March for our lives too ?

[L2R]

So why are we not aligning ourselves with the March to live ideology?
The media has made us the enemy and what little we do, we defend our side as if we are the enemy further demonstrating that we are in the way.


The media paints us as:
bloodthirsty
uneducated
prefer our black toys on the week end to children's lives
They are fighting the NRA

So are we going to allow them to continue branding us or re-brand us for what we are:
as concerned for children's lives as anyone is, maybe more
interested in self-defense against violence
educated
interested in protecting all the constitution not just the 2nd A.

Kids are being brainwashed. Their idols, hollywood and sports teams are helping.
We must do more than stand by or rally a march that looks like we are a part of the problem.

 

[jdc1244]

Attacking and seeking to vilify the student marchers is a failed strategy.

The students are not being ‘brainwashed’ – they are not ‘dupes’ of Democrats/liberals, nor are they ‘crisis actors’; to make such claims is a failed strategy.

Blaming ‘the media’ is a failed strategy.

Accusing the students of being ‘against’ the Second Amendment is a failed strategy.

And if one wishes to protect the Constitution and Second Amendment he must acknowledge the fact the measures the students advocate for are perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence, and in no manner un-Constitutional.

The best course of action is to stop doing the above.

 

[zukiphile]

I wouldn't say that the children involved are being brainwashed. Isn't it normal for kids to take cues from authority figures? If their authority figures, film personalities, sports figures, teachers and parents, are taking lots of nonsense, is that the fault of the children?

Attacking and seeking to vilify the student marchers is a failed strategy.

I agree. Kids can be wrong or manipulated, but that doesn't make them villains. It makes them children.

The students are not being ‘brainwashed’ – they are not ‘dupes’ of Democrats/liberals, nor are they ‘crisis actors’; to make such claims is a failed strategy.

Emphasis added. I don't think you know that.

Supposing that children spring forth spontaneously speaking the gun control agenda of the last couple of decades doesn't speak to a process that arises organically from their own understanding of the event.

Blaming ‘the media’ is a failed strategy.

I disagree. Where people purport to merely report events, but also shape the events themselves or are advocates for a result on an issue, it's appropriate and productive to make this more widely known.

And if one wishes to protect the Constitution and Second Amendment he must acknowledge the fact the measures the students advocate for are perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence, and in no manner un-Constitutional.

That is incorrect. Where someone pushes for bans on the most commonly held arms and wants psychological testing prior to issuance of a license for any arms whatsoever, they present constitutionally problematic policy goals.

 

[Crankgrinder]

What then, would one suggest to do concerning the propaganda campaign being waged against gun owners? be re writing of laws by interpretation? I do not find their proposals consistent with the constitution and here's why. Theyve raised the age to buy virtually ANY firearm from 18 to 21 the right to own firearms is codified in the bill of rights so is voting. the right to buy and consume alcohol is not. It cannot be regulated the same way. Might as well change the voting age to 21 as well, you can't have it both ways you're either an adult at xx years of age or you're not. Those kids will find out about that one the hard way. Second, the constitution doesn't grant citizens rights of is supposed to protect rights that existed to man since before there was any government and as such, those rights should exist, without government restriction, as though no government does exist. Yes we have laws that are in violation of this but most laws are violations of human rights anyway. Laws are edicts agreed upon by politicians backed by the threat of force funded by your own paycheck is what it is. I find myself in disagreement with many here because I don't need a piece of parchment to tell me who has the greatest say so over my life, property and civil liberties a piece of parchment no less that also contains the 4 th amendment that failed to stop the passage of the patriot act and failed stop the TSA from radiating and molesting travelers on a daily basis in the name of "safety". Are we selling liberties in exchange for "safety" ? Or are people deluded for believing that their safety should be guaranteed?

 

[rickyrick]

Most of us can’t afford the repercussions of marching against gun control advocates. We want to keep or jobs, we don’t want our tires flattened, we don’t want our property set on fire.

I’ve heard multiple recordings of hours long political rants by school teachers. There’s a propaganda machine in motion for sure.

The saddest part of all, I know this will happen again. Until the schools are secured this will repeat. It is clear that securing the schools is not possible and most localities won’t want to pay for it... too many people would have to give up thier catered luncheons.

 

[JN01]

Attacking and seeking to vilify the student marchers is a failed strategy.

The students are not being ‘brainwashed’ – they are not ‘dupes’ of Democrats/liberals, nor are they ‘crisis actors’; to make such claims is a failed strategy.

