I bought a used Winchester Model 12 in 12 gauge which I discovered from the S/N was made in 1931. Since it was used, I don't know how much of it is original and how much was changed/replaced. It has a Cutts compensator which I believe was an aftermarket add-on, since the barrel is stamped with a full choke designation. I understand that collectors describe model 12s as one of 11 different configurations, i.e. trap, field, riot, etc. I would like to determine which one mine is, but it does not fit neatly into any of the categories, and seems to have elements of more than one. It has a Pachmayr white line recoil pad, a sunburst shaped grip cap, checkering on the pistol grip, checkering on the bottom but not the sides of the fore-end, a 25 1/2 inch barrel including the Cutts expansion chamber, a machined rib, and a plain, un-engraved bolt. I'm including three images. I am thinking about cutting the barrel just behind the Cutts to shorten and open it up, and put a straight stock on it to make it more of a defense/upland gun. Before modifying it though, I want to establish that it is not an uncommon or valuable variant. Any comments would be much appreciated. Thanks.
Model 12 identification
- Thread starter westfi1
- Start date
Model 12 book
is what you need. better to spend 30 bucks before you change what might be rare (Cutts were a factory installed option)
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=165069370
is what you need. better to spend 30 bucks before you change what might be rare (Cutts were a factory installed option)
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=165069370
Your gun was a field grade, but it has been restocked and a Lyman choke installed (it is not a factory installation, since those barrels typically were not marked for choke constriction or had cylinder chokes). Any collector value it may have had is pretty much gone. It is a shooter. I would not, however, shorten it or chop it. If you need a project gun, you can sell the Model 12 and get a Mossberg and have some cash left over.
dropthehammer
New member
In my opinion, cutting the choke and replacing the wood will make the gun worth about $100 less. Cutting the choke off will limit it to being a close range small game gun, but it would make it a virtually indestructible 7 shot home defense gun. If you can deal with that ugly choke on the end of the barrel, you have a Model 12 that you can do about anything with. An excellent all around hunter/shooter. Your gun, your money, your choice. The gun has no collector value as it is.
dropthehammer
New member
I think what Scorch is trying to say is that Model 12's that left the factory with a Cutts or Lyman choke, did not have a choke designation stamped on the barrel.
I am by no means a Model 12 expert, but in 30 years of collecting them, I have seen very few Model 12's with a Cutts or a Lyman that did not have a choke designation stamped on the barrel. These unmarked examples are the only Model 12's with a Cutts or Lyman that I would consider original from the factory.
This is just my opinion. I will admit that I don't pay alot of attention to Model 12's with these chokes. I think a Model 12 with a Cutts or a Lyman is uglier than my ex mother-in-law.
I am by no means a Model 12 expert, but in 30 years of collecting them, I have seen very few Model 12's with a Cutts or a Lyman that did not have a choke designation stamped on the barrel. These unmarked examples are the only Model 12's with a Cutts or Lyman that I would consider original from the factory.
This is just my opinion. I will admit that I don't pay alot of attention to Model 12's with these chokes. I think a Model 12 with a Cutts or a Lyman is uglier than my ex mother-in-law.
I have seen a couple of these cutts choke guns over the years, they looked exactly like the gun in the first set of pictures, except for the wood. My understanding is you would order the gun with the cutts from your dealer, a gun would be shipped to cutts for choke installation. A brand new gun would be delivered to your dealer from cutts or the authorized winchester shop that installed the cutts. I had a remington 1100 that came new with a polychoke, Or i should say it was new and ordered with a polychoke to be installed before it was shipped to dealer. the book says subtract 50% for factory installed cutts compensator guns. But i kind of like the look of it.
dropthehammer
New member
elrondo
Welcome. Your Model 12 looks like a 3"mag heavy duck with a 30" solid rib barrel. Looks pretty honest, but hard to tell by the pics. My opinion on the value would be between $700-$1000. Just my opinion.
Welcome. Your Model 12 looks like a 3"mag heavy duck with a 30" solid rib barrel. Looks pretty honest, but hard to tell by the pics. My opinion on the value would be between $700-$1000. Just my opinion.
Cutts
I wish one of my model 12's had a Cutts instead of the Polly Choke it has. Although both are ugly to me, the cutts is a much better set-up. You could probably find the two screw in chokes you don't have. The usual choice was Full, Modified and some open choke like Improved Cylinder or Skeet.
Although the Cutts was designed prior to the plastic shot column when shot flew down the barrel unshielded, it still works now. I have a friend who has been killing ducks with a set-up like yours for over 50 years.
If it were me I'd keep that gun as is and use it. It will do anything any other 12 gauge will do, just uglier............
I wish one of my model 12's had a Cutts instead of the Polly Choke it has. Although both are ugly to me, the cutts is a much better set-up. You could probably find the two screw in chokes you don't have. The usual choice was Full, Modified and some open choke like Improved Cylinder or Skeet.
Although the Cutts was designed prior to the plastic shot column when shot flew down the barrel unshielded, it still works now. I have a friend who has been killing ducks with a set-up like yours for over 50 years.
If it were me I'd keep that gun as is and use it. It will do anything any other 12 gauge will do, just uglier............