New marlin cowboy report

F

ffffg

New member
I Inquired from a retired gunsmith friend of mine who did work on my problems years ago, about the new marlins... He said they were fine so i bought a 45-70 cowboy remlin recently ...

Had a couple issues, sharp hammer corners, sharp trigger corners, loose magazine tube dovetail, groove in rear sight sliding insert off center, and little things like that...So I fixed them myself, and I shot about 30 rounds of the new ftx 325 .458 and was getting fouling on the lands.. I scrubbed, and shot and scrubbed and shot, and it just wouldnt come out or or stop fouling.. I changed from h4198 to h335, kept the barrel cooler and shot 6 rounds an outing and got it so it would not increase the fouling more than an hour of cleaning would get out the new fouling, that wanted to head for the muzzel.. The problem was I never got the initial fouling out clean..

I figured it was carbon so i got some carbout.. I had to order it so i waited a week for it and in in the meantime soaked the barrel with 7.62, wipout, soaked in kroil for days, jb patches with tight jag, hundreds of strokes, wore out 9 dewy brushes, hoppes etc... So i was elated when the carb-out came, , got home put it in, nothing. let it set for 4 hours, nothing..no color, not black no blue, green whatever nothing. Whatever is in that bore it is not budging. the only thing that kept it from growing down the tube was the dewey brushes and whatever id stick down for cleaner with it, but the base fouling wouldnt budge...
The gun guys generally say fouling on top of the lands comes from rough leads from bad chambering so i took it to a good local gunsmith.. I told him to recut the lead slightly to smooth them up and lap them and see if he could get the fouling out... (if it stops fouling i maybe could slowly scrub the old fouling out..
he look down the muzzel, looked down the breach set the gun down, looked me in the eye and said "[bad] barrel."

I think he ment no need to throw good money into a bad barrel.. I cant argue with him im not a gunsmith.. I was crushed, im 68 and a not whole lot to due with my time.
I took it to where i bought it for 800 dollars (i sent for 100 rebate) and they said they would have thier gunsmith look at it..

Im afraid remlin will tell me to take a hike, or good enough for a deer at 30 yards.. ( It actually shoots fine) Meanwhile im cleaning 2 hrs a night to keep the fouling from the muzzel which will probably affect accuracy...

Sorry the marlins arnt ready for human consumtion yet, in my opinion...
I can guess how much a new quality barrel will cost for a lever action, finished, 3 dovetails, crowned, chambered etc, etc..
This was my baby, now its a pita. that i really cant do anything about right now, may have to dump the damn thing for a pretty big loss..
Im not a happy camper.. 800 dollars is alot of money for a piece of krap.
Sorry if i put this on the wrong forum.. dave
 
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Ive seen that is an option that is popular on this forum.. I may have to do it if marlin says Too bad, so sad, tough luck sucker... But at this point it may void the warranty...

I read some tests done on line and firelapping improved accuracy with jacketed bullets... But they cleaned the bore first... For some darn reason nothing will clean the bore.. would you fire lap with the carbon/copper coated bore that wont clean up?

I agree that getting the throat smoothed out would problably cure most of the fouling problems.. If that is what would happen then the bore would eventually clean up if no more fouling is building up and i can eventually brush it out... Dave
 
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Maybe you could trade this Marlin for a ROSSI Rio Grande in 45-70. A co-worker bought one last year and loves it. He hunts wild hogs with this rifle.

Jack
 
ffffg ,,,did you look at the barrel before you shot it??? was it dirty looking from the factory??? could be that is machine marks you are trying to get out?? send it to them and tell them it wont shoot,,,i would hope they would rebarrel it

ocharry
 
I read some tests done on line and firelapping improved accuracy with jacketed bullets... But they cleaned the bore first... For some darn reason nothing will clean the bore.. would you fire lap with the carbon/copper coated bore that wont clean up?
Click to expand...
If you've attempted to clean it as much as you say you have, then that isn't carbon or copper. It's a rough bore.
I've been in that situation myself, with brand-new Remington and ER Shaw barrels.

In my opinion, there are four options:
1. Make Remlington replace the barrel.
2. Fire-lap it.
3. Hand-lap it.
4. Replace the barrel yourself. (Via a gunsmith, if you don't have the tools.)
(5. If it wasn't a .45-70, reboring and rechambering would also be an option. But there isn't much you can go to beyond .45-70 that functions through a 336/1895 action without major modification.)
 
There's no way on God's green earth that I'd ever spend hours cleaning the bore of one rifle. Lots of other, less mundane things I'd rather do. I'd either sell it, rebarrel it or live with it as is (the op conceded, "It actually shoots fine..."). But no way am I ever to going devote hours to getting a bore clean.
 
dgludwig reminded me that there IS an option 6, as he mentioned:
Just live with it and shoot it. It might require a little extra scrubbing at cleaning time. But if it works well enough for you (other than looking dirty), is it really a problem?

