Michigan School Thought Control

O

Oatka

New member
Check out this latest outrage by the PC school administration. This letter was sent to the Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners

"Subject: School brainwashing...
Date: 03/10/00
Time: 12:02 AM EST
From: jscheid@parrett.net
Subject: MCRGO: needhelp asap
Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 18:53:41 -0800
From: Tim Loutzenhiser
To: mcrgo@shelfspace.com

Tomorrow morning at 7:15 [that's today - Oatka] my wife and I have a meeting at Harbor Lights Middle School in Holland with the principal, 2 assistant principals, and 4 members of the "Hazard and Risk Assessment Team".

My 12 year old son has been accused of being a risk because he spoke about the 2nd Amendment in his social studies class.

We have been able to determine that he has their attention because he often speaks of the importance of the 1st as well as the 2nd Amendments - but the comment that triggered this action was when his socialist studies teacher, Mrs.Perkins asked him to participate in a classroom discussion about school shootings and safety.

My son simply stated that his opinion was that he would feel safer if some of the adults at the school were trained and allowed to carry firearms.

As a result, my wife received a phone call at 9:00 PM Tuesday night in which we were informed that West Ottawa Public Schools feels it is necessary to separate my son from the other students and have him enter the "Mentor" program in which he would be put under the watchful eye of an adult to monitor his thought processes.

We were told that this would be in the best interest of my son, and by doing this the school would not have to involve Social Services.

We refused.

At this point I have been in contact with an attorney in Grand Rapids (through the NRA Institute for Legislative Action) and have been told by a counsel at the Rutherford Institute that they will be willing to take on this issue.

Oh, yes. I failed to mention that in January, as a part of Martin Luther King Day, my son refused to sign the "Red Letter" which was written by the principal Jerry Klomparens. In it the students are to take an oath to turn in their friends for suspicious activity, to vow to never defend themselves if attacked, and something to the effect of never to use a gun or other weapons.

But we have been assured that this had little to do with my son being labeled a threat. And the funny thing is that 3 of the "team" members are also my son's teachers - and they claim they did not know there was any situation. Bottom line - the meeting is hours away at this point and I am willing to listen to any advice. Please advise!

Thanks,
Tim Loutzenhiser"

The school administration's website and email addresses are at: http://www.westottawa.k12.mi.us/secondary_schools_website.htm
For those Michigan members who want to raise Hell.

Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners -- P.O. Box 14014, Lansing, MI 48901 http://www.mcrgo.org/

Michiganders, and others, think about joining this organization for $15 a year. I did, and I'm from Nevada! These folks put out an interesting quarterly newsletter and are active in lobbying the legislature. They don't harrass you for contributions, which is another reason I support them.


------------------
The New World Order has a Third Reich odor.
 
Gawd! If I or one of my relatives ever has
to sign such a piece of ****, I'll happily show them
our Swiss murder rates. At any rate, I'd just
ask these wanna-be peace activists wether they want to
face their mugger with bare hands or a gun.

And of course, getting robbed, raped and murdered
is a basic human right.

[This message has been edited by mussi (edited March 10, 2000).]
 
Oatka,

This is probably one of the most disturbing trends towards gun control - the programming of the children.

It's bad enough that some adults don't have common sense on this issue. Now we get to dole out our tax money to the government school system so they can brainwash our kids.

What will our country look like in 20 years? The answer depends on what we do about this type of mind control.

I will try to remain optimistic. Unfortunately, these kids will have to personally experience a situation where they, or a loved one, is unarmed and facing a violent criminal to realize that we aren't safe just because a politician passes a useless law.

Please update us on this one...

Thank You.

------------------
NRA/GOA/SAF/USMC

"Is your church BATF approved?"
 
Unbeleivable! The school system goes berserk over a kid's right to the 1st and 2nd ammendments and disregards a 6 year old stabbing a classmate with a pencil who later commits murder. Unfortunately I don't have any advice. The inmates are running the asylum.
 
