Kalif. unsafe handguns law

madkiwi

New member
The most expensive handgun I would want to buy is a Sig 229. It does not have an external manually operated safety. However, it is a very safe handgun, but Kalifornia is going to ban it as of 12/31? I had heard they were not going to do that because all the cops use Glocks, which would be banned. Of course, laws for the peasants don't apply to the elites.

Is that for real? Pardon my ignorance, up until a few weeks ago I was happy playing with rifles, I only just thought of buying my first pistol.

Madkiwi
 
You could read the bill for youself. If you go to the CA government's web site and search for SB15 (editing is great) and enjoy.

If you go to the California Rifle and Pistol Association's (CRPA) www.crpa.org site, they would probably have an analysis on it.

[This message has been edited by Destructo6 (edited October 14, 2000).]
 
I went to the California government page. It basicly said for any handgun to be sold after jan. 1st 2001 the manufacturer will have to submit 3 pistols of each model they want to sell for safety tests before that model can be sold.Used gun models that are no longer in production will be deemed unsafe ( no tests) and cannot be sold or given to another person. There is an exemption for curios and relics and for law enforcement(i guess these guns are unsafe for us but not for the police).So if you have your heart set on a certain handgun, get it now. After the 1st of the year if it isn't on the safe list your SOL. There is definately going to be a lot less to choose from.The bill by the way is California Senate Bill SB15.
 
The banned list includes all polymer frame guns, including Glocks, any automatic without a manual safety, including Sigs, any semi without a firing pin block, such as Kimbers, and those that remain will have to undergo exhaustive testing. (I am uncertain, but I think there are no existing test facilities except at the manufacturers factories, but I may be wrong on that.) Exceptions are for LEOs. Polymer frame guns will melt and be unsafe for civilains, but will not melt and will only shoot badguys, even if the officer looses hi sfirearm or it is stolen from his/her home. All accidental shootings will cease to happen and become history effective Jan 1.
As for myself, I am so glad we will have no more crime that I will have my first good nights sleep in 55 years.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by railroader:
Used gun models that are no longer in production will be deemed unsafe ( no tests) and cannot be sold or given to another person. There is an exemption for curios and relics and for law enforcement(i guess these guns are unsafe for us but not for the police).[/quote]

There is another SB15 exception to buying "no longer in production" used handguns. Sales between private individuals (via FFL dealer intermediary) are still OK, just no sales of untested used guns can originate with an FFL dealer.


------------------
Just one of the Good Guys

And yes, S&W MUST DIE!
 
Goodguy, what if I want to purchase an out of production handgun from out of state private party thru a FFL, will that still be legal?
 
Sorry, but there's nothing in this new legislation that would ban handguns with polymer frames. While I don't like this legislation, please do not spread false information about it, which stirs up people (including me). If you feel that there *is* something in it that would stop polymer-framed handguns from being sold in California, please quote it for us.
 
Does this include revolvers? I live in Kali, and this really pisses me off. :mad: Good thing I got my Sig P226 earlier this year. I'm not sure what to do in January when it starts firing at random when I'm not home...Maybe Gore's gunowner registation program will help. :mad: :mad:
 
Glocks are in. They already passed the test, the safety accuator on the trigger counts as the external safety.
 
I just posted on the same topic a couple of weeks ago. I discovered, by reading the law, that they need not exclude any guns because LEO is excluded. That takes care of that.

I was interested in buying more guns than I had months, so I needed to know what I could buy after the 1st. So, I called H&K and Ruger and they told me exactly what they were doing.

I doubt that Glock has passed all test. They need to provide three guns of each model. For example a Glock 21 is a different model than a Glock 21c. The manufacturers then need to pay for the testing. Ruger told me that there were not enough testing facilities and it took one day to test each gun. So, a 2" SP-101 would not be the same model as a 3". Any caliber changes also qualifies as another model. Wow, big money and much time! Anything other than cosmetic makes a gun a different model. So, these companies need to pick and choose.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by railroader:
Goodguy, what if I want to purchase an out of production handgun from out of state private party thru a FFL, will that still be legal?[/quote]

After reading the text of SB15, I would say that private party interstate tranfers of used, out of production handguns conducted through a California FFL would be OK as well. At least I hope I'm right. Read it and see what you think....

