Money where your mouth is!

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NMGlocker

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OK.... this is for any of the "vocal" 1911 fans out there. (WR?)
I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is. If you talk the talk, then walk the walk.
I'm willing to drive up to 12 hours in any direction, with a brand spanking new, unfired, untested, Glock 17, (just as GG himself designed). Along with 2000 or more rounds of ammo. And $500 cash.
You show up with a brand spanking new, box-stock factory 1911, Just as JMB (gawd hisself) designed it, no beavertails, no lowered ejection port, no full length guide rod, etc., same quantity of ammo, and your $500 cash.
We shoot from 15 yards, first malfunction, or first shot outside an IPSC "A" zone, and you lose the $500. No cleaning of the pistols allowed. No rest breaks. Only the magazines that came with the pistol allowed.
Any takers? (I need an excuse to buy another G17 anyway, might as well use your $500 to do it with :D )
 
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Yeah, Glock 'n Roll
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Love my Kimber, but my money's on the Glock. Let us know where this is going to take place. I'd be willing to drive some distance just to watch! :cool:

How about it WR?
 
Hell, I'd almost be willing to pitch in some gas money for a certain someone to drive to meet you.

My gut tells me you'll have no takers.

:rolleyes:

Shake
 
LOL!

I don't think there are many pistols around that I would bring to take you up on that bet! But maybe if I bumped ya good and hard on each shot. :D

Waiting to see if there are takers.....
 
Ok, I'm ALMOST in favor of starting a "Fly Wild Romanian to where ever the hell Glocker is" fund just to get this settled!
 
Well, I don't have a 1911, but I'll take ya up with a single action revolver.. let's up the rounds to 10 or 20k. And, of course, you gotta vary ammo styles, cause anything can be reliable with 1 kinda ammo. Some wadcutters here and there.. ;) Maybe some over-length cartridges, too.

Sorry, I'm bored.. :p
 
Figures you'd pull this near christmas. Consider a 6 month old 1991A1 box stock? Not sure what you're trying to prove, but it doesn't look like much.
 
LOL!

NMG, that's very funny. As a newbie to the sport, I'd really like to see the results of such a test. I'm pretty sure the Glock would take it, given the conditions you describe.

Key words above: "given the conditions".

In fairness to the 1911, we need to consider a few things.

The scenario you describe isn't even close to being a reasonable test for either weapon.

For one thing, it doesn't level the playing field, because you're allowing for Glock's inherent contemporary advances in engineering and ballistics, while denying that same condition, by virtue of research-based adaptations, to the 1911. You've effectively disqualified one weapon, by only allowing as an entry, the machining tolerances and design parameters known in the early 1900's.

That is an unreasonable set of parameters at best.

For this to be truly fair, you should expand the parameters to allow for 'contemporary' 1911's such as those from Kimber or Les Baer, to be included, so that the same level of research and technology can be applied.

For another thing, you're also placing yourself at a disadvantage. Common practice requires that you should test at least 14 or more weapons of each type, to allow for varainces in production runs. This is elementary statistical sampling, and is for your own benefit, as well. If you happen to have the one 'lucky' Glock that rolled off the line on a Friday, from the guy that had a hangover from a Thursday bender, you'd have an awful lot of egg on your face. :D

Don't want to pick a fight, but if you REALLY want to put it to the test, and make a horse race out of it, don't start one horse 10 lengths back, and expect people to pony up.

That said, I'm too broke right now to take a chance. :rolleyes:

No matter what happens... I'll still want to shoot your Glock, too, for the fun of it all. (coming from a guy that also owns a P99)
 
Rovert-

I don't believe the test is unfair at all. I believe that what he is trying to do is call out one Wild Romanian who has, essentially, professed that anything designed since JMB created the original 1911 or P35 is junk. Obviously, WR is mistaken, but he refuses to back down from his wild claims. I haven't noticed WR responding to this post to defend his beloved box stock original pattern 1911.

I would kick in a dollar or three for his gas money. But then I realize that, for the lesson to be truley effective, the WR needs to experience the loss of maximum dollars! :)
 
FWIW, my piece of crap, box stock 1991A1 has already ate a couple of thousand round with no failures whatsoever. Don't know where people are getting the idea the design is so bad, because the vast majority of failures I see is improperly assembled handloads or they limp wrist the weapon. Don't see where Glock/SIG/Beretta is any better, I shot most of them and they do just fine, but not any better.
 
NMG:

Having had a stock Kimber 1911 for over 2 years now, and having used it in several classes, self-defense, competition, and having shot 18,000+ (only replacing the spring for preventive reasons every 5k rounds) rounds with no jams, failures or problems of any kind, and with good accuracy, I can see where your foolishness could lose you $500. But it could also make you $500, I am not a betting man, even on a sure thing. There is a saying in sports that any team on any given day can be beat, same goes here. I know several others people that have had the same sucess with their 1911's.

Glock is a good gun, so is Kimber, so is Walther, so are others. There are instances, believe it or not (and you won't) where there have been some Glocks get out that weren't the perfect Glocks. Just like there are some Kimbers that get out that weren't the perfect Kimber.

So your little challenge is somewhat immature, and I would consider it (for the love of shooting) if I was 20 years younger mentally, but I am more than 12 hours away and too old to play little games like that. Your little match may seem to prove something in your own little mind, (and little minds similar to yours- You will find many at Glock Talk) but that is about the only place.

I would prefer a challenge like this: You bring 5,000 rounds and $500 as will I. We meet up somewhere between us. We then have some breakfast and go to the range. You show me some things you have learned about shooting, techniques, and self defense and I show you some things I have learned. Then we shoot different types of guns, I shoot your Glock, you shoot my Kimber, my Glock, my Walthers, my AR-15, my .357, my Ruger etc. We shoot until we spend $350 each on ammo. Then we go eat supper, drink a few beers ($150 worth of beer), have a lot of laughs.

My point being that we pro-gun folks have a lot in common in that we like to shoot and recognize the need to be able to defend ourselves. Why can't we, as a community, build on our common interests instead of being petty, immature, childish and bickering about "mine is better than yours"?

Notice that I didn't mention that I have had more problems with one of my Glocks (G19) than I have had with my Kimber or Walther, but since I have not had any problems with Kimber or Walther, that still isn't a bad ratio. I do not use this as a point because it will not change any opinions, and I don't expect it to. But I still think (know) Glock makes a good gun, Walther makes a better gun, the Kimber just keeps it's mouth shut and does the job, unlike yourself.

Again, your petty little challenge won't do anything to change any opinions and is the kind of thing I would expect to hear at Glock Talk. It just demonstates immaturity and a childish nature. But that is not necessarily a bad thing. It is good to die of old age as young as possible.

If your ever in my neighborhood, look me up and we will go shoot some Glocks. I will leave my other guns at home if you prefer.

I like all types of guns, and own as many as possible. A Glock is a good gun to own, but why own just one type of gun or just a Glock?
 
My point being that we pro-gun folks have a lot in common in that we like to shoot and recognize the need to be able to defend ourselves. Why can't we, as a community, build on our common interests instead of being petty, immature, childish and bickering about "mine is better than yours"?
Click to expand...

I believe that line in particular is worth repeating.

Since this thread has, for the most part, descended to the level of badmouthing other TFL members, I am closing it.
 
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