If you have a promise of leagal support on this issue, I personally hope that you do not back down.
In the end, you have to make the decission as to what is best for your son and your family. I will alway regard you highly for even considering to stand for pinciple on this matter.
What you have told us about the actions of these school officials is clearly reprehensible. Their efforts will fail, maybe even back fire upon themselves. You cannot use any sort of psychological control or educational technique to make peoples act against their own interests. If this were possible, no authority, mighty or petty, would ever be overthrown.
These school officials, in this matter, are not tryng to give your son the mental tools we later recognize as the mark of a well educated person. They are using their postion to intimidate him, and probably your whole family as well. You are dealing with ideologs, not educators.

Pass this on to the parents if you can.

[This message has been edited by Herodotus (edited March 10, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Herodotus (edited March 11, 2000).]
 
If he was my son, I would remove him from that school and put him in a private school where he would not be brain washed or do home schooling.

I would also sue the school for violating his first and second ammendment rights .

You are in the right and the school is wrong .
A good fat law suit with a good first and second ammendment lawyer .

I would consult with the lawyer about brain washing by the school .

I am sure that there is a special legal term
for it, at the very least , a mal practice suit against the school.

Try contacting http://www.saf.org/
for pro-gun legal assistance.

This programing, propaganda ,brainwashing has gotten out of hand and gone too far.

The schools have just gotten too big for their briches and need an expensive law suit
award to put them in their proper place.

please keep us informed of the continuing outcome of this case as it occurs as I am very interested.

A CASE STUDY OF THE EFFECTIVENESS OF ARMED TEACHERS PREVENTING VIOLENCE IS AVAILABLE
FOR DOWNLOADING AT http://www.jpfo.org/

It is the history of the state of Isreal and how they armed their teachers to prevent
PLO terrorism in Jewish schools in 1972 and
has been 100 % completely sucessfull in preventing all school violence since its
inception.

------------------
GUN CONTROL puts THE CONTROL
in the hands of THE CRIMINALS.

--------------------------------
You all have my permision to
use any of these"signatures"
here, if you like!
---------------------------

-They call 'em POLUTE-TICIANS because they POLUTE the MINDS
of OUR CHILDERN with their ANTI civil/firearms RIGHTS SOCIALIST
political agendas. We of the older generations know B.S.
when we hear it.
-----------------------------------------------
In 2000, we must become politically active in
support of gun rights or we WILL LOSE the right
& the freedom.
-------------------------
NO FATE BUT WHAT WE MAKE!!!
----------------------
Every year,over 2 million Americans use firearms
not to take live but to preserve life,....limb & family
.Gun Control Democrats would prefer that they are all disarmed
and helpless and die victims of felony violence,instead.

Protect your gun rights, go to:
http://home.xnet.com/~gizmonic/TheMarch.html
and sign up as a helper or attendee or state organizer.
ernest2, Conn. CAN opp. "Do What You Can"!
http://thematrix.acmecity.com/digital/237/cansite/can.html
 
Oatka, too late now, I suppose, but this would be an interesting meeting for audio tape. Legal in your state?

How did things work out? This is a spooky story. Feels like we're in the USSR.
 
Whoa, sorry I gave you folks the wrong impression -- it wasn't me that was involved.
I just forwarded what I thought was the ultimate example in mind control.

Luckily my grandkids go to school in Utah where the teachers still talk of deer season, etc.

So far, I haven't gotten any more info on this, but I will try to keep on top of it.

It looks like the NRA will supply legal help, and, I suspect the school authorities will fold when presented with opposition and hard questions.

Apologies again for the misunderstanding.
 
At minimum, I'd say the student, and parents have a civil rights suit against the Comunity School System. Also, the school administrator might be looking at a suit for cruel and unusual punishment.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>As a result, my wife received a phone call at 9:00 PM Tuesday night in which we were informed that West Ottawa Public Schools feels it is necessary to separate my son from the other students and have him enter the "Mentor" program in which he would be put under the watchful eye of an adult to monitor his thought processes.
[/quote]

The student is being singled out, similar to a witchhunt. They(the school admin) have apparently made the decision that if he isn't for them, he's against them. They've drawn the line in the sand.

We've decided to allow ours to finish the year, then it's private from here on out.
Until we move to a different lattitude.

