Neck sizing 6.5x55 question & load recommendation

F

fourbore

New member
I am planning to re-load a Swedish Mauser in 6.5x55. I have an RCBS 2 dies set and a Lyman neck size die with a decapper. I never used a neck die. I have loaded other bottle neck rifle ammo. Not a newbie, but; not expert or I would not be asking for advise.

First time out with the rifle, I notice the primers backed out about 10/1000 on firing. Herters ammo. So; I order a full set of head space gauges and found the NO-GO does not quite close. That is a pass. I also wasted my money on a FIELD gauge. Obviously, that also does not close for a pass. It appears when firing the case it is initially moved forward by the firing pin and then ignition takes place.

My concern is when I fire the case it expands and grips the chamber wall and what brass expansion occurs is all at the case head. If I just neck size, I am inviting eventual case head separation. How should I deal with this?

I got a crazy idea. That is to paste tiny paper shims (~10/1000 thick) onto the shoulder of each round. Just 3 little paper dots to center the round and hold it back against the bolt face. I would leave 80% of the shoulder area to expand forward. Then neck size, load and shoot again.

Might as well ask if there is any recommendation for a powder for case life, low pressure and reasonably accurate shooting. Planning on 140 grain. Although, I do have 400 milsurp 160gr bullets. I would prefer to avoid any ladders or component tests. Try a mild starter load and hope to call it good. I have a boat load of Fed 215 and Win WLRM. Both magnum rifle primers. I really like to use up those 215. Maybe 36gr of 4831 (with 215's) Send me a private message if you like. Or call me wrong. Dont hold back.
 
I necksized for my Swede when I had it. Using Norma brass and a medium level load, they went for many reloads before trimming was necessary. Never had a case separation.
 
If you wish to fireforme tha case, you need a stouter load.
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I am shooting factory ammo. I dont plan to fire form with 36 grains. The ammo is Herters and PRVI. That once fired brass with be my start point to load. That brass does not stretch out enough to fill the chamber. I base that on observing the primers slightly raised on the fired cases.

My chamber is on the loose side which is my primary motivation to neck size.
 
I am shooting factory ammo. I dont plan to fire form with 36 grains. The ammo is Herters and PRVI. That once fired brass with be my start point to load. That brass does not stretch out enough to fill the chamber. I base that on observing the primers slightly raised on the fired cases.

My chamber is on the loose side which is my primary motivation to neck size.
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Then the factory loads are pretty weak .... that or your headspace is really long..... which cannot be if you checked it with guages...
 
"...paste tiny paper shims..." That does nothing but waste your time and paper. The headspace on that rifle is fine as long as the bolt doesn't close completely on the No-Go.
"...brass expansion occurs is all at the case head..." Nope. It expands in every direction, including lengthwise.
The only issue with neck sizing only is that it's only good for cases fired out of that rifle and eventually you'll have to FL resize anyway.
36 grains of either 4831(IMR or H. They're very close with a 160, but not the same powder.) is well below minimum for either bullet weight.
"...magnum rifle primers..." Magnum primers are about the powder used and nothing else. They do help ignite any powder in extreme cold too though. There is no specific temperature range but I keep hearing it gets cold in New England.
"...Try a mild starter load and hope to call it good..." That won't be as accurate as a Swede can be. However, the 140 grain Herter's stuff(loaded by Sellier and Bellot) runs at roughly 2582 FPS MV. Any load that's close to that will do nicely. That's pretty much Max loads of H4831. Mid range loads with IMR4831.
Closest load to a 160 is a 156 from either Prvi or S&B. The S&B is running 2372 FPS. Slightly above Minimum with either IMR or H 4831. The IMR Start load is only 10 FPS slower. That'd do nicely for your 160's. Mind you, the Swedes didn't use a 160 grain bullet after 1941. It was a 156 grain RN before then and a 140 grain Spitzer after.
 
The only issue with neck sizing only is that it's only good for cases fired out of that rifle and eventually you'll have to FL resize anyway.
36 grains of either 4831(IMR or H. They're very close with a 160, but not the same powder.) is well below minimum for either bullet weight.
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When you say "well below minimum" are you suggesting I should not go there? My Hornady 9th edition shows 38.5 as a starter load with H4831 for both 140 and 160 bullets. I guess that might be more sensible then? I still like to use up the 215's.

