Left handed shooting a right handed bolt gun

T

tangolima

New member
I am right handed, and my friend is left handed. He has been shooting his right handed bolt gun going-around-the-tree.

The other day at the range, another left handed shooter was eager to demonstrate the way he shot his right-handed rifle. He worked the bolt with his non-firing (right) hand. He claimed he could shoot much faster as his trigger finger is always on the trigger, ready to go. He was a bit upset when I told him it might not be a safe thing to do. The bolt gun doesn't has disconnector. The gun can fire out of battery if his trigger finger goes a tiny bit too fast.

Did I doze off his enthusiasm incorrectly?

Your comments are much appreciated.

-TL
 
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I'm with you(shoot long guns left. Been saying it's a throw back to a former life as a cavalry officer. Carbine left. Sabre right. snicker.) Fingers off the trigger until you're ready to shoot. Speed is not an issue with hunting rifles. Safety on a range is always an issue.
 
The technique is useful IF the finger is off the trigger while cycling the bolt.

I think that is one of the basic rules, is it not?
 
Jo6pak said:
The technique is useful IF the finger is off the trigger while cycling the bolt.

I think that is one of the basic rules, is it not?
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Not when you are shooting semi auto or pump. Not when you are shooting a bolt gun and you follow through.

I am afraid he was trying to beat an auto loader with his bolt gun.

Besides, I don't see his technique would work well in the field. You need a hand on the forend to steady the rifle.

-TL
 
I have shot that way for years, it is effective and safe if you understand the mechanics of the firearm.
 
I guess it would help to see a video of. And if the rifle is cock on open or close. Cock on opening would make it really easy and seem safer.

Unless it's really unsafe i'm not going to step on a left hander in a right world.

I was buying a shotgun for my wife. She's small and not use to guns but I asked for a youth mossberg 500 at the store and she held it up and said it fit ok. Then the counter woman commented "you're doing it all wrong honey". I explained she was left handed and the woman looked at her like she was one of Jerry's kids.

We left and eventually bought the same model shotgun at another place.

She likes my 22lr bolt guns but fumbles a bit and has a good deal of fun so I bought her a break action 22lr and she shoots it as much as possible. This encouraged me to pick up a Winchester 94 in 30-30 and she runs that all day long if you let her.

Lesson is keep a lefty happy and you'll have someone to shoot with. Don't and you're all alone.

Besides this lets me buy even more guns. It's for you honey I swear.
 
My brother shoots right handed guns lefty. He uses his right hand to work the bolt. He is quite fast, and accurate, but doesn't keep his finger inside the triggerguard either. If I were lefty that is the way I'd do it too.
 
Actually, in short, that is one of the techniques for a lefty to run a bolt gun. From a supported position it can be very fast if the person has been properly trained and practiced. From an unsupported position i.e. offhand it is best to hold the rifle with at the forend with the right hand rotate the rifle and cycle the bolt with the primary (left) hand. These techniques are taught to lefties by, military, LE and by the NRA.
 
Nothing unsafe about running the bolt with your off hand. Assuming a cock on opening rifle, a bolt gun can't fire unless the bolt is closed, ie, no firing out of battery. Also, if one has a major brain malfunction and doesn't release the trigger from the last shot, the rifle will uncock when closing the bolt. Despite being a correct handed person, I've been using right handed bolt guns that way for 50+ years and it's a non-issue.
 
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One question I have, is he doing this unsupported or off a rest ?
I am right handed, but left eye dominant, so I shoot southpaw, I reach over with my left hand to operate the bolt and it does not slow me down, I use a Swiss 1911, which is a straight pull action, in matches and have no problem getting off 10 aimed shots at 200yrds, with a reload from a Swiss speed loader in 70 seconds, Only problem I have with it is I work the action so fast that I fling brass 6 to 10 feet behind and to the left of me. I shoot all long guns left, pistol I can shoot as well using either hand.
 
burrhead said:
Nothing unsafe about running the bolt with your off hand. Assuming a cock on opening rifle, a bolt gun can't fire unless the bolt is closed, ie, no firing out of battery. Also, if one has a major brain malfunction and doesn't release the trigger from the last shot, the rifle will uncock when closing the bolt. Despite being a correct handed person, I've been using right handed bolt guns that way for 50+ years and it's a non-issue.
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Either cock on open or on close, there is cocking cam in front of the cocking piece. It is this cam that blocks the striker from fully protruding, unless the bolt is fully closed. Between fully open and fully open, there is a point where the striker would have enough protrusion to ignite the primer. If we define out-of-battery ignition as anything short of fully lock up, out-of-battery ignition is not impossible.

I am sure the guy we met at the range didn't invent this technique. There must be other people who have shot this way. Is it safe? Different people have different takes. To me, it is not safe enough.

-TL
 
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Dragonflydf said:
One question I have, is he doing this unsupported or off a rest ?
I am right handed, but left eye dominant, so I shoot southpaw, I reach over with my left hand to operate the bolt and it does not slow me down, I use a Swiss 1911, which is a straight pull action, in matches and have no problem getting off 10 aimed shots at 200yrds, with a reload from a Swiss speed loader in 70 seconds, Only problem I have with it is I work the action so fast that I fling brass 6 to 10 feet behind and to the left of me. I shoot all long guns left, pistol I can shoot as well using either hand.
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He was showing us on a rest. I don't know how well he could do it unsupported.

Reaching over is what I call "going around the tree". It is safe and could be as fast if you are good at it. Of course it is only my opinion.