Best Regards,
Don

------------------
The most foolish mistake we could make would be to allow the subjected people to carry arms; history shows that all conquerers who have allowed their subjected people to carry arms have prepared their own fall.
Adolf Hitler
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jeff Thomas:
How did things work out? This is a spooky story. Feels like we're in the USSR.[/quote]

By the age of ten or so, I was old enough to learn from my father and realize that what the Soviet schools taught me was all BS. I think that parents can defeat the schools here...pity their own taxes support the enemy.
 
1. Sue the school.
2. Sue the Universities where the teachers learned to teach.
3. Sue the policy makers who formulated the policy.
4. Sue the NEA.
5. Sue (fill in the blank)

Get the kids out of there, or if that can't be done, continue to teach them about resistance to tyranny.

Then relax. The kid's alright.


------------------
ALARM! ALARM! CIVILIZATION IS IN PERIL! THE BARBARIANS HAVE TAKEN THE GATES!
 
Waiting patiently for any updates on this matter.This is the scariest thing I have heard of so far.Also heard some state legislator in Mich.wants some kind of minimum insurance liability requirement to be carried by Gun owners?
 
Reading the original post Ihad some very realistic flash backs to going to school under Ceausescu in the ever loving Socialist Republic of Romania. Good news was all of my family were graduates of public education and would by most standards be considered subversives. My family made sure to negate the political mumbo jumbo while we were all ensured of learning th 3R's quite well. Unfortunately in the USA the influence of the family on kids is becoming less and less. This was a lesson learned from the failures of Communism in not being able to separate the kids form the parents. Here we have both parents working cause the tax burder in high, cost of living is high... so the kids are better separated from the ideologies of the parents. My plan for when I have kids is to either homeschool them (wife is certified primary ed and I'm secondary ed) or if we cant afford that option to put them into a private school whose only concern is academics and are willing to leave life philosophy to me and my wife. Hope these still exist by the time my kids come and are ready for school.

------------------
If stupidity hurt, liberals would be walking around in agony.
 
Mr. X said, "Waiting patiently for any updates on this matter."

Not me! I'm waiting most IMpatiently for any updates on this matter. -- Denise
 
Found this at: http://www.shotgunsports.com/cgi-bin/webchat.cgi?category=Gunrights_Talk&num=10507&startnum=1

here are two letters sent to me from Mr. Loutzenhiser on the progress of his issue
Subject: got help - thanks
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 16:06:48 -0800
From: Tim Loutzenhiser
To: mcrgo@shelfspace.com
Just to keep everyone updated about our situation in the West Ottawa Public Schools: First I want to thank everyone on this list for the support and advice.
I am so very grateful (and humbled) to know there are people like you so willing to help out someone you have never met - I'm at a loss for words - my wife Shelly and I cannot thank you enough. We realized going into the meeting this morning that the other side outnumbered us (7 to 2). I decided to take the upper hand by making a point of shaking each person's hand, introducing myself, and being sure to make good eye contact. I then informed them that I would be taping the meeting - in part because the Rutherford Institute, the Second Amendment Foundation, and the NRA Institute for Legislative Action could not provide a representative on such short notice. My wife and I both saw a transformation from "smugness" turn to looks of great concern on some of their faces. Without going into great detail, we got right to the point and determined that the charges against my son are without merit. They all assured me that he is a wonderful student, gets straight A's, and because he is a little more advanced academically (at their suggestion he took the ACT test and scored very well) they feel he may need an "adult" to talk to about issues. If you don't understand the last sentence don't feel bad - we still have no idea of what they are getting at with this. We were able to determine that because my son knows and understands political and Constitutional issues so well, that he often speaks in terms not typical of a 12 year old - and we should be assured they have no issues with this. ? His Social Studies teacher seems to be the catalyst here because she felt concern when Derek stated (when she asked) that he would feel safer if some of the adults would be trained and have access to firearms at school. Because this teacher felt this irrational threat, she spoke to other "team" members who are also Derek's teachers. One teacher stated that he had heard Derek speak of taking the hunter's safety course (which took place at the school) and that he sometimes spoke about how he liked hunting. Another teacher said that in her class Derek helps write the school paper and he was tasked with reviewing a video game - she felt that the game might contain violence and so after talking with the "team" she felt concern. One of the vice principals felt that Derek may need some "mentoring" based on his being attacked by three older students last September, in which Derek fought back and deterred his attackers on school property. They wanted to re-enforce how understanding they were in light of the fact that the school has a zero tolerance policy - no fighting even in self defense - and how Derek was not punished in any way for defending himself. Give me a break! My wife did nail them on the fact that just yesterday she talked to some of these teachers and there were no issues yesterday, but they seemed to remember some today. Shelly also laid it on the line to them - she asked why in none of these instances they did not pick up the phone and call us? The answer was: we never thought about handling it that way! I asked for copies of the school procedure for the "team" and wanted to see the written policy. The principal, Jerry Klomparens told us there are no written rules or policies - yet. Anyway we were apologized to many times, they admitted they were in error, they admitted they really haven't established the ground rules for putting students on "the list". Very professional. It was so timely that I received an editorial form the Detroit News yesterday on this very topic - I read it to them all and left a copy with them. I also left information from the Rutherford Foundation along with the name and number of the legal council who is helping us out. Bottom line - we have been assured that it was all a "misunderstanding" and Derek will not be counseled, mentored, spoken to, or anything else without our express permission. I did indicate that the matter is not closed, and we will have discussions about and with Jill Perkins, the Social Studies teacher. I feel she has serious issues that she needs to get some counselling on - just my opinion. God help our children - and let's do what we can to battle this ignorance. Again, thanks to everyone. I will keep this list advised as this saga unfolds.

