Lots Of Guns Stolen From Trains In Chicago

iraiam

New member
It seems there is an issue in Chicago train yards. Rail cars are being broken into containing all kinds of merchandise. Many firearms have been lifted as well.

Some would have us believe that all these "illegal guns" in Chicago are coming from Indiana gun shows and other sources they want legislation against.

Take a single theft (one of many) that the article refers to where 319 firearms were stolen. Try to imagine how many interstate trips and risky illegal firearm transfers it would take to import that many guns into gun controlled Chicago. It would also take a rather large pile of cash.

The article states that only about 16 of these hundreds of guns have been recovered, it's not mentioned; but I'm betting these few have been recovered from crime scenes.

http://wgntv.com/2017/01/12/how-modern-day-train-robberies-are-bringing-more-guns-to-chicago/
 
Last edited:
I've deleted several off-topic and/or political responses. I'll leave this open for now in case anyone does have anything constructive to say about this. I won't, however, put up with snark about Chicago or about people.
 
Apparently, this has been happening for a while at these rail yards, a search of Chicago area news channels resulted in reports of these gun thefts dating back several years.

I don't have official numbers, but numerous articles have numerous dates and numbers of weapons stolen. There may be thousands of these stolen guns in the hands of criminals.
 
that article is anti-gun propaganda, there are no "illegal" guns being transported into the city.

Years ago the University of Chicago did a research paper on how Chicago criminals get their guns and it was mostly thru straw purchases then theft.

It does make sense the trains are vulnerable if sitting idle in places.
 
Chicago is a major, THE major transshipment point for lots and lots of things, and organized theft is not a new problem.

I no longer remember just when it was, decades ago but I do remember a "sensational" headline about how $6 million dollars of Winchesters had "walked off" of Chicago loading docks in one year (or possibly one theft, I no longer recall clearly).


Anyway, the point here is that criminals steal. From street gangs breaking into boxcars to more organized groups things "fall off the truck" all the time.

While the author does say its not the fault of the gun makers, and points out a case of a train bound for Spokane getting robbed, the over all tone is "illegal guns being brought into our city", and I get the implied, "if you nasty gunmakers didn't ship your stuff through here, we wouldn't have any problems"...

Maybe I'm reading in something that isn't there, but I think its a "hit piece" more than actual news reporting.

ALL major transshipment points (all our major cities) have this same problem. Its not new, and its not "news" any more than the other crime that happens day in and day out.
 
That was my thought, too. I'd bet that guns are a very small percentage of the various things that are stolen. I do wonder how "targeted" the thefts are. My guess would be that many, if not most, of the thieves rely on inside sources of information -- it would suck to break into a boxcar or container and find that it was full of bundles of paper on their way to be recycled.
 
The report doesn't mention if, or how the gangs are targeting certain cars, and didn't mention how many boxcars get broken into. Only ones that had guns in them were mentioned.

No mention, (for example) of the three other cars broken into that same night, one full of wood stoves (which are heavy and difficult to pawn or sell on the street, and so left alone) one empty, and one with 40 tons of Cream of Wheat...its kind of like a grab bag, you get something, but you don't know what, until you open it.

PERHAPS they are relying on inside information, but who has information about what is in each car of a train, and where it is going to be at any given time? Only certain people in the railroad know that kind of thing, and I would think that non-hazardous material, bulk "dry goods" is not a high priority tracking item. Keeping track of a tanker full of chlorine gas is one thing, tracking what is in each of the thousands of boxes of other things is another thing entirely, and the railroad may not even know, let alone track them.

It's not impossible, but I think it unlikely

And, of course, the law maker's answer to the problem is make another law. They write it, and get it passed, and their job is done. They don't have to worry about the cost and complexity of complying with their new law.

Report every train with guns as part of the manifest to Chicago PD? ok, who's going to process that information, and see it gets to the people who could actually use it in a timely manner in a police dept that is already "understaffed and under funded" (what dept isn't??)

Who's gonna pay for that? Without dedicated additional funding (something not mentioned by the lawmaker) resources (money & people) would have to be diverted from something else. Poor plan.

Armed guards? The lawmaker likes that idea, after all, the military provides them for their stuff, right?? Right. Some stuff, sometimes, and military guards are essentially "already paid for".

No, I don't have an answer (other than improved policing in general) just pointing out the lawmaker's solution(s) cost money to make work, and that money comes out of OUR pockets, one way or another.
 
I wonder if a boxcar full of AR-15s would be locked, while a boxcar full of newsprint rolls or Cheerios wouldn't be locked. The act of trying to secure the load might actually be broadcasting a message to thieves: "Steal me!" I know that most 18-wheelers on the highway aren't locked -- but some are ...
 
Last edited:
Some would have us believe that all these "illegal guns" in Chicago are coming from Indiana gun shows and other sources they want legislation against.

There’s no reference to Indiana gun shows in the linked article, nor is there any advocacy of regulating ‘other sources’; and who exactly are ‘they’?

Indeed, the article acknowledges that it’s not the fault of shippers or gun dealers – the article appropriately notes that increased security and establishing better communications between the shippers and law enforcement is warranted, a wise and justified proposal, having nothing to do with ‘gun control.’

