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mexico wants to sue gun manufactures
- Thread starter scud
- Start date
aarondhgraham
New member
What does the Mexican President have on Obama,,,
For 10 minutes I've been trying to type a cogent response to this,,,
I can't come up with a reasonable response to such an inane situation.
It infuriates me is all I can really say.
Our elected representatives should be slapped for allowing this nonsense to happen.
Aarond
For 10 minutes I've been trying to type a cogent response to this,,,
I can't come up with a reasonable response to such an inane situation.
It infuriates me is all I can really say.
Our elected representatives should be slapped for allowing this nonsense to happen.
Aarond
Bartholomew Roberts
Moderator
Hmmm, call me cynical but that looks more like someone laundering money to me than it does an actual lawsuit.
I can't help but be reminded of the process by which the city of Chicago operates where the city litigates suits that they know they will lose (like the current SAF effort on ranges). The city pays "friendly" law firms with hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars to defend against these suits and argue that there is nothing infringing about requiring people to have range training to own a firearm and then outlawing all ranges in the city.
It would be interesting to see how much of those tax payer dollars are later converted into campaign donations to local politicians by the partners or law firms in question.
So here we have the Mexican government paying their taxpayer's dollars to pursue a lawsuit in the United States with little chance of success - and the firm they picked to do it just happens to have recently had one of their partners nominated to the federal bench by President Obama.
Maybe its just coincidence; but it seems to resemble the Chicago way in several particulars.
I can't help but be reminded of the process by which the city of Chicago operates where the city litigates suits that they know they will lose (like the current SAF effort on ranges). The city pays "friendly" law firms with hundreds of thousands of taxpayer dollars to defend against these suits and argue that there is nothing infringing about requiring people to have range training to own a firearm and then outlawing all ranges in the city.
It would be interesting to see how much of those tax payer dollars are later converted into campaign donations to local politicians by the partners or law firms in question.
So here we have the Mexican government paying their taxpayer's dollars to pursue a lawsuit in the United States with little chance of success - and the firm they picked to do it just happens to have recently had one of their partners nominated to the federal bench by President Obama.
Maybe its just coincidence; but it seems to resemble the Chicago way in several particulars.
Even more suspicious:
Did you notice the actual dates mentioned in the article were back in November?
When I saw this last night I started wondering if the Obama administration called Mexico and said, "Hey, can you do something to distract people a little bit from this ATF fiasco?"
Then Mexican "sources" get on the horn to CBS and start yakking about evil gun manufacturers and how Mexico's gun crime problem is all the manufacturer's fault, and "oh by the way did you notice we're suing those evil greedy capitalist merchants of death?"
I already complained to the "CBS News Investigates" email address (investigates @ cbsnews.com) that running a story like that, with no mention of Project Gunrunner, was irresponsible.
Did you notice the actual dates mentioned in the article were back in November?
When I saw this last night I started wondering if the Obama administration called Mexico and said, "Hey, can you do something to distract people a little bit from this ATF fiasco?"
Then Mexican "sources" get on the horn to CBS and start yakking about evil gun manufacturers and how Mexico's gun crime problem is all the manufacturer's fault, and "oh by the way did you notice we're suing those evil greedy capitalist merchants of death?"
I already complained to the "CBS News Investigates" email address (investigates @ cbsnews.com) that running a story like that, with no mention of Project Gunrunner, was irresponsible.
The ones that come in by the shp load from China can't be tracked so they aren't problem. Let him sue us and we start charging him for costs for handling the "undocumented " immigrants. Shake your little stick and threaten us you little pipsqueak, we are still bigger than you. You send more drugs up here than we send guns down there. Color me worried.On November 5, 2010 President Felipe Calderon expressed his frustration to CBS News correspondent Peter Greenberg: "We seized more than 90,000 weapons...I am talking like 50,000 assault weapons, AR-15 machine guns, more than 8,000 grenades and almost 10 million bullets. Amazing figures and according to all those cases, the ones we are able to track, most of these are American weapons."
Or maybe not.
"We seized more than 90,000 weapons...I am talking like 50,000 assault weapons, AR-15 machine guns, more than 8,000 grenades and almost 10 million bullets.
I wonder how many American think, because of comments like this, that you can walk into a Cabelas and buy grenades.
I also love that an AR-15 is a machine gun.
The amount of ignorance spewed about weapons just sickens me.
The numbers that Calderon throws out are hard to believe. 10 million rounds of ammo? That's a crap pot load of Winchester white box or whatever brand of ammo flowing south. No wonder we had an ammo shortage. 50,000 AR-15's?
This sounds like military aid that got hi-jacked somewhere along the line.
This sounds like military aid that got hi-jacked somewhere along the line.
TeamSinglestack
New member
Maybe they should sue the ATF, if they want to be taken seriously, and avoid the appearance of filing a fivolous lawsuit.
That's the thought that came to my mind, however, since any legal defense will come out of OUR tax dollars, my opinion is that Mexico can basically pound sand.
Bart, is this what you were talking about:
The Law Firm, Reid Collins & Tsai was contracted on or about Nov. 5, 2010, By Pres. Calderon. A (major) partner, Marina G. Marmolejo, was first nominated to a federal judgeship (So. Dist. of Texas) on July 28, 2010. Her name (along with scads of others) was returned at the close of the 111th Congressional session. She was renominated on Jan. 5, 2011, for the same District Judgeship. Currently pending.
