Lathe - what to buy?
- Thread starter acloco
- Start date
A used Southbend 9 or 10" lathe with a minimum bed of 36" would be a good starting point. A larger Southbend like a 13" x 40" or a Heavy 10 would be even better, but the 9 or 10 would work fine. Used Clausing lathes would be fine also.
A collet set is nice, but it is not a requirement. A 3-jaw chuck, a 4-jaw chuck, and a steady rest are sufficient for 98% of a gunsmith's needs.
A used machine like the 9" SB would cost you somewhere in the neighborhood of $1750 in good condition. Add a quick change toolpost for another $150, and you have a great piece of machinery.
Clemson
A collet set is nice, but it is not a requirement. A 3-jaw chuck, a 4-jaw chuck, and a steady rest are sufficient for 98% of a gunsmith's needs.
A used machine like the 9" SB would cost you somewhere in the neighborhood of $1750 in good condition. Add a quick change toolpost for another $150, and you have a great piece of machinery.
Clemson
Harry Bonar
New member
lathe
Sir:
The best equipment for my money is Grizzley. Yes, they're made in China.
But, their made to U.S. specs. I have a Grizzley mill and 12x36 lathe.
The mill has no run-out at all, light, power feed longitudinal, coolant, drill chuck, set of R-8 collets, a super machine, the lathe with the 3-jaw that came on it ran-out was .001 and the workpiece the same. Unheard of!
I have a Grizzley belt sander and a belt sander, both perfect! I totally pleased with everything and really like them! You couldn't do better!
Very good quality and the mill comes with a good drill chuck, a fine vise, some other adapterts for drills etc. Both were well packed for shipping and there was no shipping damage. the lathe was $2,000 and the big mill was $3.000.
A motor went bad on the lathe and they promptly shipped another motor, no charge!
I've used the lathe extensively and was amazed at the quality and alighnment, ditto with the mill.
With the lathe you get a 4 jaw chuck, tool kit and other items. It is just really great. D1-4 Attatchments for both chucks.
Look up Grizzley on your computer. They're very good on guarantee!
Harry B.
Sir:
The best equipment for my money is Grizzley. Yes, they're made in China.
But, their made to U.S. specs. I have a Grizzley mill and 12x36 lathe.
The mill has no run-out at all, light, power feed longitudinal, coolant, drill chuck, set of R-8 collets, a super machine, the lathe with the 3-jaw that came on it ran-out was .001 and the workpiece the same. Unheard of!
I have a Grizzley belt sander and a belt sander, both perfect! I totally pleased with everything and really like them! You couldn't do better!
Very good quality and the mill comes with a good drill chuck, a fine vise, some other adapterts for drills etc. Both were well packed for shipping and there was no shipping damage. the lathe was $2,000 and the big mill was $3.000.
A motor went bad on the lathe and they promptly shipped another motor, no charge!
I've used the lathe extensively and was amazed at the quality and alighnment, ditto with the mill.
With the lathe you get a 4 jaw chuck, tool kit and other items. It is just really great. D1-4 Attatchments for both chucks.
Look up Grizzley on your computer. They're very good on guarantee!
Harry B.
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I have 3 lathes now for guns.
It is like getting married.
If you knew what were getting into, you would never do it.
Society would fail.
Gunsmithing would cease.
So you just have to get the best lathe you can and learn how to use it.
I have put ~15 chamber and barrel projects together.
Two weeks ago, I got a 0.2 moa first group from a rifle built on a $700 1938 Atlas Craftsman lathe.
If I can do it on that lathe, you can do it on most any gunsmithing lathe.
It is like getting married.
If you knew what were getting into, you would never do it.
Society would fail.
Gunsmithing would cease.
So you just have to get the best lathe you can and learn how to use it.
I have put ~15 chamber and barrel projects together.
Two weeks ago, I got a 0.2 moa first group from a rifle built on a $700 1938 Atlas Craftsman lathe.
If I can do it on that lathe, you can do it on most any gunsmithing lathe.
If you are in central Florida (or don't mind shipping) and don't mind doing a little work to it, I know where you can get a Monarch tool maker's lathe for a VERY good price. This is a 10x20 1985 Lathe and was rpobably about $100,000 back in the day. I can get more details if you need, If i recall it had some electrical gremlins but you could convert it over and have a VERY precise lathe. I will find out more if you want. I am talking a very good deal if you can do the work. It would probably cost you about $1200 to come and get it yourself. It weighs 3000 pounds. It is a solid piece of American Iron.
