Methodists after us now!

M

mcshot

New member
Check out the news from WND (Drudge Report) regarding the Methodists vote to ban ownerhips and possession of guns. The ignorant are marching again.
Sorry bout the referral as my attempt to transfer the link was unsuccessful.

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"Keep shootin till they quit floppin"
The Wife 2/2000
 
The United Methodist Church has been after us a long time, but this is about their latest antics...


May 9, 2000 GC-046

General Conference calls for ban on handguns, other weapons

CLEVELAND (UMNS) – The United Methodist Church adopted a resolution calling for a ban
on a wide range of weapons, including handguns, on May 9.

The inclusion of handguns in the ban made the resolution one of the most debated pieces of
legislation voted on by the delegates to the 2000 General Conference. The 992 delegates are
meeting through May 12 to enact legislation and policy statements for the United Methodist
Church, which has 9.6 million members worldwide.

Delegates voted 724 to 205 in favor of the statement on weapons, which will be included in the
church’s Book of Resolutions. Before adopting it, delegates rejected a proposal to remove
handguns from the list of weapons that the church would like barred from private ownership.

The attempt to remove handguns from the list prompted several delegates to voice concerns on
both sides of the issue.

Comments in favor of taking handguns off the list centered on defense of self, home and family.

"If someone breaks into my home in the middle of the night to do bodily harm to myself or my
wife, I can’t pull out the Book of Resolutions and say, ‘Wait a minute, I’m a United Methodist.
I’ve got a position on this,’ " said the Rev. Scott Kelso of Pataskala, Ohio.

Other delegates, who wanted handguns included in the list, cited the high levels of gun violence
and the frequency of accidental shootings among children.

"If we’re really the disciples of the Prince of Peace, shouldn’t we speak against guns? Guns are
destroying our society," said Jeremiah Thompson, a student from Kankakee, Ill. "They’re
destroying my generation. They’re destroying future generations."

The Rev. Beverly Wilkes of Springfield, Ill., rose to say that handguns should be included in the
ban because they are a cause of accidental deaths of many children. "We are calling for America
to disarm itself for the sake of our children and for the sake of too many others who died too
soon." She urged leaving policing to the professionals and limiting private gun ownership to those
who hunt.

Delegates approved a proposal to modify the resolution by directing it to the U.S. government
and to the governments of other countries where the United Methodist Church is present.

The full resolution calls for governments to outlaw "ownership by the general public of handguns,
assault weapons, automatic weapon conversion kits and weapons that cannot be detected by
traditionally used metal-detection devices."

During the same morning session, delegates rejected a proposal for eliminating the
denomination’s Board of Church and Society, the agency that works on social issues such as gun
control. Almost 70 percent of the delegates refused to abolish the organization after a discussion.

One delegate said he wanted the board eliminated because it voices positions with which he does
not agree. He cited the board’s stance against the Boy Scouts’ ban of gays and its involvement in
setting up a fund to pay a lawyer for Elian Gonzalez’ father. Another delegate responded that
people must get the full story about such issues before they condemn the board.

# # #

-- Joretta Purdue



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http://second.amendment.homepage.com
 
For at least 25 years. And don't forget the Presbyterians. The National Coalition to Ban Handguns was formed from these twits.

Rick
 
Gentlemen, thank you for tipping me off. Stand back and let a UMC member for 15 years who supports the heck out of his local church go after them. Thanks for the web site I am going to carefully give them a piece of my mind. I read an article yesterday about a bunch of hystericals headed to the MMM but didn't know this was going on. Guess it's time for a new reformation.
 
Boys you got the address wrong. The main address is http://www.umc.org PLEASE SEND NICE MAIL BUT ENLIGHTEN THEM. After I get through writing at their main site I am going back to ask jeeves, there were several other addresses for the main group. I will also be preparing a very carefully worded "educational" farewell letter or speach (If my preacher will allow it)that will let them know I will not be associated with a group that acts before they check the facts. Here goes that Scotch/Irish bloodpressure!!!!!!!!!!
 
sumabich:
When you get your letter written, would you mind posting it here on TFL? I would like to read it.


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It is the people who are prisoners of their own ignorance about firearms that pose the greatest threat to our 2nd Amendment Rights.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Matt19:
sumabich:
When you get your letter written, would you mind posting it here on TFL? I would like to read it.
Matt, I will be happy to but I can't figure out how to do it I would love for everyone to see it but tonight I'm the "stupid sumabich"! If nothing else I will be happy to send word attachments to all that want but you guys can probably tell me how to either send the e-mail or as a saved document. I am using Microsoft.

