that the primer tube is empty outside of having the powder fall through the case primer hole because no primer was seated in the previous stage? Loading 100 primers into the tube, do you count each round so you don't miss? What is the trick here? I ended up, after about 80, taking the brass out after each round to check and that really slows down the process.
Click to expand...

The poor man's way is to use the fiberglass rod that came with your press - drop it in the priming tube when empty, then take a Sharpie and mark the rod. Put 10 primers in the tube, remark the rod so that you know you are down to 10 when that mark hits the top of the tube. Or you can get you a low primer alarm from Inline.

3. I found that metering the powder to get to my 5.1 grains was a serious hassle. With the single stage process, I would activate the handle on the powder tube, release the powder into my measure cup, weigh it, and do it again. With the powder in one of the press stages, when I would try and drop the powder into the measuring cup it splashed/bounced out the sides (Hodgdon HS-6), and so I turned to using a primed case for this, but again it slowed the process down. Is there a better way?
Click to expand...

If you want to verify that your throw is accurate, dump a thrown in a primed case, then just take the case out of the plate and dump the charge to verify weight. With the LNL, this is extremely easy to do.

Once you get your throw set right, you should not need to weight but every 100 rounds to so to verify you are still on your correct charge throw. Hand tighten the adjustment nut on the drum and you should find that, so long as you are using the same stroke and you have the powder drop set up correctly (including the correct bushing for your type of shell) that it is nearly flawless. I've had sessions of over 1000 rounds, checking every 50-100 rounds and have never seen more than a .1 grain variance. I like to check 3 consecutive rounds when I do check to make sure that I'm getting consistent and uniform throws.

A powder cop die and a visual inspection as I'm putting the projectile on are redundant safety backups. Get the LED strip kit from Inline - one of the single best things I've ever added to the LNL.
 
Thanks All...

Folks, thanks for all the input. My second use went much better. I was much less clumsy with the powder and much more confident In the entire process.
 
Yes, the little primer rod helps but only if you're looking at it before you run out. I usually have a goal in mind, such as filling an ammo box of 50 with a particular recipe, or sometimes half a box; i.e. 25 rounds. I normally count the number of cases I intend to use and then load the same number of primers so I don't have to empty the primer tube of excess primers when I'm finished. Or, if I'm doing two boxes, I load 100 primers.

When I get down to a few cases remaining, I check the primer rod and I usually check the last one to make sure it got primed before they get to the powder station. It's irritating to dump powder into a case with a missing primer, so (for me at least), it's worth it to count the cases ahead of time so that I have some indication that I'm about to run out of primers.

And speaking of primers, I hate chasing them around with the Hornady primer pick-up tube. I bought one of those vibrating primer tube loaders and every time I use it I congratulate myself on making such a great purchase. I don't mind most reloading procedures, even the tedious ones, but there was something about that primer pick up tube routine which drove me crazy.
 
1. With my single stage, I never had powder scattered across my bench when I was done, it was clean and simple. With this press, I had some powder spillage, not in great volume, but a few bits here and there, and it adds up over 100 rounds. It seems set up correctly, is this something that is expected with a progressive press?

I like to keep the shell plate relatively tight so it has a little resistance to movement. I also, after using a progressive for about 40 years, almost always simply place my left index finger over the charged case as it moves. I found that a thick marine "prop" grease would also slow down the shell plate.
If you cycle fast, you'll get powder thrown out.

2. How do you know that the primer tube is empty outside of having the powder fall through the case primer hole because no primer was seated in the previous stage? Loading 100 primers into the tube, do you count each round so you don't miss? What is the trick here? I ended up, after about 80, taking the brass out after each round to check and that really slows down the process.

There should be a plastic rod in the kit that goes in the primer tube and will be a visual indicator of how many primers are left. It is also very easy to FEEL the primer being seated in the L-N-L, so you should KNOW if there is no primer. Without a primer rod, my L-N-L let me know that I was down to the last primer by having the primer shuttle stick--when the primer shuttle did not come back to the shell plate, I knew that the last primer was hung up.

3. I found that metering the powder to get to my 5.1 grains was a serious hassle. With the single stage process, I would activate the handle on the powder tube, release the powder into my measure cup, weigh it, and do it again. With the powder in one of the press stages, when I would try and drop the powder into the measuring cup it splashed/bounced out the sides (Hodgdon HS-6), and so I turned to using a primed case for this, but again it slowed the process down. Is there a better way?

Are you weighing every charge? If so, you can't get any real benefit from the progressive if you stop every load cycle to weigh the charge. I use a primed case to take the powder charge and pour the powder from the case to the balance pan. I do this occasionally after I start loading. I inspect the charge and charge height of every case by eye and, usually, with an RCBS Lock-Out die.
If you feel you have to weigh each charge, get an RCBS ChargeMaster and use a Lee PTE die with a Lee powder funnel on top and have the CM dispense powder while you cycle the press down and up and, with the case in the PTE die, pour in the metered charge.
 
I owned a Hornady LNL press for six months and had nothing but problems. The spilled powder you mention is only one of the bad memories. The major issue that made me dump it was the issue of several indexing plugs that would jam and break periodically.

I called Hornady customer service many times and always received poor service and people with attitudes. Thanks but no thanks. In addition, the "free" Hornady bullets I received from purchasing the press contained several different weight projectiles that were in a sealed factory box. I've also had issues with new Hornady dies.

Form these experiences, I have concluded that the Hornady quality control is poor.

Anyway, I bought a Dillon 550b and never looked back. It is clearly a much better designed press.

Yeah, I drank both the red and blue Coolaid and the blue is more yummie.
 
If you are having timing issues follow this video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXms1-ZsPnU

Frankly speaking to operate any press you need some mechanical knowledge. Many criticize presses when its actually 99% operator error or cheap design. The Hornady LNL is neither. I stripped mine down and put it back together to understand how it works and made tuning adjustments easily and successfully.:)


My 02


thewelshm
 
How do you know that the primer tube is empty
Click to expand...

With the primer tube you got a fiberglass rod. I put a piece of tape at the empty level of that rod. Then I upgraded the press with the control panel.

I found that metering the powder to get to my 5.1 grains was a serious hassle.
Click to expand...

You have to do a GREAT job of cleaning the powder measure.

Are you weighing every charge? If so, you can't get any real benefit from the progressive if you stop every load cycle to weigh the charge.
Click to expand...

Once you have the powder measure clean and working properly. Then just check periodically.

you can't get any real benefit from the progressive
Click to expand...

To get the real benefit from any progressive you'll need to automate as much as possible. I have the the poor mans bullet feeder, that is to say I have the bullet feed die and a tube. Still looking for how to add the poor mans case feeder as well.

I will recommend the deluxe control panel. Its nothing more than another safety tool. but it watches for powder, primer, and case charge. Its not perfect but its another level of safety. I could care less about the case count and I believe Hornady could have done a better job with it, I have lots of little complaints.

With all of that it is a good press and does a fine job, but there is a steep learning curve. Comparing this press to a Dillon 550 is apples to oranges. For a better more apples to apples put the LNL AP to the Dillon 650. The LNL AP will most likely come in second, but if its a dollars and cents then the Dillon would most likely finish second. I know some will disagree but the cost of changeovers on the Dillon is where it gets hurt.
 
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