Milsurp Quest

N

Nine the Ranger

New member
So I've decided that once I've come into the money (Which will be soon if there is any justice :D ) that my next couple guns will likely be exclusively Milsurps with an AR build on the side, best of both worlds right?

So my list is as follows:

Swiss K31:
I really want to get one because unless I'm mistaken prices are rising, the history and story of accuracy intruiges me so I'm definitely interested. Plus the straight pull bolt is really unique and probably a cool way to make people go 'What on earth?'

Mosin Nagant Sniper:
Unlike many I've always liked the lines of the MN, and the snipers are just cool. This one partially comes from my love of gaming where I'll grab a Mosin as soon as possible, the relatively cheap ammo just adds to it.

SKS:
Cheating as it's not a bolt gun. But it's kinda like the Mosin as I've used and loved it in games, plus I just like 'old timey' guns for their lines. It balances better than an AK in my hands and remains practical for many uses.

Lee Enfield 'Jungle Carbine':
This one is less for me, and more fulfilling a dream. My late father found one of these at our LGS and fell in love but just never got the money together to get one. So I want to get one as a dedication to my old man, I like them too but it'd likely be a wall hanger and only taken put with Dad's shotgun a few times a year.

So, what should I look for once I get to shopping? Any tips for checking condition or suggestions? Or just talk about these old war horses :D
 
I just picked up a K31. By the SN it was made in 1941 but no troop tag. While Switzerland was neutral during WWII they did enforce their border against Germany. Who knows, maybe my rifle was involved in some of their border skirmishes.
Every K31 I've shot was smooth and have great triggers. I'll get to shoot mine on Friday. I feel like a kid at Christmas.
 
A Mauser, in some flavor, certainly must be part of any collection.
Depends on your budget, which model...
The K98K is among the most valued, and while once cheap- matching, good condition examples are in the four figure range.

Currently available are the M24/47, and the M48 from Surplus retailers/wholesalers. Beyond that, you're pretty much into private sellers.
 
All the really nice examples of Mauser K98, Lee Enfields and Mosin snipers are in privet hands now. You can find a gem every now and then but they are rare.
There are nice Russian capture K98 out there but they are still near or above the 300.00 range. Any LE is in the 300.00 range and a Jungle carbine is yet higher.
Mosins are now selling for near 200.00 for plain 91/30’s and put together snipers are bringing well past 400.00
The days of cheap and plentiful milsurp has sailed over the horizon.
Here is a great site that can give you very good and solid info on any milsurp you are looking for. These guys know there milsurps and are willing to help a new comer.
http://forums.gunboards.com/

Happy hunting!:D
 
I picked up a K31 near the end of last year (with troop tag) and love it. Have noticed prices going up $50-100 just since then. Great rifle and Swiss surplus ammo is surprisingly cheap and easy to get.

I have not seen a decent MN Sniper for sale in person for over a year. About 2 years ago you could buy truckloads of them. No doubt prices have risen sharply.

I have 3 assorted Lee Enfields and will without doubt add more as time goes on but that does not yet include a Mk V (Jungle Carbine). Have not found one I like for a price I was willing to pay yet.

I was just in a certain large national retailers store the other day and they wanted an outrageous amount of money for some No. 4 Mk I's they had - $1,700 each! I paid $89 for mine in 2006. I've seen folks asking $800 for rifles like that in very good nick and think even that is outrageous.
 
Like already stated, a Mauser. Preferably German WW2. Don't forget the U.S. issued rifles, Springfield 1903 (1903A1, etc.) or Garand M1. Personally, I find them more important to a milsurp collection. Also, there's the Japanese Arisaka.
 
I haven't seen any of the "snipers" with scope for under 600$ in decent shape. I couldn't do that for that gun. Too many mosins that shoot as good or better than a sniper for 200$ or leas. I think your list should have a druganov instead, although more expensive, I think, yes opinion, that its actuly more "worth" it and will bring more value in the long run
 
Good choices. The same choices I've made :).

If I were you and jumping in now, I'd get the K31 1st, then a decent SKS, as the prices are on their way up, but not quite ridiculous yet. AIM keeps finding more (almost said "new" instead of "more") SKS rifles to bring in every couple of months. As far as K31's, you could also look at the other Swiss straight pull rifles that also shoot the GP11 cartridge like the Schmidt-Rubin Series (1911 and K11) rifles. Although GP11 is considered match grade ammo at bargain prices, it's still not as cheap as 7.62x39/x54R.

If looking at a MN, do yourself a favor and look for a Finnish variant. Shoots the same cheap ammo, but will make the most out of quality ammo too. The price is already up on those, so no need to beat the crowd to the last one. If still wanting a Russian MN, see if you can find an FFL that has a crate of them you can look through and pick your own best-of.

Enfield's are nice and have a wonderful history. My hunting partner has one and it is quite accurate, but it was sporterized back in the '70's. He has made good use of the 10 round magazine :).
 
