minutemen=skinheads=neo-nazis??

9

9mmsnoopy

New member
according to the houston chronicle they are one and the same. in an article today " '95 bombing was beginning of end for militias" the article goes on to say... "today, anti-immigration vigilantes on the U.S.-mexico border,environmental extremists,skinheads and neo-nazis pose a greater threat of violence,former fbi officials and watchdog groups say"


you have got to be kidding me!!!! to compare a group of Americans who simply want to keep ILLEGALS from entering the country to the timothy mcviegh type of trash is just totally irresponsible reporting. then again this is a paper that quite often runs stories in english and spanish, so i guess i should expect it.


didnt help matters when bush called the minutemen vigilantes, but then again,hes the one pushing that bullcrap "guest worker program"
 
They are vigilantes. And that is not a slur.

vigilante - noun
A person who tries in an unofficial way to prevent crime, or to catch and punish someone who has committed a crime, especially because they do not think that official organizations, such as the police, are controlling crime effectively. Vigilantes usually join together to form groups.
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Grouping them together with known hate groups and terrorist organizations is a simple case of a liberal rag engaging in guilt by association. Anyone with half a brain will see right through it, but it is maddening to read such libelous words.

Have there been any instances of violence perpetrated by the minutemen?
 
if there had been any violence associated with the minutemen we CERTAINLY would have heard about it, hell, all 3 networks would have led off the national news with it,would have been a page 1 headline in all the papers, so im sure there wasnt any cause i never heard about it.
 
bluesman, while they may be vigilantes according to the definition of the word, most people,esp. anti-gunners think of violence when they here "vigilantes", i think that was bush's way of thinking also. hes been known to get confused.
 
A vigilante catches and punishes those he suspects to be criminal, thus assuming the role of judge, jury, executioner, and police officer, all at the low, low price of .223 ammunition.

What those people are doing is not vigilantism because they are not punishing the immigrants, they are just reporting or apprehending them. Citizen's arrest is still legal AFAIK.
 
TheBluesMan, I am not sure where the above vigilante definition came from, but my guess is that it is from a descriptive dictionary, not prescriptive. Descriptive dictionaries include the formal definition and other descriptive definitions that reflect informal or popular uses of the word. Prescriptive dictionaries provide the proper for formal definition that reflects how the word is supposed to be used.

By the definition above, the first part of the definition would mean that things like self defense, actions by private security guards, etc. would be considered as vigilante actions and that simply is not the case. The second part, "to catch and punish" is more correct. An action is a vigilante when due process of the law is not followed as happens when there is no formal trial or sentencing.

Also, the definition you provided said that vigilantes usually join together to form groups. I don't know if that is actually true or not. Vigilante groups often gain quite a bit of nortoriety and might appear to be more common than individual vigilantes, but I don't know of any sort of census study that would justify saying they usually form into groups.

As legal definitions go...

http://www.legal-explanations.com/definitions/vigilante.htm
Someone who ties to punish another person without any legal authority by taking the law into his/her own hands. Groups of vigilantes in the 1800s doled out their own "frontier justice" by conducting trials of accused horsethieves, rustlers and shooters, and hung the accused if "convicted." A mother who shoots and alleged molester of her child is a vigilante.

So, unless the Minutemen start imposing penalties on immigrants, they are not vigilantes.

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9mmsnoopy, I don't see the article as irresponsible reporting as what they are reporting or opnions expressed by certain people. Plus you missed the context of the statement. The opinions are not comparing all those groups and likening them to one another, but simply noting that such groups are a greater threat for violence than militas as militia popularity has declined. Note that they are not saying that the violence has happened by the minutemen, only that the potential is there.
 
according to the houston chronicle they are one and the same. in an article today " '95 bombing was beginning of end for militias" the article goes on to say... "today, anti-immigration vigilantes on the U.S.-mexico border,environmental extremists,skinheads and neo-nazis pose a greater threat of violence,former fbi officials and watchdog groups say"
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This is media priming for something just over the horizon; more "domestic terrorist groups". They will throw this stuff out from time to time until it is quietly simmering in the background.

Look for future "incidents" to be blamed on obscure and handled "[rightwing Christian groups] against euthanasia", "rightwing anti-immigration groups" etc ... and the need for more focus on We the People; more controls, more legislation etc.
 
I am not sure where the above vigilante definition came from, but my guess is that it is from a descriptive dictionary, not prescriptive. Descriptive dictionaries include the formal definition and other descriptive definitions that reflect informal or popular uses of the word. Prescriptive dictionaries provide the proper for formal definition that reflects how the word is supposed to be used.
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Kind of like the definition of "assault weapon"? (Not a snide remark. Playing devils advocate for purpose of spuring debate). Some states declare the legal definition of "assault weapons" as something different than the name was intended and much common use of late has provided many their justification for changing the dictionary definition possibly as well.

LAK,
While I don't think that the use of words in such a way is part of a conspiracy by the media but might be the plan of those who first used words in such a way, I do agree with the end result you suggest. Most of the media is guilty of what many of us do. A number of us re-use words we have heard in common speech and never question the origin and not knowing the consequences of use of such words (I find myself guilty of this all the time :( ). This is of course (one way) how propaganda propogates beyond the conspirators.
 