[/quote]
 
Matt and anyone else, if you can't tell me how to post e-mail me directly and I will send a copy of my letter to you. kbagby@connectu.net
 
Tomorrow's probably going to be a rough day for me. I'm 46, was born into a Methodist family, and my ancestors (on both sides of my family) were Methodists as far back as I can trace their denominational affiliation. My great-great-grandfather built the church where I was raised.

Yet tomorrow I plan to tell our pastor that this week's action at the general conference means I can no longer in good conscience belong to the United Methodist Church. The church has not only taken a stand on a political and non-spiritual issue, which I believe to be a mistake in itself, but it has also taken the wrong side in that issue (gun bans). The denomination in which I was raised now intends to use money I contribute to sponsor indoctrination classes that tell my children that guns are wrong. Sorry, but that's it.

[This message has been edited by David Roberson (edited May 13, 2000).]
 
Sumabich, Open your letter in whatever format you typed it in like Word, Wordpad Notepad etc. Highlight the text you want to copy and right click on the highlighted text, select copy and open your browser top TFL hit add reply and right click in the body area (where you type your reply) and hit paste your letter should appear there. If you can't get it to work e-mail it to me and I will post it for you if you like, hope this works for you..............


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...“ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” --Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759.

Whereas, to preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them; nor does it follow from this, that all promiscuously must go into actual service on every occasion. The mind that aims at a select militia, must be influenced by a truly anti-republican principle; and when we see many men disposed to practice upon it, whenever they can prevail, no wonder true republicans are for carefully guarding against it.
---Richard Henry Lee, The Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788

Take care and God Bless, El Jefe

The ANTI-HCI Site!
 
David,

Some Methodist churches are not part of the UMC. For goodness sake, make sure that you find out if yours is or not first before you talk to your pastor. It sounds like you know what you are doing, and I agree with it, just please double check everything.

Joe

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http://second.amendment.homepage.com
 
Need to watch the "Presbyterians" thing, there is 2 denomination's of pres.. I would think the the USA denom. is the one that would have started it. I grew up pres. and wasnt aware that there was 2 denom. untill I started looking for schools to play ball at.