The notion that Chicago’s firearm regulatory policies ‘don’t work’ because the City is awash in guns and gun violence is as ignorant as it is wrong, a ridiculous myth devoid of fact or merit, and fails as a post hoc fallacy.
 
I'm an Engineer for one of the largest RR's in the country, I can tell you this, we basically only know about hazardous materials. Most stuff if not hazardous is just marked as mixed freight and that's it.

If it was an inside job (which I highly doubt) it would have to come from someone that worked in the main office. Other then that, we don't get that kind of information. What's more than likely happening is they're breaking into as many cars as they can and only taking the good stuff.

From the article that much is easy to read for most intelligent people, where the story gets stupid is from the person writing it. His fear mongering and anti gun agenda is trying to get people to do the same. If you were a criminal, would you take the guns or the cream of wheat?
 
44 AMP said:
The report doesn't mention if, or how the gangs are targeting certain cars, and didn't mention how many boxcars get broken into. Only ones that had guns in them were mentioned...

PERHAPS they are relying on inside information, but who has information about what is in each car of a train, and where it is going to be at any given time? Only certain people in the railroad know that kind of thing, and I would think that non-hazardous material, bulk "dry goods" is not a high priority tracking item.
Although I don't work in the railroad industry, I've hung around with people who do, so I know just a little about how the system works.

The railroads DO actually keep close tabs on where cars are located and a broad description of what's in them, and this information is available to many employees, but my understanding is that the key word is "broad." IOW the contents of a cargo container are more likely to be listed as "dry goods" rather than "422 televisions, 130 rifles, and 2,000 boxes of shower curtains." ;)

However, sophisticated thieves with inside information can often make a reasonable guess of what a car contains based on where it's going and coming from. A key thing to understand is that railroads got out of the less-than-carload (LCL) freight business decades ago; what's why your local freight station is occupied by a restaurant and loft apartments rather than a railroad shipping department. ;) Railroads move entire cars (or most often blocks of them) from one point to another; they don't move smaller loads piecemeal. Hence, if you know where most Walmart shipments containing Item X come from, you can target cars coming from that place, but it's likely a giant distribution center that also handles many other items.

I speculate that the thieves may have had inside information regarding the car's origin and destination, rather than what exactly is in it – hence the reported hit-and-miss nature of their haul. Think of how little space 100-odd rifles would occupy in a shipping container full of sporting goods. It could be that the guns were incidental to their intended target, which may have been something more easily fenced, like electronics or expensive athletic shoes.

Another important point is that I could understand railroads being hesitant to issue any sort of bulletin regarding exactly which cars contain a particular type of valuable goods, precisely BECAUSE the information could wind up in the wrong hands! Police departments are by no means immune to corruption.
Aguila Blanca said:
I wonder if a boxcar full of AR-15s would be locked, while a boxcar full of newsprint rolls or Cheerios wouldn't be locked.
I suspect that there is no difference, as the railroads wouldn't want to give the thieves any clues.

Also, I seriously doubt that anyone ever ships an entire carload of AR-15s. Since deregulation, railroads have also largely gotten out of the small-scale single-car shipment business; they prefer to deal with blocks of cars or even entire trains for customers who are moving lots of cargo on a regular basis. I seriously doubt that any gunmaker sells enough guns to a single customer on a regular-enough basis to warrant shipping by rail. The AR-15s probably move from the manufacturer to a distribution center by truck, from which point they're loaded into individual cars bound for different stores. Most of these shipments likely involve high-volume customers such as Walmart or Academy Sports. That said, one could imagine a scenario where thieves target cars coming from the Walmart distribution center nearest to a major gunmaker location such as Springfield, MA or Prescott, AZ.
Koda94 said:
I bey a boxvar[sic] full of smartphones and other electronics gets as much theft a guns.
Probably more, considering that electronics dealers are subject to less federal scrutiny. In fact, most of the stories I've heard about sophisticated train burglary* rings concerned electronics. IIRC another commonly stolen item is auto parts, as there's a large market for them, and they're generally very hard to trace. FWIW I've read that much of the thieves' haul of these items winds up overseas.

*Footnote: IMHO these thefts are best characterized as burglaries rather than robberies in the classic sense. As I understand it, almost all of them are perpetrated by thieves pulling a truck up to a parked train car on an isolated siding and unloading it.
 
I find it hard to believe that these types of thefts are not inside jobs. Depots have a serious amount of video cameras. Also, unless you have the paperwork, there is no way to know what is inside these containers. I know, 'cause someone close to me is in the transportation logistics industry.
 
There’s no reference to Indiana gun shows in the linked article, nor is there any advocacy of regulating ‘other sources’; and who exactly are ‘they’?

Well, I cant really call "them" out without bringing politics into the thread, which is against the rules, but "they" go out of their way to blame gun violence in Chicago on the gun laws in surrounding states, the"gun show loophole" and terms like that, a sentiment I have heard/read about no less than dozens of times in the last year or so.

Indeed the article does not mention this issue, but my point is that it's not necessary to look to other states gun laws as the source for these guns as "they" would have us believe, there is a well documented source for them right in the Chicago front yard going back some years, and by documented I mean complete with police reports and insurance payouts.
 
Back
Top