Light 30 Caliber Bullets
- Thread starter roy reali
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Not yet, but I've got close to 2500 85 grain FMJ bullets I pulled from some bad 7.62 x 25 commie surplus ammo. Bullets measure .308" exactly.
In a couple of weeks, I'm taking my reloading gear and chronograph down to the country and will be trying out the 85 grainers in a 30-30 Win. single shot.
I'll try to remember to post results when I get back.
In a couple of weeks, I'm taking my reloading gear and chronograph down to the country and will be trying out the 85 grainers in a 30-30 Win. single shot.
I'll try to remember to post results when I get back.
Light loads of very fast pistol powders will shoot surprisingly well. I've shot the 100 grain Speer plinker over 6 grains of Bullseye in the .308. A more popular load is about 10 grains of Unique, which is also surprisingly accurate. Especially great for teaching kids to shoot, because the recoil is negligable and you still have enough precision to blow up charcoal brickets with them.
I expect the very light bullets, being short, will be more prone to tipping in the bore, and therefore be a little harder to get accuracy from than the longer 100 grain bullets, but the experiment would be fun. Just avoid slow rifle powders with those light bullets because of the secondary pressure spikes observed in instrumented guns and which have not been satisfactorily explained as being anything other than what they appear to be. Fast pistol powders won't cause a problem though.
I expect the very light bullets, being short, will be more prone to tipping in the bore, and therefore be a little harder to get accuracy from than the longer 100 grain bullets, but the experiment would be fun. Just avoid slow rifle powders with those light bullets because of the secondary pressure spikes observed in instrumented guns and which have not been satisfactorily explained as being anything other than what they appear to be. Fast pistol powders won't cause a problem though.
Sidetracked
New member
Loading for a .220 Swift, I have learned to live by velocity ratings for bullets.
If you push bullets beyond their designed velocity, they could potentially tear themselves apart in flight.
The Hornady book 7th edition shows the following for the bullets in question:
.308" 86 gr RN "Self-Defense/Small Game" 1000-1600 FPS
.308" 90 gr XTP HP "Self-Defense/Small Game" 800-2200 FPS
That's fairly slow for anything coming out of a rifle barrel, but should be usable.
UncleNick's loads (or similar) sound pretty reasonable to keep these bullets from vaporizing.
If you push bullets beyond their designed velocity, they could potentially tear themselves apart in flight.
The Hornady book 7th edition shows the following for the bullets in question:
.308" 86 gr RN "Self-Defense/Small Game" 1000-1600 FPS
.308" 90 gr XTP HP "Self-Defense/Small Game" 800-2200 FPS
That's fairly slow for anything coming out of a rifle barrel, but should be usable.
UncleNick's loads (or similar) sound pretty reasonable to keep these bullets from vaporizing.
Roy,
It would be helpful to know what cartridge you are intending to load these light .308 bullets into. There are HUGE differences in case capacities availabe for the cartridges that take .308 bullets, from the 30 carbine to the 300 RUM. What powders will work safely for you depends stongly on the size case you are loading.
The second pressure spike phenomenon that Unclenick mentioned seems to occur with powders that are too slow for light bullets in big cases. It is not well understood (or even universally believed), but seems to be able to occur with some loads listed in manuals. So, substituting an even lighter bullet in a load recipe for a light bullet in a big case with a relatively slow powder may not be as safe as one would assume.
Without knowing the size of your case, it is not clear if 3031 is slow or not in your application.
SL1
It would be helpful to know what cartridge you are intending to load these light .308 bullets into. There are HUGE differences in case capacities availabe for the cartridges that take .308 bullets, from the 30 carbine to the 300 RUM. What powders will work safely for you depends stongly on the size case you are loading.
The second pressure spike phenomenon that Unclenick mentioned seems to occur with powders that are too slow for light bullets in big cases. It is not well understood (or even universally believed), but seems to be able to occur with some loads listed in manuals. So, substituting an even lighter bullet in a load recipe for a light bullet in a big case with a relatively slow powder may not be as safe as one would assume.
Without knowing the size of your case, it is not clear if 3031 is slow or not in your application.
SL1
Well, 3031 does not seem to be on the slow side for the .30-30, so I don't see any red flags here with loading the lighter bullets. There are .30-30 loads listed for 100 grain bullets.
I don't shoot that cartridge, but I have seen old Contender loads with faster powders like IMR-4227. Speer manual #10 lists 16.0 gr start and 18.0 gr max with 110 gr bullets, so you should be fine with this fast powder and lighter bullets, if you decide to go that way.
Unclenick, do you have any more thoughts?
