need help with my kids next deer rifle

R

riverratt

New member
Okay so as a kid i killed my first deer with a win. 30-30 at the age of 9. I remember sighting in the rifle in the months prior, and i remember the feel of the metal buttplate driving into my shoulder. Looking back at that time i am surprized i could hit anything from flinching before shooting. The length of pull was waaay to long for me and i could barely reach the trigger. The fear of that guns recoil left me shooting only .22s for the next few years (thankfully i grew out of it). (FYI it wasnt as much the recoil as it was the point on the buttplate but i didnt know that then):) I dont want my kids to be scaird of a gun like that.

I have been letting my kids to go at there own pace but living in indiana, we couldnt use rifles unless they were chambered in a pistol round, my choices were limited. I bought them an h&r youth .44 mag, that i down loaded for them.

We live in ky and can use any centerfire rifle we want. My kids can now shoot a full power .44 mag load (240gr) and the distance of the shots where we hunt mandate a different rifle.

Now i have always been told that a .243 or 7mm-08 are very light recoiling rifles but have never shot one, and no one i know has one i could use. So my question is... how much less/more will a .243 or 7mm-08 kick than our .44 mag if all guns weigh the same?

Sorry for the long post got kinda carried away:D
 
I feel you're kinda overthinking the situation. The recoil difference between a .44Mag rifle and a .243 or 7/08, tho probably measureable, is so little as to be inconsequential. Your kids know that a gun thumps on one end, but kills on the other. I taught mine that all guns have recoil, even BB guns, but the recoil isn't gonna hurt you, well, except for a few, but that's not what we're talking about. Find the rifle with a stock that fits and take them hunting, they'll never forget it. GW
 
Thanks for the quick reply goatwiskers i have taken both boys out and found a youth model savage that fit them well in .243 thought about picking it up next fri. Just aint sure they are able to handle it. But it sounds like the kick is closer to what they have then i thought.

They have been hunting and my youngest killed his first deer this past season, a 123lb (field dressed) buck with 13" spikes. I dont know who was more exited after we, well he, tracked it.
 
The "ACTUAL" recoil between them is likely about the same. The much better designed stocks and recoil pads on modern bolt rifles will probably make "FELT" recoil of a 243, 260, or 7-08 even more comfortable than the 44 mag. I'd probably include 308 in that group as well.

I know I find the recoil from my 308 more pleasant than from my lever guns in 30-30 or 44 mag. Those single shots can be wicked, even in light calibers.
 
I started my daughter when she was 8 with a .223 Remington, as she was sensitive to recoil. She has been very successful with the .223 Rem using Barnes Vortex ammunition and the 55 grain TSX bullet and took her first deer at age 9 at 140 yards. This last year I let her take a hard quartering shot with that round, she hammered a nice white tail doe at 100 breaking her front shoulder and having her pile up in less than 20 yards.

If you work with your children you'll not hesitate to use a small caliber. The .223 is easy on the shoulder and will not make a young child fear recoil or report. Since the .223 Remington is legal for deer in KY I'd consider that as a contender in your rifle selection.
 
I'd go with .243. I think it's light enough recoil that anyone can shoot it as a starter rifle, but effective enough that you can continue to use it.

I shot an older crescent-buttplate Model 94 in .30-30, and it was not comfortable to shoot. It handled well, but the recoil was sharp.
 
My little .243 carbine weighs seven pounds, total. I've never really noticed the recoil; doesn't compare to my rather-heavy '06. Been real easy to kill a couple of dozen bucks with it.
 
I will say that you definitely know you've lit off a big game cartridge when you fire a 7mm08. It's not really bad, but much more recoil than a 243. Physics say there should be 40% more recoil from a 140 grain bullet versus a 100 grainer at the same velocity which is pretty close to correct from my perspective.
In the field, a 7mm08 loaded down to 2300fps with the correct bullet will be more effective--again my perspective.
I've killed a lot of deer with a 243 and so have my kids so I'm not trying to discredit it.
 
Thanks for all the replies, they were all very helpfull. Sounds like im gonna pick up that savage as planed.

Growing up i hunted with a 30-30 for 4 years and then went straight to an 06 with a 180gr bullet. My granddad always said that anthing less than that wont kill deer as effectivley. I know now that that isnt true but i still dont think im ready to switch to something like a .223.

I will be handloading for it so does anyone have a good bullet they would recomend, or just any cup and core 100gr work? Keep in mind shots will most likely be within 200yrd.
 
My grandpa was one for 30 calibers for a long time and then he stumbled upon some good smaller rifles. For the last 30 years his go to deer rifle was a 6.5x50 jap rifle. Many times he shot deer in the 100-200 range dropping them in their tracks.

When I was 16 he shot one out of my deer blind that had 16 measurable points and many smaller. The deer easily weighed 300 pounds and we had a lot of trouble dragging it gutted with a fourwheeler.