just a FYI and not a flame
 
As Sumabich is having difficulty posting his letter I told him I would help out if he sent it to me here it is in its entirety:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Dear Sirs, I am a member of Lafayette Street UMC in Shelby N.C. My family is as well, and we are active members. I just read that the General Conference has decided to become a political power on social issues and I thought I would write to you and tell you what I think of that action. First, the committee that decides social issues should check their facts before committing the membership. In the case of sending money to little Elian's (?) father. I find that absurd! Our tax dollars are already doing that. Who do you think is paying for his vacation at the estate and the "schoolmates" of Elian's as well as the round the clock security. The US taxpayer. Why is the church involved in the affairs of the state? Did you know that Elian's parents were legally separated in 1991, and that he was born in 1993? Did you know that the family in Miami had legal custody of the boy as granted by the 11th district court (the same court that turned Janet Reno down when she tried to circumvent the order. She went to a lowly magistrate to get a search warrant which is typically given to search for things not people. The INS does use it when it suspects that illegal aliens may be hiding somewhere. It is hard to argue that Elian was hiding with every major news agency at the front door! The second issue is again, why is the church meddling in the affairs of the state.Once again I must tell the "social committee" to check the facts! The call to ban guns in any way shape or form is a violation of the second amendment says "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed". If the committee took the time to check the writings of our founding fathers they would clearly understand the intent of this article. Jefferson, Madison, and Franklin all stated that the intent was to keep the Government honest, because if it became corrupt the people could rise up and bring it down. They also stressed the duty of every citizen to participate in keeping the law, in fact they said it was a responsibility. Ask the millions of dead Jews under Hitler's control after he banned private ownership of weapons. At present, violent crime is higher in England after the gun ban. Why. because honest law-abiding citizens were no longer in a position to protect themselves. In our own country, states that have passed concealed carry permits for it's citizens have seen a significant decline in violent crime (Dr. John Lott). Why, because those citizens can protect themselves.Since Clinton (a wonderful Christian role model for us all) came to power we have been inundated with a steady attack on our individual rights and has controlled the mainstream press. It appears that 724 members of the UMC General Conference prefers to believe this mans lies(in case you forgot "I did not have sex with that woman). One is that there is a high rate of accidental children killed. There is more than I would like to see, but his statistics include the shootings of 18-19 year olds that he considers children. That group has a significantly high gun mortality rate because a significant part of those deaths are gang-related. Did you know that in the last 10 years more children have died from airbags in cars than in school shootings? Is the Board of Church and Society going to recommend a strong UMC stance on airbags? At present the MMM is a 501(c)3 private non profit. According to IRS regulations a 501(c)3 is prohibited from political activity yet their web site speaks volumes about their political agenda. Oh, wait I forgot isn't a church considered a 501(c)3? If so I again ask, "What is the church doing meddling in the affairs of the state"? Let me give you some facts that the mainstream press has ignored by the MMM and Ms. Donna Dees-Thomases. The New York Times noted a week ago that she was on leave from her job as a part-time publicist for CBS. Before
that she was Dan Rathers publicist. She is also the sister in law of Susan Thomases, best friend of Hillary Clinton and long time advisor to the first lady.Yet she claims to be a simple New Jersey housewife. I don't think so, yet so many of us don't take the time to check the facts before acting.
I have watched Bill Clinton manipulate the press and our country for the past 8 years. I have to agree with Charlton Heston that he is prepared to accept a certain amount of children's deaths to further his own political agenda. Likewise, he is a liar! In most of the cases of gun violence and children the root of the cause is dysfunctional families and parents who are not and do not teach responsibility to their children. The add "knowledge is power is true. My wife and I both possess concealed carry permits and have taught our children to be responsible and knowledgeable in the use of firearms, we have also taught them how to disarm an armed attacker. We did this after reading about the wrestling student, who because of his knowledge of firearms knew the "crazy" student was out of bullets when he heard the click, knew to attack then and saved many students lives.Why didn't the General Conference take a strong stand on strengthening families and do something about the real cause? No, they took the easy way out just like most who do not take the time to check the facts and blamed it on an inanimate object! Shame on you. For the past eight years my church family has helped me keep the faith and live a Christian life in spite of a corrupt Government and a society that glorifies drug abusing, murdering, alternative lifestyles and persons whose only contributions to this society is their ability to stick a ball into a net are modeled as role models for our children. Now I don't even have that to fall back on. I love every member of my local church but I cannot in good conscience, continue to belong to any group that infringes on my individual rights as a Citizen of the United States. For that reason I am renouncing my membership in the United Methodist Church and will urge others to follow until such time as the General Conference sees fit to disband the Board of Church and Society is disbanded and the UMC stops mixing it's affairs with our government.
Luke 22:36 Jesus said to them, " But now, if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one
Timothy 2:1 You then, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus and the things you have heard me say in the presence of many witnesses entrust to reliable men who will also be qualified to teach others. Endure hardship with us like a good soldier of Christ Jesus.No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs-he wants to pleas his commanding officer.
SHAME ON YOU! [/quote]

Wow I am stunned...........let me know if I can be of any more assistance.


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...“ They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.” --Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759.

Whereas, to preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them; nor does it follow from this, that all promiscuously must go into actual service on every occasion. The mind that aims at a select militia, must be influenced by a truly anti-republican principle; and when we see many men disposed to practice upon it, whenever they can prevail, no wonder true republicans are for carefully guarding against it.
---Richard Henry Lee, The Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788

Take care and God Bless, El Jefe

The ANTI-HCI Site!

[This message has been edited by El Jefe (edited May 14, 2000).]
 
The Presbyterian church has many sub-denominations. PC USA is the liberal one -- they are pro-choice as well. I would imagine that the conservative divisions such as PCA, UPC, and EPC would take a different stand on gun-control. I will be looking into this though just to make sure.


Hueco
 
Sumabich has done a brave thing. As a lifelong Methodist, I can imagine that this has not been easy for him.

My wife and I had a talk with our pastor this morning about the dreadful thing our church did this week. His response was unencouraging. I had thought that perhaps he might urge us to oppose this and try to turn it around at the next general conference, but he didn't. He in fact said that if he could, he would vote to ban all guns and all alcoholic beverages.

We did not formally submit our resignation today, but we're leaving the United Methodist Church. In the next few weeks I plan to have a number of conversations with other Methodists about the reasons why.
 
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