SL1
I don't shoot that cartridge, but I have seen old Contender loads with faster powders like IMR-4227. Speer manual #10 lists 16.0 gr start and 18.0 gr max with 110 gr bullets, so you should be fine with this fast powder and lighter bullets, if you decide to go that way.
Unclenick, do you have any more thoughts?
SL1
The Lovemaster
New member
Wow, charcoal briquets for targets, what a great idea! 
Thanks
The only reason I have even considered these loads is that I saw some Hornady 90 grainers on a friend's reloading bench. He uses them for one of his handguns. He said he would give me a few to try if I wanted to.
We have a lot of jackrabbits around here. If my rifle shoots them well they would be dynamite on those bunnies.
The only reason I have even considered these loads is that I saw some Hornady 90 grainers on a friend's reloading bench. He uses them for one of his handguns. He said he would give me a few to try if I wanted to.
We have a lot of jackrabbits around here. If my rifle shoots them well they would be dynamite on those bunnies.
I have loaded the lighter bullets in 30-30 for a Contender 10 inch barrel.
The only thing that worked reasonably well was H110. It was fast enough to burn it self in that short of barrel but I never went lighter than 110 Gr weight bullets and only pushed them to arund 1700fps.
I wish you luck.
The only thing that worked reasonably well was H110. It was fast enough to burn it self in that short of barrel but I never went lighter than 110 Gr weight bullets and only pushed them to arund 1700fps.
I wish you luck.
light weight .30 cal
Two things come to mind if you are looking for lightweight .30 cal to shoot; the first is to resize .32 ACP bullets using a Lee Sizing die #90037. 60 grain hollowpoints are available - Hornady XTP hollowpoints, for example. A couple of passes through to compensate for springback should do the trick, according to Lee. That's a pretty light bullet for plinking or whatever.
In addition, there are chamber sleeves that allow you to fire .32 ACP directly; Sportsmans Guide,
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/32-acp-rifle-chamber-insert?a=471502
has them for about $15.00. Can't get much lower recoil than that, and you can practice with a known-working round and switch to handloads when in the field. They're available for .30-06, .308, and .303; there are probably others; Google chamber sleeves or chamber inserts.
The second is to use sabots for .308 diameter bores, and use .224 bullets in the sabot. You can get, for example, 40 grain or 45 grain spitzer boattails, with decent BC's for downrange performance - the .32's are practically round ball - and when you add the ~15 grains of the sabot, you are loading for a 55-60 grain payload. You could even use cast bullets, because the nylon sabot won't lead the bore - the bullet never contacts the rifling. Or go lead free, down to 35 grain Hornadys
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/97...24-diameter-35-grain-ntx-lead-free-box-of-100
You can get the sabots for about 8 cents each:
http://www.jdcomponents.com/prices/prices.html
And dies, load information, neck flarers, etc. are available at:
http://www.eabco.com/remington-accelerator-sabots.html
FWIW.
Cheers,
George Steele
Two things come to mind if you are looking for lightweight .30 cal to shoot; the first is to resize .32 ACP bullets using a Lee Sizing die #90037. 60 grain hollowpoints are available - Hornady XTP hollowpoints, for example. A couple of passes through to compensate for springback should do the trick, according to Lee. That's a pretty light bullet for plinking or whatever.
In addition, there are chamber sleeves that allow you to fire .32 ACP directly; Sportsmans Guide,
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/32-acp-rifle-chamber-insert?a=471502
has them for about $15.00. Can't get much lower recoil than that, and you can practice with a known-working round and switch to handloads when in the field. They're available for .30-06, .308, and .303; there are probably others; Google chamber sleeves or chamber inserts.
The second is to use sabots for .308 diameter bores, and use .224 bullets in the sabot. You can get, for example, 40 grain or 45 grain spitzer boattails, with decent BC's for downrange performance - the .32's are practically round ball - and when you add the ~15 grains of the sabot, you are loading for a 55-60 grain payload. You could even use cast bullets, because the nylon sabot won't lead the bore - the bullet never contacts the rifling. Or go lead free, down to 35 grain Hornadys
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/97...24-diameter-35-grain-ntx-lead-free-box-of-100
You can get the sabots for about 8 cents each:
http://www.jdcomponents.com/prices/prices.html
And dies, load information, neck flarers, etc. are available at:
http://www.eabco.com/remington-accelerator-sabots.html
FWIW.
Cheers,
George Steele
Having used some of these for 30 carbine.. here's the good and the bad.
90 Gr. XTP measures .309 They may cause chambering problems depending on how tight your gun's throat is. But you can drive them to at least 2200 fps and they'll hold together.