That is just a coin toss on the powder. I do see RL19 or 22 are recommended in two other manuals as most accurate. The RL19 has a start 37.6 both bullets.

I guess you all know, the small ring Mauser have no gas venting provision. Any case or primer fails all comes back threw the bolt body.

I see you are from Canada so you probably get a good laugh when we complain about the cold. It has been cold. I do complain. Last week mornings 5 to 8 below (afternoon around 10) and we really caught a break at +5 this morning.
 
Swede

Are you certain you have your dies properly set up?

If so, you should not experience headspace issues; as long as the
case shoulder is correct. If not, the case will be pushed forward by the firing pin impact.

I have been using the same 100 rounds of Norma 6mm brass for more than 30 years with little to no issues in my 98k Mauser.

Die set up is critical and should be reviewed and revisited regularly.
 
I have not done any loading yet. I just test fired with factory Herters ammo. Next, I checked the head space. Cold temps put a damper on shooting.

My next move will be to shoot a few boxes of factory loads to harvest the empty brass. I am concerned the once fired brass is not filled the chamber on firing.

I can see where the primer would back out a bit for an instant. By the time the bullet left the barrel, I would have though the brass would expand and the primer would be back flush with the case.
 
I can see where the primer would back out a bit for an instant. By the time the bullet left the barrel, I would have though the brass would expand and the primer would be back flush with the case.
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That is the way the way it's supposed to work.

The only time I ever had primers back out was with a rifle with dangerously long headspace and really light loads ....
 
How I set up a neck die is to stop it from sizing about 1/32nd of an inch from where the neck begins to expand at the neck. You can practically do the same thing with a full length sizing die, just back it off.
 
How I set up a neck die is to stop it from sizing about 1/32nd of an inch from where the neck begins to expand at the neck. You can practically do the same thing with a full length sizing die, just back it off.
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I was told that was called the poor man's neck sizing die :)
 
I partial size for my 6.5x55. Plan on a Lee collet die to neck size it but just haven't ordered it yet. I thik you mentioned that the starting load you used was below min in the book you used? That being the case, is the neck and shoulder black? If so, your not getting enough pressure and the case is not filling out and being pushed back. 10/1000 is an awful small measurement. generally when I've seen primer's back out, they come out enough to be able to see and feel them. Only ever seen it with light loads. Not enough power to set the case all the way back to the bolt face. When you fire a round, the case fille up the chamber and the primer is moved back to the bolt face. Then pressure builds and the case itself is pushed back to the bolt face re-seating the primer. Try a load at no less than min and see what happens. Using the collet die is a relatively new deal for me. I got the Lee in 30-06 and tried it out. Feel was confusing for me at first, wasn't sure if I was getting the neck sized or not. But got over it and now have one in 243 also. Before using the s d collet die I partial sixe my case's till they won't chamber anymore. Then get the FL die adjusted so the case's will chamber easily in the rifle. At that point th case fit's the chamber just right. I set the die there and lock it in, never fool with it again with that die, it is set for that rifle. Then back to collet sizing and when the case get's sticky, run it through the FL die and ready to go again. The best thing about using the collet dies, who ever's you have, is that case length seldom need's adjusting again. By going to the collet instead of an adjusted FL die, you will eliminate the expander nipple on the rod pushing out the primer. That is where most case stretch come's from.
 
I have been using the same 100 rounds of Norma 6mm brass for more than 30 years with little to no issues in my 98k Mauser.
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When I bought my Carl Gustaf I asked my gunsmith about loading for it and he said to expect 10 firings before the cases begin to fail, now you have me wondering.

I bought a 3 die set plus a Lee FCD. Some of the .308 ammo I recently bought for my M1A shows the same collet type crimp. Obviously I don't need both a neck size and the FCD, right?

I didn't mean to highjack your thread fourbore, we are discussing the same questions!
 
If it doesn't not close on a no-go, then the headspace is fine.

Lee Collet die's work great for neck sizing, and are inexpensive, but your Lyman should work fine.

"well below minimum", I would only do this with powder that tolerates it, specifically H4895.

I only neck size for my Husky M38, and have never had a head separation, and am still on the original 100 Remington cases I bought ~20 years ago. I don;t know the total reloads per case, but definitely more than 5 each.
 
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