Need some tax advice, please

CindyH

New member
To make a long story short, thatnks to my ex, we owe the IRS over $25,000, including interest and penalties. Paying this off at a rate faster than the interest and penalties would require ridiculous payments over a period of several years.

I've read a lot of things that say the fed. income tax is illlegal and unconstitutional, and that we all pay it "voluntarily" by signing our W-4's. I've read a lot about this and all of the tihngs that state this site specific court examples, etc. The sites/articles I find that say it's a load of cr@p say simply that. They don't site any specific cases or facts, they just say, "Everyone pays taxes. You know you have to pay them. Get over it."

I've also talked to a few people who have heard the same thing, and some who even know of people who have gotten out of paying taxes forever. But, they say you have to go through a lot of hoops to do it, and you really have to know what you're doing.

There's a guy in town who says he can do just that and get us out of debt for $3500. I've tried the offer in compromise twice, and the IRS rejected it both times. At one point, my (then) husband and I made a combined income of $25,000/yr. But, since we were self-employed and had no proof of this, when we called to set up a payment plan, they took our previous year's income ($50k), but used our then current bills that we were barely affording on our income, and came up with a monthly payment of $980!!!! :eek:

This is just an example of my dealings with them over the past five years. I am really at a loss as far as what to do. My parents say this guy is full of it. My ex says he'll guarantee it in writing, or we get our money back (I'll have to see this before I give any $$$$).

Does anyone have any experience with this sort of thing? If you don't feel comfortable posting it, please e-mail me (cindy.hayward@visto.com)
Thnaks
 
The best advice I can give you is to consult your Congressman/woman first. You might be suprised at the ammount of snap they have with even the IRS. Most have people in their offices whose sole purpose is dealing with complaints arising out of tax issues. Then I would suggest an attorney (that you probably can't afford to begin with).
I believe that the IRS is voluntary too, but I voluntarily pay my taxes, because to fail this would enevitably mean I would lose my home, cars, liberty, and maybe even my life. For some this is worth it, but for myself, there had better be a damn good reason before I'll subject my wife and child to the ensuing shootout that would occur when they tried to seize my property.
 
Cindy:

Your chances of getting out of paying the income tax by the methods described are nil. They are a sham. No court in the country has as of yet has agreed with this position.

Having said that, I would suggest that you talk to a tax attorney. Not an accountant, but a tax attorney. Depending on your circumstances there are several avenues that you personally can pursue. If for example your ex-husband owned and ran the business and he filed the income taxes, the IRS has a program for innocent spouse relief. Whereby your ex would be stuck with all the tax and you would be free and clear. This is a big one right now. The IRS is pushing this program to help out the innocent little ladies and will do most anything to meet their quota and make them look good to all the politicals.

Second, even though you have not had much success with the IRS regarding an offer in compromise, a tax attorney (who deals with these cases on a daily basis), has a far better chance. If it were me, I would try and reconstruct your income and expenses from your bank accounts (request copies of bank statements from your bank) and file your returns or amended returns to show the lower amounts. Then it is a matter for the courts.

Hope this helps. Oh by the way I am a CPA and have dealt with quite a few cases like yours.



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Richard

The debate is not about guns,
but rather who has the ultimate power to rule,
the People or Government.
RKBA!
 
CindyH,

I can pass on a story about 2 brothers I went to high school with.

They and their father set up a "Church". Made themselves "Ministers" in this church. Sold ministerships in this church for $3000. This was back in the '70's. They had quite a few folks who signed up.

About 3 years later I'm the supervisor of one of these brothers. I handed out the paychecks, and can attest to the fact that NO federal or state taxes were being withheld from his check. This went on for years and seemed to be working.

Long story short. The family lost their farm and everything on it. If I remember correctly the sentences for the "ministers" ranged from 7 to 20 years. To be served in Levenworth Federal Prison.

Good Luck...