I recently sold a nice "Jungle carbine". They are cool looking but recoil is heavy, one reason they weren't popular with troops. Another reason to not like them is "wandering zero", when the barrel warms zero goes away.

K-31, get one and the surplus ammo if you can find it, it is match grade.

Mausers, yup, there are many varieties, collect them all. The Swedes are great, 6.5x55 is a near perfect round.

No collection is complete without a Springfield 1903 and/or 03a3. Krags are very nice, original only, no sporters. Trapdoors, rifles from the days when men were men and women were glad of it!

Hang around your local shops, be on first name basis with the owners, let them know what you're looking for, you'll fill your card, and unfortunately, max your other cards before you know it. Have fun!

I might be a junior member on this forum but this ain't my first rodeo.
 
Nine the Ranger asked:
.....
So my list is as follows:

1) Swiss K31:

2 Mosin Nagant Sniper:

3) SKS:

4) Lee Enfield 'Jungle Carbine':

So, what should I look for once I get to shopping? Any tips for checking condition or suggestions?
Click to expand...

Drop the Mosin and get shopping for the other 3 and a good gunsmith.
 
What you are missing is the Model of 1917, Eddystone, Remington or Winchester.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1917_Enfield

Frankly at 75% use in WWI it far surpassed the more vaunted 1903, and with an OEM rear peep sight it is very good shooting with irons (nice adjusted ladder as well)

Nice square and fat front blade for good sight setup (unlike the skiny 1903 and its sharp peak)

Nice bench gun as its stable and less kick, lot of reload components for it.

Do not get fooled by rumors, the bore is actually a bit tighter than the 1903 as it was specified to US specs and used the British 5 grove setup so it is not a .311 bore as per rumor, its a true (actually a tad sub) .308

Great gun, cock on close action is interesting (though that can be changed if it really bugs you.)

One of the less know guns history wise that did the job.

Don't get me wrong, I do like the 1903, but I think its best setup with a scope (or a 1903-A3 which is better though it suffers the same poor front sight) its not as nice a gun as the pre war 1903s
 
I like the M1917, its an accurate rifle but lacks the windage adjustments of the Springfields.

Also it takes a lot of practice to where you can fire a deceit rapid fire string (as in shooting the CMP GSM games). Unlike the Springfield you have to take the rifle out of your shoulder to work the bolt quickly.

And in rapid fire, when regaining your sight picture, you need to be careful not to grab one of the leafs that protect the front sight instead of the front sight itself.

The Springfield is the most accurate milsurp out there, I agree that the front sight is too thin but that can be fixed by replacing the original front post with the Marine sight which is 0.010 thick. Which is a legal modification per CMP GSM Rules. I also went to a thicker front sight on my M1917. I like my front sights to be the same with as the bulls eye when taking a sight picture.

And then of course there is the Garand. Cant forget this war horse. Best sights you'll find on a milsurp rifle. Nearly as accurate as the Springfields, highly reliable.

No milsurp collection would be complete without a Garand.
 
The 1917 front sight can be drifted to get it on target.

You can make or buy the tool if you need to, this one is good and worked well

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Enfield-P-1...5948a3d&pid=100011&rk=1&rkt=1&sd=251637531815

Personally I think you can shoot the 1917 better than the 1903 as it has far better sights. A3, maybe not with front sight mod.

For competition the smoother 1903 regardless of version maybe better handling but for casual bench shooting the 1917 is great, less recoil (a bit more weight)

Also unique and interesting gun as its derived from the British Pattern which was not manufacture in Britain but the US and then the shift to the 1917.

Far more interesting than the 1903 in my opinion as well as relevant in WWI despite the legend and went on to serve extensively in WWII.
 
well the first one to keep an eye on is the jungle carbine since they were pretty rare to begin with and always hard to find, as such prices are going up faster than most other enfields.

of your other options I would say the SKS might be your better bet. cheapest ammo of the lot, and dead reliable. my chicom SKS is also quite accurate as far as weapons of the time goes. the mosin nagant, although I will give you the fact that they have pretty lines, are not very accurate, refined or easy to operate. their bolt handles are very short, way shorter than most bolt handles which means you get less leverage and the bolts are stiff which means you just about have to "slap the bolt open" rather than use your fingers like modern rifles. the first time I shot a mosin, the only other milsurp at the time I had experience with was the enfield number 4 and I thought I had broken the mosin because it was so much more... sloppy than what I was expecting.

one other you could look at would be an arisaka... ammo is a real pain in the rear to find, but totally worth the aggravation in my opinion. I love the actions, the lines, the history, and the ones in my collection are pretty decent in the accuracy department.
 
$289 is what I paid for a K31 from Gander Mountain a few months back. Mine was in particularly good nick with the dogtag still in the buttplate.

I think they are asking $339 or so now but the last few times I have been in GM stores (several different ones) they still had several on the shelf to chose from.
 
A few of my milsurps: A sweet 1903 M96 Swedish Mauser in 6.5x55, a Finnish M39 in 7.62x54 and a fake Lee Enfield SMLE "T sniper" in .303.
 
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