Blaming ‘the media’ is a failed strategy.

Accusing the students of being ‘against’ the Second Amendment is a failed strategy.

And if one wishes to protect the Constitution and Second Amendment he must acknowledge the fact the measures the students advocate for are perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence, and in no manner un-Constitutional.

The best course of action is to stop doing the above.

In the past few weeks, David Hogg and his classmates have been made the de facto spokesmen for the gun control movement. The usual suspects have been largely absent from the debate. The argument for gun control has always been based on emotion rather than logic, but in this instance I do believe that the "grown ups" are counting on the kids to have more of an impact. I don't know that there was ever an organized plan to do so but I believe they are doing all they can to capitalize on it.

David Hogg in particular has shown himself to be arrogant, rude, often profane, and for the most part, ignorant of the subject he is protesting about. Not unusual for a teenager.

The mystery is why are adults considering policy decisions based on these emotional rantings?

I know that gun control is acceptable in the world view of most in the media, but if they claim to be journalists, how can they allow all of the blatant mis-statements by these kids to go unchallenged? If they do not, someone needs to.

Ignoring all the above and surrendering to those who want to gut the 2nd Amendment is a failed strategy.

 

[tony pasley]

These young adults are hurt, scared and screaming out. They have been used by antigun groups to further their agenda. The best way I know is to ask would theses new laws work any better than the laws already on the books that were not enforced. The Parkland shooting blame falls squarely on the school, local law enforcement and FBI not doing their job properly. The Sugarland church shooting the DOD failed to report to NICS most of the shooting in the last couple of years law enforcement has been involved with the shooter but not followed through with. Pointing this out will not change the minds of those ruled by emotion but you can get to those who are willing to think before acting.
The next step is to show how passing new laws on emotional response to something, like to save young adults lives raising the driver age to 18 or 21 because of all the deaths caused by drivers under those ages as a example.

 

[riffraff]

The whole thing really irks me.

When I was in public school (90's basically) we were taught the US is a free place, better than everybody else, and about the protections and freedom guaranteed by the constitution - gun control included.

If one believes those sorts of things it's hard to support much for gun control and one would certainly not be so opposed to 2A as we see with these students; one would certainly not be so critical of us as a nation. It seems like such things are probably not being taught or maybe even worse are being taught the way parts of our history like slavery are taught.

It's also very hard for me to understand how a teenager would ever ask for freedoms to be removed. All we ever wanted as teenagers was more freedom. I find it very odd.

Mind you we don't really know what percentage of students strongly feel this way, and I cannot imagine any fair survey exists on the subject (on either side).. We just know a large number are marching around crying about it, who I too believe are propped up by those with $$ and such an agenda. I'm not discounting that this all is a huge concern, just saying that such beliefs may not be as widespread as it looks.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

The students are not being ‘brainwashed’ – they are not ‘dupes’ of Democrats/liberals, nor are they ‘crisis actors’; to make such claims is a failed strategy.

High school students don't front multi-million dollar media blitzes without considerable assistance from professional media manipulators. These are 17-19yr olds (a 19yr old senior, that's right) who have gone through a very scary and traumatic event. I'm sure their feelings are genuine; but the idea that they aren't being manipulated is just the most incredibly naive thing I've read today - and I read internet gun boards regularly!

And if one wishes to protect the Constitution and Second Amendment he must acknowledge the fact the measures the students advocate for are perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence, and in no manner un-Constitutional.

In 2006, it was perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence that you had no right to firearms whatsoever and we can take them all away any time we like for any reason. In fact, all but two of the circuit courts had reached variations on that conclusion. As it turns out, that's no longer current Second Amendment jurisprudence. More importantly, it was wrong then, and wrong now - just as many of the ideas being pushed now are bad ideas.

We must do more than stand by or rally a march that looks like we are a part of the problem.

Just because the media doesn't show it to you, doesn't mean it isn't happening. Turn off the TV, grab some people who have never been shooting and go have some good, safe fun. It is much more effective and much less stressful.

 

[Mike38]

Kids are being brainwashed. Their idols, hollywood and sports teams are helping.

That started 20+ years ago. It's just now taking hold. Unfortunately, it's at the point of being nonreversible.

 

[gwpercle]

It wasn't that long ago in Louisiana that the legal voting age was 21. I voted in my first election after I turned 21 after registering to vote. Soon after that I was called for jury duty because you had to be 21 to serve on a jury and they used the voter registration rolls to get names for the juries.
I turned 21 in 1970. I believe in 1971 Richard Nixon signed the bill that changed the law to 18....I might be off on that .
I bought my first handgun at that time also, had to be 21 for that too .

