I have found the best way to choose a primer is to try a verity. I will test a few loads and when I find the best 5-10 shot group. That is where I will try a few different brand primers to see If I can see a difference between them with a good 10 shot group. Then I stock up on the best primer and continue working up loads. In the past it has worked for me. What do you think?
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Lets talk primers
- Thread starter Longshot4
- Start date
I've never used anything but CCI for decades. Then when the shortages hit, I was forced to use Federal (both Match and regular) and Winchester.
They all seem to shoot the same to me.
I've done tests with 38 target loads using CCI 500, Winchester WSP, and Federal Match primers (identical loads, except for the primer). They all shot straight ("straight" is almost entirely a function of the bullet choice itself - at least in the 38 target world). The only difference was slight variations in velocity and standard deviation. But the results were not really significant, with the possible exception that the Fed Match primers may have been a little more consistent.
But they all lit the powder, and all the bullets went right were I pointed them.
They all seem to shoot the same to me.
I've done tests with 38 target loads using CCI 500, Winchester WSP, and Federal Match primers (identical loads, except for the primer). They all shot straight ("straight" is almost entirely a function of the bullet choice itself - at least in the 38 target world). The only difference was slight variations in velocity and standard deviation. But the results were not really significant, with the possible exception that the Fed Match primers may have been a little more consistent.
But they all lit the powder, and all the bullets went right were I pointed them.
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That's pretty much the way I choose primers, but most of my hunting rifles show little difference to primers. The exception is my Ruger #1 .45-70 where some loads show unburned powder or excessive residue I'll switch to a magnum or "hotter" brand.
BUT all load publishers recommend that on upper level loads drop down 10% & work back up when changing any component, including the primer. Good advice, but I'm not sure everyone follows that.
When I have a choice, I always buy CCI.
FWIW...
...bug
BUT all load publishers recommend that on upper level loads drop down 10% & work back up when changing any component, including the primer. Good advice, but I'm not sure everyone follows that.
When I have a choice, I always buy CCI.
FWIW...
...bug
Sure Shot Mc Gee
New member
Nope!! Federal for me. Hottest primmer that I know of. Then Winchester brand. Don't swap out primers anymore. Just use what I have. KISS I'm a believer of.
Reloader270
New member
Never had one misfire from thousands of loads with Federal. Cannot say this from other brands, especially in revolver and my Marlin .357Mag Rifle.
My primer choice is usually based on seating and hardness. I have never been able to find a discernible difference in accuracy among primers. But I have found inconsistencies with size and anvil depth, but I assume that works itself out in seating anyways. Favorite all-around primer is cci magnum, I use it in everything between 9mm to 300blk. I prefer tulammo kpv for small rifle because they are hotter than the others and I use Winchester for large rifle because they are soft and primer pockets between 54r vary a lot. I had one batch of bad primers in my life and they were Remingtons, I am sure they make a fine product, but I had a bad experience that I have never experienced with the others, so I haven't gone back. Good luck on your testing
Machineguntony
New member
In a blind taste test of primers, I couldn't tell the difference, and neither could any of my guns tell the difference. They just ate them all and went, burp bang.
9MMand223only
New member
On my primer tray, that I use to dump the primers onto, then use a pickup tube to fill my dillon, the only primer brand that seems to have a clue is CCI.
The federal & rem has their primers in sideways, so you can't place them on a tray, you have to do it one by one.
The CCI you just place the tray flat against the primer tray, and they all go perfectly flat, and I can pickup immediately.
Federal and Remington is such a hassle if you use a pickup tube, that it simply makes buying them, not an option, too much hassle.
I shot thousands and thousands of each in 9 MM and 223, and I can't tell the difference with any of them, whether it be MATCH, non match, normal, you name it. All shoots the same accuracy.
The federal & rem has their primers in sideways, so you can't place them on a tray, you have to do it one by one.
The CCI you just place the tray flat against the primer tray, and they all go perfectly flat, and I can pickup immediately.
Federal and Remington is such a hassle if you use a pickup tube, that it simply makes buying them, not an option, too much hassle.
I shot thousands and thousands of each in 9 MM and 223, and I can't tell the difference with any of them, whether it be MATCH, non match, normal, you name it. All shoots the same accuracy.
condor bravo
New member
Re: posts #5 &6
Are Federal primers the "hottest" (from post #5) or are the primer cups just more sensitive? I assume you are aware of why Federal primers are now packed in their larger boxes rather than the previous small boxes that all other primers are still packed in. For those who don't, a Fed Ex or UPS driver, who was transporting a quantity of Federal primers packed in their original boxes, was killed when the truck hit a sharp bump and the primer contents exploded. Hence the current boxes that provide more cushion. The Federals are more sensitive.
Are Federal primers the "hottest" (from post #5) or are the primer cups just more sensitive? I assume you are aware of why Federal primers are now packed in their larger boxes rather than the previous small boxes that all other primers are still packed in. For those who don't, a Fed Ex or UPS driver, who was transporting a quantity of Federal primers packed in their original boxes, was killed when the truck hit a sharp bump and the primer contents exploded. Hence the current boxes that provide more cushion. The Federals are more sensitive.