I had to ask myself that question about one of the aforementioned ER Shaw barrels. For a short time, I gathered supplies to fire-lap the barrel. But ... In the end, the answer was, "I won't shoot it enough to be a problem, and it shoots like a dream. Might as well just leave it alone and keep it...."
 
If the group size is within reason for such a rifle, it sounds like you're going beyond adequate cleaning. "Cleaning the un-cleanable." Shoot it and be content with normal cleaning.
 
When I started hunting, 53 years ago (sounds long ago, but seems like yesterday), I used my uncle's 336, in 35 Remington. Shooting offhand, I was preached to put all shots within a paper plate, at 100 yards. Served me well!
 
Thanks for the help, I appreciate it... what was happening is the bad bore fouled, then the fouling would march down to the muzzel adding more on top as it was shot..After a good scrubbing (not cleaned) even a half dozen rounds would add 2-4 inches of fouling down bore.. Id get that off and start over.. I felt that if it reached the muzzel, accuracy would start to suffer, dont know. I wanted to get it clean so i could lap it,, So much goo down there it was like bulldozing a mountain.. and 6 rounds would put what i got out back..

A new 800 dollar gun and it turns out to be a bummer, its like haveing cops at the door for a teen getting cought steeling a motor cycle at 4am in the morning and on camera at the town pump getting gas.. ... Its all good, hes grown up, bought my old pawn shop i started and just gave me my first grandson... Some one to give the cowboy to when i cant pack it any more...

In the meantime I took it to the seller and the gunsmith there said he would bore scope it, It looks like I may get a new barrel from remlin.. but not in stone yet..
At least they know if they send another bad barrel thell get that one back also.....
Ive got a nice old marlin .35 waffle top.. Its really a great gun.. But i like the repeating 45-70 here in montana for things that go bump in the night.. (:<)

A couple guys shot a griz on the trail here this year, Fish and game couldnt prove that he wasnt going to attack so they got away with it.. drug it down to the creek ,then decided to report it, seemed fishy. but every now and then someone gets their head chewed on and legs and arm bit if they run into a grumpy momma bear in the spring.. ....

http://www.ktvq.com/story/33299198/montana-man-documents-moments-after-grizzly-bear-attack

http://www.spokesman.com/blogs/outd...r-montana-hunter-injured-grizzly-bear-attack/




Dave
 
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What did you mean by "it actually shoots fine?"
If it does shoot fine, meaning plenty accurate, what is the problem?
Why is it necessary to have a pristine barrel if it shoots fine?
It's just going to get dirty again anyway.
Don't get it.
 
What did you mean by "it actually shoots fine?"
If it does shoot fine, meaning plenty accurate, what is the problem?
Why is it necessary to have a pristine barrel if it shoots fine?
It's just going to get dirty again anyway.
Don't get it.
Click to expand...

He's probably OCD. :D
 
What did you mean by "it actually shoots fine?"
If it does shoot fine, meaning plenty accurate, what is the problem?
Why is it necessary to have a pristine barrel if it shoots fine?
It's just going to get dirty again anyway.
Don't get it.
Click to expand...
Sometimes, the problem is fouling.

I have a barrel that's laser accurate for about three rounds, and then goes down hill very quickly.
It copper-fouls so badly and so quickly, that there are streaks of copper visible through the bore after just five rounds. If you push on further and get 15-20 rounds down the tube, performance down range is sub-par and there are literally globs of copper all over the bore and muzzle.

Shoots great when clean.
Fouls too quickly to be worthwhile.
:rolleyes:
 
Sounds to me like a phone call to Marlin is due. Seems like way too much thinking on what ifs when a simple phone call may produce the effect needed. I personally have never heard of a factory sending a new barrel to a gun shop for them to fix under factory warranty. Give the phone call thing a try. The outcome may surprise you.
Ralph
 
The gunsmith report is in.. He said the barrel is clean which fooled me. I was getting clean patches but the lands are chewed up bad enough to look like fouling.. He Said marlin has been making guns like that by the many thousands and is typical, and the norm.. He also said they usually shoot fine, which it seems to do. but for how many rounds ill have to see.. Ill get it back and evaluate the fouling problem, and the amount of time to clean after 10 rounds etc..... He recomended firelapping it which was the first advice frankenmauser gave me. He doubted marlin would do anything about it, and it would cost about 1000 dollars to do a quality rebarrel job..
thanks again for all the help... Ill probably be asking questions about firelapping next... Dave
 
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