I've driven the Sierra 85 gr. bullets to the full 2450+ and they work great in a carbine. Beyond that is anyones guess.
Speer part #1835 110 gr. varminter HP can be driven to 30-30 book max. according to Speer 13.
The Hornady 86 gr. SHOULD hold up to 2400+ fps due to the base.. the lead won't touch the bore. Haven't tried them yet but from the ones I've seen, the copper cup seems thick enough to do the job.
90 Gr. XTP measures .309 They may cause chambering problems depending on how tight your gun's throat is. But you can drive them to at least 2200 fps and they'll hold together.
I've driven the Sierra 85 gr. bullets to the full 2450+ and they work great in a carbine. Beyond that is anyones guess.
Speer part #1835 110 gr. varminter HP can be driven to 30-30 book max. according to Speer 13.
The Hornady 86 gr. SHOULD hold up to 2400+ fps due to the base.. the lead won't touch the bore. Haven't tried them yet but from the ones I've seen, the copper cup seems thick enough to do the job.
Years ago I bought a life-time supply of .30 Cal. Carbine bullets (110 gr FMJ) at a nickle a piece. I've used them over the years in .30-30, .30-06, .30-40, .30 Carbine and .30 Luger. In the 06 and .30-40, those little pills produced near MOA groups and at 100 yds too.
Zero recoil, low noise, accurate...and fun to shoot with new shooters or those who can't handle a lot of muzzle blast and recoil.
My powder of choice is SR4759, but 4227 or 2400 work equally well. In the big cases, I load for a muzzle velocity of ~1500 fps. In the carbine, I match the WWll government load of ~1900 fps. The carbines (3 of them) will do an honest 1.5" gp at 50 yds.
HTH's Rod
Zero recoil, low noise, accurate...and fun to shoot with new shooters or those who can't handle a lot of muzzle blast and recoil.
My powder of choice is SR4759, but 4227 or 2400 work equally well. In the big cases, I load for a muzzle velocity of ~1500 fps. In the carbine, I match the WWll government load of ~1900 fps. The carbines (3 of them) will do an honest 1.5" gp at 50 yds.
HTH's Rod
Interesting
I have long had a curiosity as to the range of bullet weights that could be fired successfully and usefully using a .30-06 as a baseline cartridge. .30-30 and M1 Carbine loads are also on the to do list - the latter for handgun, as well.
Thus my comments above regarding use of a sabot and light .22 caliber bullets - much as Remington released years ago in their Accelerator line of sabot-based ammunition. There were some complaints about Accelerator accuracy, although the rounds were reputed to have muzzle velocities exceeding that of a .220 Swift (with 55 grain bullets - not the lightweight 40 grain Swift). Never chronographed either back then, but now I have some time. I still have 3 1/2 boxes of them left to test, analyze, measure, and work up handloads of comparable performance with currently available sabots and .22 bullets.
It's interesting to hear of successes that people on this forum have had with various bullets and loads. I am champing at the bit waiting for some better weather to get out with a chronograph and to do some testing. Thanks for all the tips.
I have long had a curiosity as to the range of bullet weights that could be fired successfully and usefully using a .30-06 as a baseline cartridge. .30-30 and M1 Carbine loads are also on the to do list - the latter for handgun, as well.
Thus my comments above regarding use of a sabot and light .22 caliber bullets - much as Remington released years ago in their Accelerator line of sabot-based ammunition. There were some complaints about Accelerator accuracy, although the rounds were reputed to have muzzle velocities exceeding that of a .220 Swift (with 55 grain bullets - not the lightweight 40 grain Swift). Never chronographed either back then, but now I have some time. I still have 3 1/2 boxes of them left to test, analyze, measure, and work up handloads of comparable performance with currently available sabots and .22 bullets.
It's interesting to hear of successes that people on this forum have had with various bullets and loads. I am champing at the bit waiting for some better weather to get out with a chronograph and to do some testing. Thanks for all the tips.
For a 30-30, I think that a 110carbine bullet in either jacketed or SP is ideal. It was meant for 2,000 fps or so, but can go into any non magnum range. Long bearing surface helps accuracy over lighter bullets.
I used unique light charges in 30-06. 2400, 4227, trail boss, or even other rifle powders.
I would not use anything lighter than these carbine bullet, especially those me and for pistols. The little bullets work fine, I suppose up to an 06 case, but using them in any larger cases strike me as being just a bad idea
I used unique light charges in 30-06. 2400, 4227, trail boss, or even other rifle powders.
I would not use anything lighter than these carbine bullet, especially those me and for pistols. The little bullets work fine, I suppose up to an 06 case, but using them in any larger cases strike me as being just a bad idea