Sadly the young people will be voting soon and they don't realize how they are setting themselves up for domination. The first step in taking over a nation is to disarm the people. I'm sure how Adolf Hitler did this to certain groups of German's has not been taught.
To enslave a man he must be kept unarmed , armed men can and will fight for their freedom.
Gary

 

[BBarn]

A student recently wrote the following:

“Ban semi-automatic weapons that fire high-velocity rounds

Civilians shouldn’t have access to the same weapons that soldiers do. That’s a gross misuse of the second amendment.”

I'm not sure that is a result of being “brainwashed”, but that student didn't get that idea from reading the 2nd Amendment, the history behind it, or from an accurate source on the type of firearms most gun owners own. They have heard it or been taught it by someone else, and they believe it.

Turn off the TV, grab some people who have never been shooting and go have some good, safe fun. It is much more effective and much less stressful.

I too believe the above is one of the most effective approaches with those unfamiliar with firearms.

 

[jrinne0430]

These kids are being manipulated. The march was financed by Hollywood, Soros, and numerous Corporations. For example; a bus company donated their buses, hotels donated their rooms, Clooney (and others) donated over $500k, the women’s march provided much of the prep support, and it also appears they received professional speech writing/preparation, industrial type banners and signs, a cheering media, etc. In addition, Citi bank has started restricting card use for firearms, YouTube is to ban gun related vids, Twitter removing the opposition's accounts, media covering only the anti’s position, Dicks, insurance companies, etc., etc..

The left is successfully controlling the narrative that is energizing their base (which is very motivated), convincing those on the fence that gun control is needed and numerous corps are either financing them or jumping on board. Any opposing view is immediately shamed and silenced as hate speech or “supporting the killing of children".

I'm with the original poster...what are we do?

 

[zukiphile]

Protest marching doesn't seem to be as much a part of 2d Am. culture as it is for some other movements. Maybe marches only matter if media outlets make a big to do about them.

I'm with the original poster...what are we do?

Maybe what you are already doing. If you pester your senators and congressmen directly, that should help. If you are a gracious host and mentor to those who are curious about shooting, that helps the culture and the culture shapes the legislative response to these issues.

If you respond to poor arguments about the right calmly and quietly, you may undermine the sense that you can't be trusted with a right.


It may be frustrating to see a contrary position make a lot of noise and get lots of air time, but that isn't the only way to be effective.

 

[Crankgrinder]

Political demonstration marches are not always effective either. After trumps election they marched rioted, burned things, didnt do all that much good. There were demonstrations at Berkeley and Charlottesville, did no good, for anybody. Woodstock did not end the war.

 

[LogicMan]

And if one wishes to protect the Constitution and Second Amendment he must acknowledge the fact the measures the students advocate for are perfectly consistent with current Second Amendment jurisprudence, and in no manner un-Constitutional.

The measures they are calling for are blatantly un-Constitutional, and the ones that maybe would not be are still a straight path to heavy infringement.

 

[jrinne0430]

FL just passed a law so that 18yr olds cannot buy firearms, three day waiting period, and others. The fed budget that was just signed by Trump added the NICS Fix and Trump’s admins just banned bump stocks. These are significant gun control measures! No matter how you look at it, we have some big problems on our hands and it’s going to take more than to pester our elected officials (some of them already betrayed us). We will lose this fight if we stay idle.

 

[L2R]

Maybe brainwashing is too strong a word, maybe it isn't.

The point is that they are carrying signs that say they are against the NRA. How did that happen? And how did we become the villains? We should be supporting them but suggesting a different solution to the problem we all want to fix?

By standing quietly on the sidelines, we give credit to those who tell them we are the enemy.

 

[LogicMan]

Just because these gun controllers are getting all this air time and marching doesn't mean there isn't a silent army that leans the opposite way. No different than with the massive Trump protests when he was elected. The silent army spoke in that he was elected.

 

[LogicMan]

By standing quietly on the sidelines, we give credit to those who tell them we are the enemy.

Don't be silent to your Congressmen and Senators, state-level and federal-level. Most gun rights people work and don't have the time or resources to be organizing big marches. Perhaps if we could rely on Hollywood, the media, billionaires like Bloomberg, big corporations, if the businesses we work for were willing to give time off to go to such a march, etc...gun rights people could stage such marches too.