Loading for Winchester repro 1873 45 Colt

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FoghornLeghorn

New member
45 Colt, .451 diameter, 200 grain SWC copper plated Xtreme bullets.

Firearm is a Winchester reproduction model 1873 in 45.

I want to use either Winchester 231, Titegroup, or Vihtavuori 3N37.

Looking at the reloading data for the Vihtavuori, I guess it’s too high pressure for the 45 Colt in the 1873 action. I’m surprised it doesn’t have a special category for the Ruger revolvers or Thompson Center pistols, though. Is there any way to extrapolate the data from other, similar Vihtavuori powders to the 3N37 powder for use in the standard 45 Colt cartridge?

Barring that, Titegroup has the starting load as 6.7 grains, 899 fps, 9600 CUP. Max load 7.5 grains, 989 fps, 12700 CUP.

231 is 7.8 grains, 956 fps, 11000 CUP. Max is 8.7, 1048 fps, 14000 CUP.

Above data is for jacketed bullets. They don’t give data for plated, but plated bullet manufacturers say jacketed data is ok as long as CUP isn’t exceeded for their bullets.

My questions are, can the Vihtavuori 3N37 data be extrapolated from other (similar) Vihtavuori powders?

Also, which of the other two powders would you use and what would your load be for (what appears to be a rather delicate firearm action) the 1873?
 
Powders don't extrapolate readily because the inflections in the burning curves are differently located. Usually, if data isn't given, the powder isn't a good choice for some reason or another. The peak pressures involved may be too low for it to burn well, in which case velocity spread will be high and the fouling dirty and a lot of unburned powder will be expelled with the bullet. In this case, Gordon's Reloading Tool suggests about a quarter of the propellant would exit the muzzle unburned, so 3N37 falls into that category for this load.
 
FoghornLeghorn,

Winchester load data (the manufacturer of the powder) shows a cowboy load of 5.5gr of W231 for a 250gr lead bullet at 750fps and 10,000psi for the .45 Colt. Since you are using a 200gr lead bullet, I would use 6.0gr of W231 for your Model 1873. Pressure would be low enough to not cause any problems with your lever gun.

Don
 
USSR said:
FoghornLeghorn,

Winchester load data (the manufacturer of the powder) shows a cowboy load of 5.5gr of W231 for a 250gr lead bullet at 750fps and 10,000psi for the .45 Colt. Since you are using a 200gr lead bullet, I would use 6.0gr of W231 for your Model 1873. Pressure would be low enough to not cause any problems with your lever gun.

Don
Click to expand...
Not lead. Copper plated. Berry's says their cp bullets can be loaded with the same data as jacket or lead. As long as it does not exceed 1250 fps. I prefer a slightly hotter charge since there is a problem with the 1873 bullet case expanding enough to seal the gas and debris from the action.

Or some such. And it's pretty hard to clean the 1873 internals.
 
I don't mean to overthink this, but I'm getting a lot of cautionary data concerning this gun.

However, the late RCModel said,
The only SAAMI spec for the .45 Colt is 14,000 PSI. That is the only pressure suitable for use in any rifle with a toggle-link action.
Click to expand...
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p... Colt is 14,000 PSI,with a toggle-link action.

And the next poster down said,
Do not exceed the 14,000 psi/13,800 CUP range of loads for these rifles in .45 Colt.
Click to expand...

As I said in the OP, the Titegroup reloading data page for 45 Colt, 200 grain jacketed Hornady XTP bullet, says the beginning load is 6.7 grains for 9600 CUP. Max load is 7.5 grains for 12,700 CUP.

For 231, starting is 7.8 grains for 11000 CUP. Max is 8.7 for 14000 CUP.

The max load for either one is within acceptable parameters?
 
FoghornLeghorn,

Most of the industry says to use lead bullet load data with plated bullets, not jacketed bullet load data. Berry's seems to be the outlier. I have given you sound advice, the rest is up to you.

Don
 
Most of the industry says to use lead bullet load data with plated bullets,
Click to expand...

Yes, I'm aware of that. Besides, I always load my reloads at minimum levels to protect my old firearms. Pre 27 S&W, for example, I use 38 special loads, etc.

But I'm concerned about the whole "case seal in the chamber" thing.

Anyway, I'll sort it out. Thanks for your help/advice.
 
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