The law firm has two offices. Besides the NYC office, they are also located in Austin, TX.
The Law Firm, Reid Collins & Tsai was contracted on or about Nov. 5, 2010, By Pres. Calderon. A (major) partner, Marina G. Marmolejo, was first nominated to a federal judgeship (So. Dist. of Texas) on July 28, 2010. Her name (along with scads of others) was returned at the close of the 111th Congressional session. She was renominated on Jan. 5, 2011, for the same District Judgeship. Currently pending.
The law firm has two offices. Besides the NYC office, they are also located in Austin, TX.
I would love to hear their briefs about their specific cause of action as well as what gives them standing in a U.S. court against U.S. manufacturers that don't sell firearms in Mexico. Their grievance, if they actually had a valid one, SHOULD be against the U.S. government for failing to control its borders and for running Gunwalker. But that isn't the agenda here, now is it?
Bartholomew Roberts
Moderator
Yes, that is the firm handling this case.
Actually Mexicans are able to buy legal firearms in Mexico. The Army runs the business. How may of these legally sold firearms are being used for crimes?
If you do some digging you will see that the actual statement should be that 90% of the "traced" firearms originate from the United States. what percentage of the firearms that have been confiscated have been traced by the Mexican authorities?
There lies the meat of the case. The ATF or FBI have only what the Mexican authorities have told them. They can only Trace guns that came from the United States.
If the case came to court one would hope that the firearm companies and the NRA would question the evidence of the Mexican Government and the truth about the actual number of U.S. firearms used in crime below the border would come out.
Also I believe the ATF has investigated about 2000 gun deals along the border. The reuslts have yielded no criminal charges and only tow revocations of the FFL.
This lawsuit could be a good thing for the firearms industry and gun owners and shine some light on the truth.
some more on the case:
http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-...s-react-to-threatened-mexico-industry-lawsuit
So I would say to the Mexican Government..bring it.
If you do some digging you will see that the actual statement should be that 90% of the "traced" firearms originate from the United States. what percentage of the firearms that have been confiscated have been traced by the Mexican authorities?
There lies the meat of the case. The ATF or FBI have only what the Mexican authorities have told them. They can only Trace guns that came from the United States.
If the case came to court one would hope that the firearm companies and the NRA would question the evidence of the Mexican Government and the truth about the actual number of U.S. firearms used in crime below the border would come out.
Also I believe the ATF has investigated about 2000 gun deals along the border. The reuslts have yielded no criminal charges and only tow revocations of the FFL.
This lawsuit could be a good thing for the firearms industry and gun owners and shine some light on the truth.
some more on the case:
http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-...s-react-to-threatened-mexico-industry-lawsuit
So I would say to the Mexican Government..bring it.
Last edited:
Doc Intrepid
New member
Take 3 deep breaths...
According to the NRA-ILA, the chances of this lawsuit going anywhere are between Slim and None, and Slim left town.
According to NRA-ILA Grassroots Alert Vol 18, No. 16, 4/22/2011 --
"This report describes Mexico's actions as a "novel approach," in reality, such lawsuits have been used for decades as a tactic by anti-gun groups and governments in their attempts to bankrupt gun manufacturers and circumvent the political process.
That's why Congress passed the "Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act" in 2005. This act protects firearms manufacturers, distributors, dealers and importers from suits brought about as a result of "the harm solely caused by the criminal or unlawful misuse of firearm products or ammunition products by others when the product functioned as designed and intended." The outlook for a Mexican government suit looks dim; since the PLCAA was signed into law by President George W. Bush on Oct. 26, 2005, no federal court has allowed such a suit by a government plaintiff to go forward against a U.S. firearms manufacturer." (emphasis added)
http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=6674
While the NRA could certainly be accused of being biased in this matter, they continue to produce evidence that - while certainly a percentage of weapons used by gangs in Mexico come from the US - a much larger percentage is comprised of military grade hardware (grenade launchers, etc.) coming into Mexico from Central and South America:
http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=6577
According to the NRA-ILA, the chances of this lawsuit going anywhere are between Slim and None, and Slim left town.
According to NRA-ILA Grassroots Alert Vol 18, No. 16, 4/22/2011 --
"This report describes Mexico's actions as a "novel approach," in reality, such lawsuits have been used for decades as a tactic by anti-gun groups and governments in their attempts to bankrupt gun manufacturers and circumvent the political process.
That's why Congress passed the "Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act" in 2005. This act protects firearms manufacturers, distributors, dealers and importers from suits brought about as a result of "the harm solely caused by the criminal or unlawful misuse of firearm products or ammunition products by others when the product functioned as designed and intended." The outlook for a Mexican government suit looks dim; since the PLCAA was signed into law by President George W. Bush on Oct. 26, 2005, no federal court has allowed such a suit by a government plaintiff to go forward against a U.S. firearms manufacturer." (emphasis added)
http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=6674
While the NRA could certainly be accused of being biased in this matter, they continue to produce evidence that - while certainly a percentage of weapons used by gangs in Mexico come from the US - a much larger percentage is comprised of military grade hardware (grenade launchers, etc.) coming into Mexico from Central and South America:
http://www.nraila.org/Legislation/Federal/Read.aspx?id=6577