Also I have been fairly happy working on a Sharp 14x40. I can hold +/- .0005 on it easily and I am only a student with my 3/4 OCP certifications. (Maybe a year or so experience, although half of that is running CNC machines and 1/4 is doing book work/watching videos.) Harbor freight sells a copy off of the Sharpe 14x40 with a Accurite DRO for $5000 without the DRO for $4000.
Also I have been fairly happy working on a Sharp 14x40. I can hold +/- .0005 on it easily and I am only a student with my 3/4 OCP certifications. (Maybe a year or so experience, although half of that is running CNC machines and 1/4 is doing book work/watching videos.) Harbor freight sells a copy off of the Sharpe 14x40 with a Accurite DRO for $5000 without the DRO for $4000.
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+1 Grizzley
I've used my Grizzly 13 X 40 belt drive for several years now and have been very pleased with it. Never turned out a barrel I wasn't happy with. Most recently I had a guy come back to me and showed me pics of the Elk he shot with his 338 RUM at 932 yards.
One shot One kill. That gun shoot under .5 moa.
I've used my Grizzly 13 X 40 belt drive for several years now and have been very pleased with it. Never turned out a barrel I wasn't happy with. Most recently I had a guy come back to me and showed me pics of the Elk he shot with his 338 RUM at 932 yards.
One shot One kill. That gun shoot under .5 moa.Harry Bonar
New member
lathe
Sir:
I've seen yours in my catalog; belt drive is a little smoother than a gear head! Mine gives a very smooth cut for a gear head.
Harry B.
Sir:
I've seen yours in my catalog; belt drive is a little smoother than a gear head! Mine gives a very smooth cut for a gear head.
Harry B.
HisSoldier
New member
Get a Dorian or Aloris tool post. They are the standard of serious machine shops for manual lathes. Remember, every time you do something a few seconds faster you win, anything that slows you down ends up costing you time, and unlike money you only have a certain amount of time in your life. Don't waste money or time on an oriental knockoff toolpost, you'll remember me kindly if you take that advice.
If you get a tool post, try for the expanding wedge style, as opposed to the 'piston' style.
The expanding wedge type pulls the tool towards the post when tightened and reduces the overhang and has a larger contact area.
The piston type pushes the tool away from the post and create a longer lever for chatter and has less contact area.
The expanding wedge type pulls the tool towards the post when tightened and reduces the overhang and has a larger contact area.
The piston type pushes the tool away from the post and create a longer lever for chatter and has less contact area.
+1 on the Dorian tool holder. Love it. It is the expanding wedged dovetail type. I also like the Eagle knurling tool because it creates pressure between opposing jaws rather than bearing on the spindle from one side.
Chinese lathes are OK if you know their limitations. I got a 13x40 through Enco about 10 years ago. None of the used gear I could get at the time didn't need refiguring, so I concluded a cheap lathe that I could tweak myself would save me time. I used to repair machine tools with another fellow when engineering work was slow, so I had precision levels and a few other tools to help the situation along. I chose the lathe I did because it was the least expensive lathe with a large enough spindle to let me do through-spindle chambering and which had a bed long enough to contour a barrel between centers.
Several items were out of whack at the git go. This lathe is a gap bed lathe and the gap was improperly seated. That just required pulling, cleaning and re-seating and tightening the bolts to correct. The cross slide on the saddle had no stop, and could crash the DRO scale, so I had to add a stop. The saddle gear sump leaked so fast it wouldn't hold oil for a day, so I had to tear that down and add Form-a-gasket to it. The sight glass for spindle oil leaked and had to be sealed with gap-filling super glue. One of the four head alignment screws had stripped threads, so I had to install a Helicoil to repair it. The head needed alignment to improve perpendicularity to the bed. The stand that came with the lathe was so flimsy you could see the whole lathe torque it when the motor started. I wound up building a weld-up frame from 1/4"×2"×2" steel tubing to get that vibration out. I built the frame inside the cabinet, and that gave me the opportunity to add leveling feet, anyway. That, in turn, let me use my super sensitive machine levels to get the bed completely free of twist. Since this was probably not a fully seasoned casting, the leveling feet will allow me to compensate for future stress relief twisting. The motor was, though an American made brand, poorly balanced and its vibration showed up on the work at some spindle speeds as tiny chatter marks. I wound up replacing the motor with a Baldor. I also replaced the motor drive belt with a polyurethane link belt that doesn't transmit vibration well. I've had one electrical failure in the form of the power light. I fixed that.