The jap rifle has similar load data to my 30-30 winchester but the felt recoil is a lot less and that's even using a recoil pad on the winchester.

He was also a fan of the 7mm-08, 7mm mauser, 270 and 243.
 
Well I think the 30-30, especiall in a Marlin lever is a perfect deer combo within it's range.
Heck I even have a Remmy bolt gun in 30-30.
There are many, many, cailbers that will fill your needs.
This topic has been discussed forever and probably should be.:D
 
Let me preface that I have never shot a .44 Mag carbine.

However, I have several kids and have bought a couple different rifles in an attempt to get them something to shoot comfortably for deer/hog. Here's what I've learned.

I purchased a Weatherby Vanguard Youth in .243 for my oldest. .243 is a proven performer on both hog and deer, so I was completely comfortable with the caliber selection. The rifle was nice, came with both adult and youth LOP stocks, and to me was a joy to shoot. My oldest harvested a deer and hog with it. I thought all was well.

Then one day, I wanted to go to the range and she really did not want to go. Surprised, I began asking what the problem was and discovered that the recoil was uncomfortable to her. Ugh! BIG problem. The last thing I wanted was for her to be scared of her rifle.

So, back to the drawing board. I finally ended up with an AR-15 with collapsible stock in 6.8 SPC. Adjustable to her LOP and can grow with her, the AR is very light on recoil with the buffer/spring, and the 6.8 is more than capable on deer/hog out to 300 yards. The first time out was a blast for her. She loved shooting it.

Now, cost definitely comes into play here. An AR is not a cheap proposition compared to an entry-level bolt .243. I've seen a Remington 700 youth .243 package with a Bushnell scope for $415. Savage has affordable options as well.

A huge benefit of going with the .243 is ammo availability. If you go with the AR, and decide on a caliber other than 5.56, ammo can be tougher to find and almost just as expensive as .243, despite the smaller cartridge sizes. This can be remedied with an extra upper in 5.56 for practice.

Just a couple thoughts from someone who has BTDT.
 
In my Daughter's 243, we used Speer Grand Slam 100 grain bullets. Those punch through and leave a good sized hole. She had a problem with shooting at the "middle of the brown" and made some less than optimum hits. Those Grand Slams did very well considering. Another bullet which worked well in other 243's is the Nosler "solid base" soft point. It hangs together well while expanding adequately.
 
option

You will get a ton of replies on .243 and I can't argue against it. I will suggest another option though.

If you are still hunting in woodlands, with 150 yd +/- shots, consider a 7.62x39 bolt rifle. Near 30-30 power, a simple manual of arms, and most are light and short carbine types. And I promise, absolute powder puffs to shoot. Savage made some, so did Ruger, and CZ and Zastava still do.

I am not a fan of the various lever carbines for beginners, even though many of us started on them. Without the lawyer safety, they require an understanding of the half cock. With the lawyer safety, they still require working all the ammo through the rifle to clear it. A bolt with a mag or floorplate is way simpler to render clear. I thought the first shot I took with a M94, as a highschooler no less, kicked more than I thought it would too!

My Ruger 77/Mk2 in x39, stainless and synthetic, may be the ideal youth rifle. Now that bamaboy has outgrown it (he's a hog rifle man now) I take the little Ruger anytime I can where the ranges are not to great.
 
You know, bamaranger, i didnt even think of a 762x39 as a potential sporting round. I know they can handle the recoil of an AK. Thanks for adding another option.
 
.260 Remington 700. One of my favorite deer hunting rifles. Also, don't overlook the possibility of a Mosin-Nagant as a beginning rifle. With a Medium Size Limbsaver Recoil Pad the kick is very little. Ammunition is readily available and there are hundreds of different customization options on the market to turn it into a sporter, like the Archangel and Boyds stock. Heck, it's a good deer hunting rifle even with open sights up to a 150-200 yards with enough practice. One more thing, if you don't want to scope it, Josh Smith makes these wonderful adjustable sights that can increase accuracy by alot. Anyway, I'll stop going on now. Good Luck with your child's next firearm.
 
I've found the Sierra 85-grain HPBT in .243 to be deadly on deer. But, two caveats: I only take either a neck shot or a cross-body heart/lung shot. No angling shots. That's a "blow-up" bullet.

My 7mm08 is 6.5 pounds, total. Not a bad "Thump" of recoil, but definitely noticeable with full-power 139-grain bullets. A bit heavier rifle and "starting" loads would probably be more tolerable for a smaller person.
 
OP if you hand load choose the 7mm-08 hands down...

With a 120gr nosler ballistic tip @ 2800fps its a light kicker and WILL kill the crap out of deer. Its far more effective that 90-100gr bullets in a .243. If recoil is a worry slip on a removeable butt pad. Once they get older push those 120 grainers to 3000fps and they will NEVER need another deer gun.
 
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