Joe



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Go NRA
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by bookkie:
Your chances of getting out of paying the income tax by the methods described are nil. They are a sham. No court in the country has as of yet has agreed with this position.
[/quote]

CindyH,

bookie is right. I, too, am a Certified Public Accountant (for 19 years) and my suggestion is just the same as his; save whatever money you have, visit with an attorney that practices in taxation, and work with him. Listen to his advice.

I've never heard of anyone getting those "angles" to work. If it sounds too good to be true, then it is (too good to be true).

Numbers

[This message has been edited by Numbers (edited August 31, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Numbers (edited August 31, 2000).]
 
Oh, by the way... if anyone thinks that by saying tax avoidence like what is suggested here is a scam, is due to my bias as an accountant.... Please be advised that I'm one of the largest supporters to do away with the IRS and income taxes. If there was a legal way to get out of them..... accountants and tax attorney's would be the first to do so. After a few years of dealing with the IRS on a daily basis and seeing the abuse (I once challenged an agent over his audit of a client, and to intimidate me, he audited me personally for three years) one gets to the point of hating the system. I spend so much time fighting this crap, when I could be doing something productive.



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Richard

The debate is not about guns,
but rather who has the ultimate power to rule,
the People or Government.
RKBA!
 
Bookie,

Have you taken a look a this site? This guy is offering quite a sum of money to anyone who can disprove his method. It might be worth your time to get your hands on it.

www.anti-irs.com

Of course, if you did, you'd have to pay taxes on it... :(
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John/az
"When freedom is at stake, your silence is not golden, it's yellow..." RKBA!

See The Legacy of Gun Control film at: www.cphv.com

Do it for the children...

[This message has been edited by John/az2 (edited September 01, 2000).]
 
Thanks, everyone for your input. I have an appointment w/ a tax attorney in a couple of weeks.

Personally, I've tried dealing with them myself for several years and I must say their tactics are unethical, unconstitutional, and just plain evil, but they're bigger than i am and I know in about a year, after they process my tax returns and find my new employer, I'm screwed. Already had that happen once and they can garnishe everything except the last $100 of your check. They did. :(
Can't do that again.
 
Cindy, I'm no help at all; don't know squat about tax law. But I just wanted you to know that what's been done to you really sucks and I can imagine the worry you are going through. Let's hope karma kicks in for him (or kicks him, for that matter).
My thoughts are with you.
 
Cindy, bookie and Numbers have given you good advice ... glad to hear you have an appointment with a tax attorney. Check your state bar, and see if your attorney is listed as a specialist re: income taxes. Personal recommendations / reputation are also important. Not all tax attorneys are created equal ...

Make their work as easy as possible, so you can minimize the fees. Take the time to get your records straight, etc.

Don't waste another moment on anti-IRS tax schemes. I've been in the business myself ... such schemes are a waste of time, at best. If your ex comes up with any more ideas like this, just keep reminding yourself why he's an 'ex'.

You want a sharp tax lawyer, and they should be able to resolve this as well as possible.

Good luck, and best wishes. Regards from AZ

[This message has been edited by Jeff Thomas (edited September 01, 2000).]
 
In looking thru my papers, preparing for the appointment, I've found that I'm actually only liable for a portion of it. (Part of his debt is from the year BEFORE we were married, that's where this whole problem started).
The total is around 16k and the original debt is *only* about $10k. Not realyy an "only" amount, but much less intimidating than $25k! (I've read that bona fide tax attourneys can often get the penalties and interest reduced, at least).

BTW, thanks, mrsMTN, moral support helps a lot. :)

In divorce court, he's trying to play victim, as in he thinks he made a lot of money and when he didn't anymore, I left. :rolleyes:
Well, I have paperwork showing that I actually paid off several thounsand $$$$ of his debt w/MY credit cards before we were even married. [/divorce rant] (sorry) :D
Thanks again, everyone. I believe what the people say about the IRS being unconstitutional, but it doesn't hold up in court, so I'll have to fight that battle another way. *whew* I almost gave him $500 toward paying this guy, too!
 
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