(MA)For those of you who don't know, here's what "Gunmen" look like

USP45

New member
Story and Photo

Camera catches alleged shooter at R.I. festival
by Laurel J. Sweet

Monday, August 7, 2000

In an apparent attempt to kill his girlfriend's ex-husband, police
said a Roslindale man opened fire at a crammed Puerto Rican
festival in Providence yesterday afternoon and shot four people,
including a child.

David Fontanez, 38, who was captured on film with the gun still in
his hand by a Providence Journal photographer, eluded arrest by
Rhode Island and Massachusetts authorities last night.

Praising Journal photographer Rachel
Ritchie's ``courageous actions,''
Providence Mayor Vincent A. Cianci
Jr. last night said, ``We probably
have one of the best pieces of
evidence the Providence police have
ever had in the commission of a
crime.''

``A lovers' triangle'' triggered the
4:30 p.m. shootout on Borenuen
Street near Interstate 95, said
Providence police Maj. Martin Hames.

``They were all at the festival,'' he said.

Police said three bystanders were hit by bullets as Fontanez
chased Colon through the crowd, pulling the gun's trigger.

Fontanez, a native Puerto Rican, was last known to be living on
Hyde Park Avenue in Roslindale, Boston police said.

Witnesses told Providence police he fled the festival in a blue
Toyota with Massachusetts plates.

Luis Colon, 39, the former husband of Fontanez's girlfriend, Lucy
Vega, was shot in the chest, Hames said. Colon, the most seriously
hurt of all, was in critical condition last night at Rhode Island
Hospital, hospital spokesman Eric White said.

A 13-year-old boy, who Hames said was shot in the ankle, was
treated at Hasbro Children's Hospital and released, White said.

Two women who were also shot during the melee, Idis Ramon, 49, and
Maria Dellacruz, 44, both of Providence, were in satisfactory
condition last night at Rhode Island Hospital, White said.

Hames said the crowd numbered more than 1,000, ``but we had no
idea the festival was even going on.''

Police were not present when Fontanez opened fire, but Hames said,
``I'm sure it was total chaos.''

Cianci echoed investigators' assertions that the shooting
apparently stemmed from some kind of a domestic dispute.

He, too, said the city was unaware there was a festival being held
this weekend.

One of several photographs snapped by Ritchie, who was covering
the celebrations, clearly shows a tattooed man dressed in a tank
top, shorts, and thick gold chains, walking away, clutching a
handgun.

``We have an actual photograph of the shooter,'' Cianci said.

While Fontanez was allegedly firing off bullets, Cianci said
Ritchie ``was doing some shooting of her own.''

Police tried to confiscate the film and took both Ritchie and her
cameras to the police station.

Ritchie was released with her equipment after discussions with the
newspaper's lawyers, and the Journal agreed to share the photo
with the police.

Witnesses at the festival said the man pulled the gun and started
shooting while people in the crowd tried to take cover.

Friends of Colon said they had to carry him two blocks to the
hospital because emergency crews could not get through the
festival crowds.

------------------
~USP

"[Even if there would be] few tears shed if and when the Second Amendment is held to guarantee nothing more than the state National Guard, this would simply show that the Founders were right when they feared that some future generation might wish to abandon liberties that they considered essential, and so sought to protect those liberties in a Bill of Rights. We may tolerate the abridgement of property rights and the elimination of a right to bear arms; but we should not pretend that these are not reductions of rights." -- Justice Scalia 1998
 
As the NYC social worker recently bashed by a brick would have said, 'He must have had a very difficult childhood'.

Makes you wonder how this guy would score on psychiatric tests--or would it all come out to flat-line.

So much for the fiction that we are a civilized society...

------------------
 
So the question is...

You're carrying at the festival. David suddenly starts chasing Luis though the crowd, then he starts shooting.

Shoot, don't shoot?

I have to say, I think i'd take cover, and if i believed i had a good shot (clear of non-combatants), i'd shoot.

Thoughts?

------------------
~USP

"[Even if there would be] few tears shed if and when the Second Amendment is held to guarantee nothing more than the state National Guard, this would simply show that the Founders were right when they feared that some future generation might wish to abandon liberties that they considered essential, and so sought to protect those liberties in a Bill of Rights. We may tolerate the abridgement of property rights and the elimination of a right to bear arms; but we should not pretend that these are not reductions of rights." -- Justice Scalia 1998
 
The classic case, you don't know why someone is shooting someone. The running guy might just have stabbed the shooter's sister.

Or the classic undercover cop chase.

MYOB unless you can truly determine casuality.
 
Now i'm not saying that i would definitly shoot, but...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Police said three bystanders were hit by bullets as Fontanez chased Colon through the crowd, pulling the gun's trigger.[/quote]

This changes things abit for me...

Do undercover cops really run through a crowd shooting?

And even if the guy running away did just stab the shooter's daughter, does that give him the right to run, shooting through a crowd?

Is he not a valid threat to me?

------------------
~USP

"[Even if there would be] few tears shed if and when the Second Amendment is held to guarantee nothing more than the state National Guard, this would simply show that the Founders were right when they feared that some future generation might wish to abandon liberties that they considered essential, and so sought to protect those liberties in a Bill of Rights. We may tolerate the abridgement of property rights and the elimination of a right to bear arms; but we should not pretend that these are not reductions of rights." -- Justice Scalia 1998
 
I'm not saying this is a no shoot situation. It seems like a cop out type answer but I would have to say "it depends". If he was close to me and my family and shooting well he would get a rude introduction to my USP .40. But if I was in the crowd and heard the shots I would get my family out of harms way and let him run off. With all the lawsuit crazy people these days you would probably end up in jail for saving someone.

I saw the picture and he doesn't look like a respectable gun owner. :)
 
>Praising Journal photographer Rachel
> Ritchie's ``courageous >actions,''
> Providence Mayor Vincent >A. Cianci
> Jr. last night said, >``We probably
> have one of the best >pieces of
> evidence the Providence >police have
> ever had in the >commission of a
> crime.''

ALLEGED gun.
ALLEGED gunman.
ALLEGED shooting.
ALLEGED picture.
ALLEGED people shot.

Remember ... a series of court-appointed lawyers -- paid for by you -- will deny any guilt during the seven + years this is appealed ...


Ya gotta love then Dems.
 
USP45 - I don't think undercover cops run through crowds shooting very much, but it happened right in front of me once, and the bastard (who was shortly thereafter no longer a LEO) shot and killed a guy right in front of me. There were about ten other cops around (I found out later) as well as about fifty people. If I had been armed and pulled a gun I undoubtedly would be dead today, but the cop never identified himself and was not only undercover, but long hair, beard, scruffy clothes etc.
 
Unless he is shooting at me I cannot determine motive . Therefore he gets a free ride .

------------------
TOM
SASS AMERICAN LEGION NRA GOA
 
You can always "accidentally" stick your foot out as he runs past and wait for his reaction. :-)
 
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