Tim, Shelly, and Derek Loutzenhiser
-----------------

Also interesting: "In wake of school shootings, officials must beware witch hunts"
By Larry Atkins - http://detnews.com/EDITPAGE/0003/09/1oped/1oped.htm

--Denise
 
From http://www.shotgunsports.com/cgi-bin/webchat.cgi?category=Gunrights_Talk&num=10596&startnum=1

Subject: Tim Loutzenhiser update...
Date: 03/15/00 Time: 7:17 AM EST
From: jscheid@parrett.net 206.30.252.183

Thanks for your concern. We have the situation under control for now. We have open lines of communication established, and have been assured that our son will not be "mentored", segregated, or counseled in any way without his and our permission. The situation looks much better now than it did a week ago tonight. We still have issues to discuss with the principal and team members, and I have indicated that I will be speaking to everyone, probably on an indivdual basis first and then I will address them as a group. To say there needs to be some "under- standing" is an understatement, but I intend to see that this never happens in this way to anyone else at Harbor Lights School, and just maybe we can help other schools to try to take a more level approach in identifying students that may need some understanding in their lives instead of a paranoid group of individuals creating alarm when simple communication between a teacher and parent could easily clear up a problem or just answer a question. I originally made only one request for advice to the Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners, where I have friends. It is totally amazing at how rapidly the news of this incident has gone all over the net, to radio stations, papers, etc. The show of support is so humbling, so gratifying, that I cannot possibly say thanks to everyone who has been willing to support us. Again, I say thanks - you are all considered to be our friends.

I received a call from the principal of the school Monday afternoon. He indicated that they were somewhat overwhelmed by all the calls, e-mails, and letters that are coming in from all over the U.S.! He wanted to be sure things were still open for dialog and made it clear that they will listen to us if and when we decide we will have the follow-up discussions. I really want this to be a learning process so that they will know there are lots of us out here and our thinking is not to be called "not normal". I also told him that I did not launch any letter writing campaigns, but that it is gratifying to know that all this support is out here. I have come to realize in the past week that we have a weapon at our disposal that no can stop - and that weapon is education. We have to work to insure that all schools realize the harm that can be done by fear. Feel free to post. Thanks.

Tim Loutzenhiser
 
The problem is that the Loutzenhiser kid is more of an adult than his teachers.

I swear the lunatics have taken over the asylum.

------------------
ALARM! ALARM! CIVILIZATION IS IN PERIL! THE BARBARIANS HAVE TAKEN THE GATES!

[This message has been edited by Munro Williams (edited March 17, 2000).]
 
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