All in all, a lot of work and tweaking, but most of the setup work would have to have been done with any machine. I didn't have to do any scraping or other figuring. The new spindle was good and runs true. The 6" 3 jaw chuck that came with it had a TIR of 0.0005" for 1" rod, but the scroll doesn't track perfectly, and it is out by up to 0.003" at some diameters. No problem with parallelism of the chuck jaws, though. The D-4 camlock spindle nose seems to be properly made.
Chinese lathes are OK if you know their limitations. I got a 13x40 through Enco about 10 years ago. None of the used gear I could get at the time didn't need refiguring, so I concluded a cheap lathe that I could tweak myself would save me time. I used to repair machine tools with another fellow when engineering work was slow, so I had precision levels and a few other tools to help the situation along. I chose the lathe I did because it was the least expensive lathe with a large enough spindle to let me do through-spindle chambering and which had a bed long enough to contour a barrel between centers.
Several items were out of whack at the git go. This lathe is a gap bed lathe and the gap was improperly seated. That just required pulling, cleaning and re-seating and tightening the bolts to correct. The cross slide on the saddle had no stop, and could crash the DRO scale, so I had to add a stop. The saddle gear sump leaked so fast it wouldn't hold oil for a day, so I had to tear that down and add Form-a-gasket to it. The sight glass for spindle oil leaked and had to be sealed with gap-filling super glue. One of the four head alignment screws had stripped threads, so I had to install a Helicoil to repair it. The head needed alignment to improve perpendicularity to the bed. The stand that came with the lathe was so flimsy you could see the whole lathe torque it when the motor started. I wound up building a weld-up frame from 1/4"×2"×2" steel tubing to get that vibration out. I built the frame inside the cabinet, and that gave me the opportunity to add leveling feet, anyway. That, in turn, let me use my super sensitive machine levels to get the bed completely free of twist. Since this was probably not a fully seasoned casting, the leveling feet will allow me to compensate for future stress relief twisting. The motor was, though an American made brand, poorly balanced and its vibration showed up on the work at some spindle speeds as tiny chatter marks. I wound up replacing the motor with a Baldor. I also replaced the motor drive belt with a polyurethane link belt that doesn't transmit vibration well. I've had one electrical failure in the form of the power light. I fixed that.
All in all, a lot of work and tweaking, but most of the setup work would have to have been done with any machine. I didn't have to do any scraping or other figuring. The new spindle was good and runs true. The 6" 3 jaw chuck that came with it had a TIR of 0.0005" for 1" rod, but the scroll doesn't track perfectly, and it is out by up to 0.003" at some diameters. No problem with parallelism of the chuck jaws, though. The D-4 camlock spindle nose seems to be properly made.
HisSoldier
New member
Unclenick,
Sounds like my experiences with oriental lathes. The lathes I've owned that were made in Taiwan were good. I bought a "Victor" lathe, assuming it was made in Taiwan (Victor is a Taiwanese company). But it was made in china. Piece of junk. I don't want to go into all of it We've been getting our money out of it mostly using it for prepping bars for one CNC lathe. It's accurate for turning OD's, but leaves visible waves on the surface of ID's, and while threading it will suddenly start a thread right down the middle of a partially finished thread. I've torn the threading dial apart, the half nuts, it's a real mystery. 2 1/2" spindle bore though.
Sounds like my experiences with oriental lathes. The lathes I've owned that were made in Taiwan were good. I bought a "Victor" lathe, assuming it was made in Taiwan (Victor is a Taiwanese company). But it was made in china. Piece of junk. I don't want to go into all of it We've been getting our money out of it mostly using it for prepping bars for one CNC lathe. It's accurate for turning OD's, but leaves visible waves on the surface of ID's, and while threading it will suddenly start a thread right down the middle of a partially finished thread. I've torn the threading dial apart, the half nuts, it's a real mystery. 2 1/2" spindle bore though.
Wildalaska
Moderator
We have a pretty big shop. We just got a Clausing, and have two Grizzlies (as well as Haas 4 axis CNC, Bridgeport, Jet)...the machinists are happy with the lathes
WildnihowmahAlaska TM
WildnihowmahAlaska TM