Manufacturing/Selling Firearms

[dakota.potts]

I've had an idea recently that I wanted to test the waters with -- a low recoil defensive firearm with large controls, easy to access bolts, recoil pads low charging weight, etc. with a marketing focus on home defense and a low retail price. Something a child or old lady with arthritis could use safely and is in most peoples' budget range.

I know if I created a proper business plan I could get funding and I'd like to contract a local gunsmithing business to build 10 prototype models or so. Could I sell these since it's a small number and I'd be losing money on it? I think it would be hard to say that I'm doing it as a living with a 10 quantity run that doesn't make a profit, but I'm not sure.

My biggest issue is concerning getting an FFL. You have to be aged 21 and I'm 18. Do I have any options at all? Could a family member in the same premises as me sign obtain their FFL and I work as an employee for them selling and marketing the items? All plans are for non-NFA long guns. Could I find a business partner of age? I'm not looking for a shady deal, only to find out if there's a way that I could legally work helping to sell these items or help in the business. I might be able open the business with a family member who would obtain the license. What duties would I be able to do and what would I need the family member to do? Obviously I can do things like social marketing and sales pitches to local business but how much as far as selling? Is there a place I can go to find out more about this topic? I haven't found much on the ATF website.

Thank you guys for all the help.

 

[Wreck-n-Crew]

I know if I created a proper business plan I could get funding and I'd like to contract a local gunsmithing business to build 10 prototype models or so.

They can't build them/assemble them without an FFL for resale if my recollection serves me right.

As a current business owner, I would suggest to get advise from a lawyer even after you turn 21. There are so many things you are going to need to know before you begin.

As far as what I do know, A person can make their own firearm, providing they are of the legal age. You could grab a person of age and have them make something by your design but they could possibly get a patent and back you up before you step forward.

Since you have 3 years to go, you will need that time to design and testing can be done after you turn 21. Don't go Jumping in before you can legally protect yourself with patents and legally applicable and binding contracts.

In the three years you have left you could learn Tool and Die as well as some engineering. Those two things will serve you well. Having experience with the processes used to create the parts will give you a leg up when managing the manufacturing and assembly aspects until you can hire the right leaders to play those roles.

You also have time to make contacts with suppliers of tools, machinery, and material supplies you will need to get started. Also making business acquaintances is a must for growth. Time to look into advertising possibilities and cost. Advertising guns is limited due to law, it's not like you can make a Commercial for TV. The internet should be one of your biggest allies.

Stay away from Business partners! Also Finance and investors. You will need money, Whether from investors, Credit Unions/Banks or both. Work on your credit now. Plan with all of these things in mind and you can be successful if your product turns out well.

Finally, Lawyer,lawyer and LAWYER. I can't reiterate it enough, you need one! Yes I already said it but Lawyer!

Sure there are some here that know the law better than me because they are lawyers, so take their advice as gold if/when they chime in.

 

[Psychedelic Bang]

Mr. dakota.potts,

"You've got some holes in your story," as we like to say. So, I am just going to help you examine your ideas, and try to see it another way because:

1. Nobody wants a dream crushed.
2. Every idea is a good idea until its a bad one.
3. There's a good thing about entrepreneurial spirit, and the freedom of owning your own business.

Something a child or old lady with arthritis could use safely and is in most peoples' budget range.

You would be gun manufacturing specifically for a disabled market. At the very least you would need to do a ton of research for your business plan re funding. You would to show that a great number of would be gun owners need a gun they can use safely. You literally have to assume there are folk out there, who otherwise would have a gun if they could use it safely, or are uncomfortable with the current guns because they can not be used safely.

I know if I created a proper business plan I could get funding

Is that because you have access to millions of dollars in a trust, or as an allowance, or because you think its easy to go to a bank and get money?

I'd like to contract a local gunsmithing business to build 10 prototype models or so.

Have you researched that? I can't imagine a gun smithing business being able to prototype your gun, or make a run of ten of them for a reasonable amount of cash. Obviously, this is not my area of expertise, but I'd be willing to be that prototyping a gun this way cool $1,000,000

I suppose you could design your firearm using CAD on a computer and 3d print the gun. This will be way more affordable and could run you less than $250,000 before you have a final prototype that is ready to be messed produced. Again, the dollar number is just a guess.

My biggest issue is concerning getting an FFL. You have to be aged 21 and I'm 18.

Well, you've got 3 years until your 21 so why worry about it now? Highly unlikely you need an FFL to make custom grips. I'm sure people are always looking for a better grip for one reason or another; maybe even for reasons of arthritis.

If I were going to start another business.. I might first look at grips rather than the firearms themselves.

Something for you to chew on, and when you are 21.. You can get your FFL.

Good luck

 

[dakota.potts]

I'm not necessarily looking to build a gun specifically FOR a disabled market --rather, one with big, easy to use controls, light cocking weights, etc.

I'm actually thinking about maybe buying a Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 and modifying it -- custom grips, recoil springs, etc. The goal is to make it light, handy, hard to take away from you in a defensive environment, and easy to use. If that can be done on an existing platform, all the better. I'm toying around with the idea of a stock with an arm brace and a recoil pad, muzzle brake, etc.

Probably should have made that clear. I'm not looking to re-invent the wheel with this. More along the lines of stocks, springs, trigger adjustments, etc. Or maybe that's not enough of a service to be marketable. I've obviously got a lot of thinking to do but that's getting away from Law and Civil Rights. I'd be happy to take it to PM if you want to know more about what I'm planning.

EDIT: As per your grip idea, it's entirely possible I learn to modify guns to make them smooth, light, and easy to operate. My mom bought her Sig p238 because she has weak joints and hands and it was the only slide she could operate. I'm sure there are people looking for a smoother slide action on their Remington or maybe a good recoil buffer. Definitely things to think about

The plan would not be "look at this gun for the disabled market" as much as "Gun sales have gone up X amount and this brings to the market a handy gun that any owner can be taught to operate at a low price". Of course that lacks market research and validation,

We're a family of entrepreneurs and one of our business enterprises is a start up incubator -- they provide money, coaching, and web design as well as meetings with other investors in exchange for equity.

This definitely isn't an overnight dream. I've seen businesses started from the ground up and I know that in any business it isn't easy.

I'm just a little curious of what it would take looking into the future. All that helps me move forward, since I have far more ideas than time or resources

I do appreciate the healthy concern though. I'm just looking to get an idea of FFL's, SOT, excise taxes, what would go into this kind of thing so I can think more about it and decide if it's worth seriously putting time into. The law side is the main purpose of this thread being in the Law and Civil Rights, so I'd be happy to start a thread in General Discussion or move to PM conversation if anybody wanted to have the conversation about the business/gun side of the deal.