Mags Training vs Carry

C

colbad

New member
For my entire professional life I have always dipped into my own pocket $$ to make sure I had a separate set of magazines (clearly marked) for training and those I use for duty carry. I do shoot my carry magazines (for confidence in my gear) but they NEVER get dropped or touch the ground. However, I routinely see people (even cops) training with their carry mags. When I ask why they would do that, the answer is usually "thats all the mags they gave me" or "thats all that came with the gun". Pretty sad answers if you ask me.

So the question is, how many of you out there minimize potential mag failure by using separate training mags vs duty/carry mags? In that the mag is the weakest part of the weapons system, protecting it from being dropped, etc seems like a no brainer. Thoughts?
 
I just purchased my first carry gun (Ruger LCP) and I did buy separate practice mags for it - but the reason was not reliability but rather capacity. I have factory 6 and 7 round mags for carry and aftermarket 10-round mags for practice so I don't have to reload as much.
 
All my mags are used enough to know they run so they can be used for carry or range work.

The only mags which are segregated are ones which still function but have a flaw like a P228 mag which does not lock back the slide. I still use it as a training tool. Slide does not lock back but I get a click instead of a bang. I hit is again nothing I then I tap and rack gun locks back move to mag change.
 
I am reasonably careful with all my magazines, but if some are so weak and liable to damage that they can't take normal use, I don't want them for carry. I would prefer magazines that I have used and know work rather than ones I have coddled and protected. Same with the idea of shooting cheap ammo for practice while carrying the "good" ammo I don't even know will function.

Jim
 
Another thing I will say is that I treat mags as disposable wear parts. When they start to fail I will not do more than replace a spring. If they do not run after that I will scrap them. Changing followers and base plates etc... most of the time is not worth it unless we are talking about $50 mags.
 
James K said:
I am reasonably careful with all my magazines, but if some are so weak and liable to damage that they can't take normal use, I don't want them for carry. I would prefer magazines that I have used and know work rather than ones I have coddled and protected. Same with the idea of shooting cheap ammo for practice while carrying the "good" ammo I don't even know will function.

Jim
Click to expand...
You can run the dedicated mags a number of times to be sure they work and I don't shoot Gold Dots at the range every time only a box or two to ensure function. It doesn't have to be all or nothing.
 
I have factory 6 and 7 round mags for carry and aftermarket 10-round mags for practice so I don't have to reload as much.
Click to expand...

How funny! I do exactly the opposite: I download my full capacity magazines so that in practice I get lots of repetitions of reloading skills.

pax
 
So the question is, how many of you out there minimize potential mag failure by using separate training mags vs duty/carry mags? In that the mag is the weakest part of the weapons system, protecting it from being dropped, etc seems like a no brainer. Thoughts?
Click to expand...

I think you are over thinking it. If the mags are so brittle that they might be damaged from a waist high drop, then you need to invest in better mags. Especially if you are going to trust your life to them.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with being careful with them(to a point). However, not using them at the range on the off chance you might drop one seems a bit silly. Test the mags. If any are unreliable, Mark them as range mags(or throw them out), and don't use them for duty. Practice at the range with your duty mags(to ensure their reliability), as well as your range only mags.
 
Apparently no one has ever dumped mags on rocks, cement or had them ground into the dirt during training. I am not talking about sitting on a bench and plinking. I am talking real shoot and move training. All it takes is a gentle bend of a lip to trash even the best of the factory mags.
 
My magazines have been dropped countless times on just about every surface imaginable.
Other than cleaning them, they have required no attention.
Until this thead was brought up, it never occurred to me not to.
 
How funny! I do exactly the opposite: I download my full capacity magazines so that in practice I get lots of repetitions of reloading skills.
Click to expand...

I can practice mag changes at home. When I am at the range I like to practice hitting the target.
 
I can practice mag changes at home. When I am at the range I like to practice hitting the target.
Click to expand...

Well you need to work on swapping the mags and getting the pistol back into action efficiently and be able to fire after the mag change. IMHO you can only do that during live fire.
 
I understand that mags can fail when they're dropped on hard surfaces...like the concrete floors at the range I shoot at about 3 times a week...but over the last 10 yrs or so, I can only think of 2 or 3 mag failures from dropping a mag out of a 1911 - and those were all Les Baer supplied mags - with cheap spot welded base plates that failed ( and I've since tossed all of his mags out ) --- and in shooting about 400 - 500 rds a week typically, I can only recall those 3 failures from dropping mags on concrete floors / and never with a Wilson Combat 1911 mag.