The "vigilante" term is being thrown at the Minutemen until the public has stopped questioning what the term means, or why those people are actually out in the desert heat doing what they're doing. As I see it, they see a problem to which our government isn't responding, so they're stepping in (in the true spirit of the Minutemen, frankly). There are only a few shades of difference between what they're doing and what Todd Beamer and the other people on United Flight 93 did on 9/11. They're trying to stave off disaster. Doesn't that add some context to the concept of what's being called "vigilate" behavior?
 
This is media priming...
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this is the continuation of education for all that the government is always correct and the supreme authority. anyone who opposes the government is a 'vigilante'. the authors of the Consitution were 'vigilantes' and 'terrorists'.

the government, through the media, manipulates peoples perceptions of events by the usage of terms such as 'vigilante'.

http://web.mit.edu/persci/people/adelson/checkershadow_illusion.html
 
There are other "Minutemen like" border groups that are not even welcomed by Minutemen officials presumably due to their extremism and prior illegal activity. For example, Ranch Rescue and the Arizona Guard.
 
It is almost childlike...the way in which the open-border lobbyists have attacked secure-border advocates such as the Minuteman Project. At the same time they are saying "vigilante" and "prone to violence"...they are making fun at the "grandmothers in lawn chairs" out on the border. What they would like to pin on us: Racist, anti-immigrant, gun-toting extremists, nazi-like, too grandmotherly-like...and of course, the catch-all: Yahoos.
When your position sucks, you can always revert to name-calling.
When in doubt, obscure the issue.
If you can get the American public to either fear or laugh at a group, then half of your battle is over.
 
Novus Collectus,

Each to his own; but this is a discernable pattern going back as far as I can remember, and is discernable - even openly recorded - elsewhere throughout modern history. And not just in this country.

If it were just one or two syndicates, stations and papers etc doing this, I could buy the accidental coincidental bias and stupidity theory. As it is I gave up trying to ascribe any other rational and logical explanation for it many years ago.
 
Militias are constitutional, and they do what must be done.

I for one am glad that we have that right.

God bless the Minutemen!
 
Pancho Villa used to be an illegal guest worker....He used to run a mule train with water from Prescott, over Mingus mountain to Jerome, AZ.....

God bless the Minutemen!
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My wife always asks God to bless her own 60 Minuteman.....(That's me)
 
Arizona Minutemen Protect US while ACLU gets high...

Great job guys and girls! :rofl:

I cannot believe these idiots got busted smoking pot on the job.


ACLU smoking dope at border?
Minutemen say photos show 'legal observers' getting high
Posted: April 19, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern

acluobservers1.jpg

acluobservers2.jpg

© 2005 WorldNetDaily.com


ACLU "legal observers" allegedly smoking marijuana while observing Minuteman volunteers (Photo: South East Arizona Republican Club)

Volunteers with the Minuteman Project in Arizona say "legal observers" sent by the ACLU to monitor the citizen border patrol have been seen smoking marijuana in violation of the law.

Photographs were posted on the website of the South East Arizona Republican Club after Minuteman participants reported they saw, and smelled, the ACLU workers smoking pot.

Eleanor Eisenberg, executive director of the ACLU of Arizona, did not respond to a request for comment given to her assistant by WorldNetDaily.


As WND reported, ACLU activists shadowing the Minuteman Project at the U.S.-Mexican border are actively aiding and abetting aliens attempting to enter the country illegally, according to a spokesman for the volunteer civilian force.

Grey Deacon told Joseph Farah's nationally syndicated "WorldNetDaily RadioActive" audience Friday that ACLU monitors sent to the border to watch Minuteman activity and report civil-liberties abuses to authorities have begun flashing lights, sounding horns and warning off illegals and their "coyote" human smugglers from entering territory patrolled by the volunteers.

"They are actively engaging in criminal activity," said Deacon.

Deacon said the ACLU activists are resorting to new tactics because of the success the Minuteman Project is having in assisting the Border Patrol in spotting illegal aliens and in generating publicity about the insecure U.S.-Mexico border.

The ACLU dispatched its representatives to the 23-mile section of the Arizona border patrolled by the Minutemen after predicting the group would abuse the rights of illegal aliens. No such abuses have materialized to date.

"The ACLU's position is that illegal aliens have a right to enter our border and stay in this country as long as they want," said Deacon. "That's what one of the leaders of the group told me personally."

A volunteer reported, according to the South East Arizona Republican Club, "The ACLU is getting desperate to get something on the Minutemen and are trying to provoke incidents now."

"They pushed one of the Minutemen the other night trying to get him to push back. Didn't work. Then last night they walked up and shined a spotlight right in a Minuteman's face from six inches or so away. Didn't work that time either. We immediately report these types of contacts with them to the sheriff to counter any claims they try to make against us. They should be called the UCLU (Un-American Civil Lawsuit Union).

"They give us the middle finger every chance they get to try to get us to react. We are still trying to figure out if that is their age or IQ."
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