-TL
 
I've been going around that tree my whole life and really don't take well to lefty bolts. I prefer to shoot as I was taught. I sometimes shoot like a righty anyway....,just a little slower is all.
 
My brother actually bought a left handed bolt rifle years ago. He was so used to shooting the right handed gun from the other side that he preferred that. Another reason is the limited number of options in a lefty bolt gun. He just liked the options available for right handed shooters better.

He has no problem operating the bolt with his right hand even off-hand. As long as the rifle isn't very muzzle heavy it is still supported by both his shoulder and his left hand on the grip. I practice shooting my right handed bolt rifles from the wrong side from time to time. Sometimes when hunting if game approaches from an odd angle it is easier to just shoot from the other shoulder than try to reposition. It isn't that hard with some practice. But like anything else, it does require practice.
 
I am right handed, shoot left handed do to poor vision in my right eye. My bench rifle is a Rem 700. Very comfortable running the bolt with my right hand, but never put my finger on the trigger until I'm ready to take the shot
 
tangolima said:
Besides, I don't see his technique would work well in the field. You need a hand on the forend to steady the rifle.
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Actually it works quite well in the field. The rifle is supported by a firm grip with the left hand, or by tucking the buttstock under the armpit a little.
The biggest danger is getting the left thumb out of the way of the bolt, with a bit of practice it becomes second nature.
As I mentioned the trigger finger is outside the guard while working the action.

I'm ambidextrous, and grew up shooting primarily left handed. When I learned in my late teens that I was right-eye dominant, I switchd to mainly shooting right handed; but I can still switch to south-paw without difficulty
 
I'm a lefty and, at this time, all my bolt guns are right handed.

If I'm shooting off a bench or solid rest I tend to use my right hand to operate the bolt.

Off-hand I'm likely as not going to "tip and reach", but it just depends on the "moment". I've done it both ways.

For me it's always been about comfort/convenience… not speed… never had the "need for speed"... range or field with a bolt gun.

Although I'm left eye dominant… I do shoot right shoulder often without any noticeable deficit. Some of that has to do with having to qualify at work "strong hand/weak hand, strong side/weak side with pistol and long gun / shotgun. That being said birds, winged or clay is always left side for me.

"Finger off the trigger" SHOULD be a given regardless.
Mike
 
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The key is finger out of the trigger guard when the bolt is being worked. It is not automatically done unless the shooter is deliberately trained. I took issue with the gentleman at the range because his finger was on the trigger all the time, "ready to go", perhaps thinking he was firing an auto loader.

I wonder why almost all right handed guns have their handles on the right hand side, bolt or auto. Isn't it more "convenient" and "faster" to have them on the left? I believe there is a good reason for this seemingly "duh" feature. It forces the shooter's finger off the trigger when the bolt is being worked. Please don't get mad; it is the way it is supposed to work.

From time to time I see guys at the range shooting AK. Cool as tough guy in movie, he turns the rifle side way and works the op handle with his left hand, while right hand holding the pistol grip. The muzzle is pointing down range alright, but I can't tell whether his finger is off the trigger. Just don't think it is cool as it looks.

-TL
 
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I'm a cross-dominate shooter as well and since my right eye is my weaker eye, I can't focus on a target / sight for long so I've always shot left-handed. I too use my support hand to work the bolt when shooting a right-handed bolt action rifle. It allows me to keep the gun shouldered with only a very slight cant when working the bolt while also being able to visually follow the game. Follow up shots are quick as since I'm tracking the game, by the time the support hand gets back to where it needs to be, I'm already on target for the next shot if needed. The weight of the rifle is of no concern as I do this on the recoil end while the muzzle is slightly elevated as it's easier and quicker to let the gun fall into the support hand then to try to raise the rifle back on target. Numerous times, I've taken two deer at once so it is an effective method but I don't leave my finger on the trigger when doing it.
 
Actually it works quite well in the field. The rifle is supported by a firm grip with the left hand, or by tucking the buttstock under the armpit a little.
The biggest danger is getting the left thumb out of the way of the bolt, with a bit of practice it becomes second nature.
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If it's speed your after, keeping the gun shouldered and eyes on target with the sights aligned (meaning cheek on the stock) is more important than having your finger ready to hit the trigger. It'll also keep you from anticipating the shot (bad follow-through/chicken necking) .... it takes more time to get the gun shouldered, get a good cheek weld, aquire the target and align the sights than it does to move the hand that just worked the bolt to the trigger and squeeze it...... it's simpler operation, because there are fewer steps and the trigger is always in the same place in space in relation to the bolt knob. The same can not be said for the gun and shoulder (different positions) or the sights and target (especially if it's moving). .....and even as the shooter using his support hand to get the bolt closed and his finger is poised to squeeze the trigger, he still has to bring his support hand back across the gun, forward to the forearm of the stock, (pull the gun out of his armpit if he put it there to keep the gun pointed downrange) re-shoulder the gun, reaquire the target and align the sights .... and this whole time the trigger finger is ...... waiting?

Sounds kinda complicated and herky-jerky to me. "Simple+Smooth=Fast"

The biggest danger is getting the left thumb out of the way of the bolt, with a bit of practice it becomes second nature.
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With some guns (various Mauser designs), having your thumb around the wrist of the stock is a recipe for pain and fluid leakage, if you get apierced primer .... it's safer to keep the thumb alongside the stock, pointing at the target .... faster, too.

Now an individual that has extensively practiced to the point he has established "muscle memory) may be faster doing it "wrong" than if he did it "right" ..... but if he put the same amount of practice doing it "right", he'd be faster that way.
 
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