As far as the difference in accuracy goes. When I load for big game under 200 Yds. I won't worry much about accuracy. After all a 1 1/2"- 2" group should do just fine at 100 Yds. But for target or varmints I want the best accuracy I can get. Those are the loads that I will select primers carefully. I have seen clear differences with primers with group size. I have seen CCI do well but at this time it is Remington. I really don't care much who makes them as long as they are accurate and I can find them. Around here the primers are usually Win., Rem. or CCI and even they are not always available.
nemesiss45
New member
I use what i can find, but i always get remongton when i can.
I think evaluating primers for uniformity in flash and heat to burn powder by using shot group sizes that are larger than 1/2 inch at 100 yards is a waste of time, components and barrel life. Too many other variables mask that of the primers.
Instead, use a chronograph properly and pick the primer that produces the lowest velocity spread. Set the rifle up to shoot free recoil backwards exactly the same for each shot. A 1" thick medium foam pad between your shoulder and the butt plate should absorb the recoil. Don't get concerned about accuracy; just shoot bullets reasonably centered in the screens.
Instead, use a chronograph properly and pick the primer that produces the lowest velocity spread. Set the rifle up to shoot free recoil backwards exactly the same for each shot. A 1" thick medium foam pad between your shoulder and the butt plate should absorb the recoil. Don't get concerned about accuracy; just shoot bullets reasonably centered in the screens.
Bart: I have been loading for a long time and I have never had option of purchasing a chronograph. Firing good loads with different primers is simple and it will show the more consistent firing primers. I like to keep it simple. Although I'm sure your way will work. It is just more costly.
4runnerman
New member
I use CCI-450's,BR-4 and BR-2 in everything but the 308. The 308 gets GM210M primers. I just did a load work up for my bosses Rem 308 tac. With GM210M primers we would get .5 or less groups at 100 yards, Went ( with same load) and CCI-BR2's and GM215. Same load opened up to 5 inches just like that.
A few years ago I was shooting my 223. 25.5 gns Varget and 60 gn Honady A-Max with Rem 7 1/2 bench primers. Shot real nice, then I loaded same load with CCI-BR4 primers. Needless to say groups went to shooting pencils in half at 100 yards,playing Tic Tac Toe with 9MM case at 100 yards. Primers do make a big difference on accuracy, but it is the last component that I change in load work up. I do not use Rem primers in anything any more, I just feel it is a substandard primer now along with Rem Brass and Bullets. There quality has gone down the tubes it seems.
A few years ago I was shooting my 223. 25.5 gns Varget and 60 gn Honady A-Max with Rem 7 1/2 bench primers. Shot real nice, then I loaded same load with CCI-BR4 primers. Needless to say groups went to shooting pencils in half at 100 yards,playing Tic Tac Toe with 9MM case at 100 yards. Primers do make a big difference on accuracy, but it is the last component that I change in load work up. I do not use Rem primers in anything any more, I just feel it is a substandard primer now along with Rem Brass and Bullets. There quality has gone down the tubes it seems.
A year ago I would have said don't bother, but my shooting buddy tried 6 different small rifle primers on a best load for his .22 Hornet.
He has gotten incredible accuracy out of each of his three .22 Hornets and knows the rifles and the loads that get the best out of each of them.
Turns out that there was a pretty significant difference between the results with the primers he tested.
He used CCI # 400 and BR primers, Federal 205 and 205M primers, and Remington #6 1/2 and # 7 1/2 primers.
He was very meticulous in preparing the loads and shot a large enough number of groups with each test sample to be statistically significant.
The 205M Federal match primers showed a consistent accuracy improvement over all the other primers.
The 205M primers were the only standout in his rifle. All the others were about the same.
He has gotten incredible accuracy out of each of his three .22 Hornets and knows the rifles and the loads that get the best out of each of them.
Turns out that there was a pretty significant difference between the results with the primers he tested.
He used CCI # 400 and BR primers, Federal 205 and 205M primers, and Remington #6 1/2 and # 7 1/2 primers.
He was very meticulous in preparing the loads and shot a large enough number of groups with each test sample to be statistically significant.
The 205M Federal match primers showed a consistent accuracy improvement over all the other primers.
The 205M primers were the only standout in his rifle. All the others were about the same.
Primer comparisons and other information:
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/p/articles-index.html
Scroll down to the section headed "Primers."
Longshot4, my primer testing was nothing more than shooting 15-shot groups at long range in cool weather from an F-class prone position. I compared a lot of them to RWS-5341 large rifle primers which gave me best accuracy in such tests.
I've never owned a chronograph, but borrowed one a few times years ago. I mention testing them shooting rifles in free recoil because one typically gets 1/3rd or less the velocity spread that way than holding the rifle against their shoulder.
http://riflemansjournal.blogspot.com/p/articles-index.html
Scroll down to the section headed "Primers."
Longshot4, my primer testing was nothing more than shooting 15-shot groups at long range in cool weather from an F-class prone position. I compared a lot of them to RWS-5341 large rifle primers which gave me best accuracy in such tests.
I've never owned a chronograph, but borrowed one a few times years ago. I mention testing them shooting rifles in free recoil because one typically gets 1/3rd or less the velocity spread that way than holding the rifle against their shoulder.
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Bart: You sure have a knack to bring to the table some good information. I was hoping to get some detail and the BlogSpot sure was interesting. Also Thanks to the rest of you for sharing your experiences with the primers. If nothing else I believe that primer selection is a important part of the loading for accuracy.