I practice my reload drills almost every range trip....( Wilson 1911 ETM mags in 9mm and .45 acp ...with the larger ETM base pads on them )...and I run reload drills all the time.... ( ... like draw - Fire 3 - reload - Fire 3 - Reload - Fire 3 with a par time of around 10 sec...).../ and while I typically have 7 mags with me at the range ( I don't count the number of times each gets dropped / they each just get mixed into the course of fire )...

Yesterday afternoon, I ran that drill ( 3 + 3 + 3 ) 4 times at 5 yds, 4 times at 6, 7 and 8 yds....so most every mag hit the floor 4 or 5 times at least..( out of the 32 times I dropped a mag during the drill )...and about the only thing I do when I pick them up, is make sure the base pad has not come loose...

I would rather the range - had anti fatigue mats on the floor...in the firing stalls - but as a heavily used indoor range in a fairly large metropolitan area...keeping them clean would be way tougher than the concrete floors..../ and the general training bay ...where we can move between targets, etc...its not practical to put mats in the entire 25 yd X 15 yd bay.../ so I accept dropping mags on a concrete floor - as just part of the best facility I have around !

So I don't worry about it ...when I carry, I will carry 3 out of the same 7 mags I use at the range - and that's also why I have 2 extra mags on my belt ...in case one does fail. I carry one of the same 1911's I shoot every week - with the same ETM mags...( 5" Wilson 1911's ) in either 9mm or .45acp....

I think all of those mags I use now are at least 5 yrs old ....and If - or maybe when --- 1 or 2 of those 7 mags fail / I will toss them all out -- or give them to someone ( like one of my adult kids ) that don't carry - and let them use them as "range mags" and replace them. I have at least 3 more new mags ...ready to go, in storage, if I need them ...and I'll just order a few more....( a few hundred dollars in mags every 10yrs or so, is not a big deal )...
 
I test the function of every mag that I have. I replace springs and grind followers and tweek the magazine lips and make sure that each mag functions. If I drop one in the dirt I flush it out with some carb spray or my solvent sink or a dribble of gasoline or in the field a dunk in the creek followed by vigorous shakeing. Mags are just too easy to figure out......it aint like they are multiport computer controlled fuel injection......
 
Well you need to work on swapping the mags and getting the pistol back into action efficiently and be able to fire after the mag change. IMHO you can only do that during live fire.
Click to expand...

Using dummy rounds like snap caps I can do everything but make it go bang without leaving the house, then use that experience to see how I did at the range - the one place where I can make it go bang - so I can concentrate more of my time there on hitting what I am shooting at.
 
Here's a picture from a John Farnam class earlier this year. We were doing a move-and-shoot-and-move-some-more drill on rotating steel targets, and everyone dropped magazines into the mud and then trampled on them.

attachment.php


Then we all picked up our magazines, blew out the worst of the gunk, reloaded and did it again.

And again.

No dead magazines. (Though I was happy to clean mine, when the day was done.)

pax
 

Attachments

  • farnam.jpg
    farnam.jpg
    214.7 KB · Views: 193
MFitz...you should probably practice with the same type of mag that you carry. If you get into a real world situation, your brain degenerates into reaction mode and goes into your training. I'm not sure what type of pistol you have, but mags can also make a difference. Even something like the extra bullet weight of larger mags will affect how things go in an absolutely rushed panic situation.
I'm a mutant and found out I was more accurate with 7 shot mags than the 8 shot mags I got for my PPS. I'm not sure if you practice only with your practice mags or not, but you should try both a lot and find out what works and stick with it.
 
My carry guns have a min six magazines per gun. Both carry ammo and magazines are changed every six months. If I find a bad magazine, and a new spring and follower, doesn't fix the problem it is tossed. I have tossed one in twenty years. I still have original magazines for my Glock 19 that I bought 16 years ago. That pistol has countless rounds thru it, and was my duty gun.
 
MFitz...you should probably practice with the same type of mag that you carry. If you get into a real world situation, your brain degenerates into reaction mode and goes into your training. I'm not sure what type of pistol you have, but mags can also make a difference. Even something like the extra bullet weight of larger mags will affect how things go in an absolutely rushed panic situation.
I'm a mutant and found out I was more accurate with 7 shot mags than the 8 shot mags I got for my PPS. I'm not sure if you practice only with your practice mags or not, but you should try both a lot and find out what works and stick with it.
Click to expand...

LCP and I practice with all my mags. I have 3 6-round, 1 7-round and 2 10-round mags - the latter are practice-only, the others I practice with and carry.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top