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Excerpt from SB15

8. Exempts from the transfer limitations in this bill transfers between private parties through dealers/law enforcement agencies; transfers between parties otherwise exempt from the requirement that transfer be made through a dealer or law enforcement agency (limited duration loans between known parties, loans for hunting season, etc); transfers, deliveries, returns to or from an licensed dealer of weapons capable of being concealed under specified conditions; weapons listed as curios and relics, and transfers pertaining to those handguns exempted in new provisions added by this bill (such as delivery to DOJ of weapons being tested).[/quote]


------------------
Just one of the Good Guys

And yes, S&W MUST DIE!

[This message has been edited by Good Guy (edited October 14, 2000).]
 
Gary H.

I, also, would like to buy more guns than
there are months (Calif-one every 30 days).
A Ruger Super Red Hawk is on my list. Can you
tell me what the company's plans are? Thanks
for your time.

Mike
 
hey guys, this is nothing more than the Massachussets laws puked up again in CA. Glocks are not out, give me a break, the text says 'safety device as determined by the BATF' The whole thing is designed to wipe out the 'Valley of Fire' from the San Fernando valley, cheap gun makers, Lorcin, Bryco, Jennings, Davis, Hipoint, all that crap..
 
Here is the current list of legal handguns as of jan. 1, 2001. There are 15 ruger handguns, thats it so far. Thereare .22 autos and revolvers .http://caag.state.ca.us/firearms/certlist.htm
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lunde:
Sorry, but there's nothing in this new legislation that would ban handguns with polymer frames. While I don't like this legislation, please do not spread false information about it, which stirs up people (including me). If you feel that there *is* something in it that would stop polymer-framed handguns from being sold in California, please quote it for us.[/quote]

Lunde,
I was the one who stated that. I tried to go to the CRPA cite to get the exact wording, but the site is temporarily down.
There have been several bills presented in California similar to this one and I may be getting them mixed, but I don't think so.
The part I am thinking of is a high temperature test designed to eliminate firearms made of cheap pot metal. The arm has to withstand x number of hours at y degrees. I recall this temperature being too high for polymer framed guns but aluminum alloy and better steels would do fine.
I will try to get the exact wording, but as I said, it is possible I got the bills mixed up. If so, I am sorry for any confusion.
 
I hope Ruger comes out with Manuel safeties on the P95 and P97 models so that they can be sold in Kalifornia after Jan 1 2001. Anyone know if Ruger plans to do this?
 
Firstly, the law is B.S., but there are a ton of rumors as to what it says; there is no "melting test", also, a manufacturer doesnt have to submit each model of handgun, as long as the different models have similar characteristics, but different calibers may need testing. The text is:

12131.5. (a) A firearm shall be deemed to satisfy the
requirements of subdivision (a) of Section 12131 if another firearm
made by the same manufacturer is already listed and the unlisted
firearm differs from the listed firearm only in one or more of the
following features:
(1) Finish, including, but not limited to, bluing, chrome-plating,
oiling, or engraving.
(2) The material from which the grips are made.
(3) The shape or texture of the grips, so long as the difference
in grip shape or texture does not in any way alter the dimensions,
material, linkage, or functioning of the magazine well, the barrel,
the chamber, or any of the components of the firing mechanism of the
firearm.
(4) Any other purely cosmetic feature that does not in any way
alter the dimensions, material, linkage, or functioning of the
magazine well, the barrel, the chamber, or any of the components of
the firing mechanism of the firearm.

The testing requirements are as follows::

12126. As used in this chapter, "unsafe handgun" means any
pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon
the person, as defined in subdivision (a) of Section 12001, for which
any of the following is true:
(a) For a revolver:
(1) It does not have a safety device that, either automatically in
the case of a double-action firing mechanism, or by manual operation
in the case of a single-action firing mechanism, causes the hammer
to retract to a point where the firing pin does not rest upon the
primer of the cartridge.
(2) It does not meet the firing requirement for handguns pursuant
to Section 12127.
(3) It does not meet the drop safety requirement for handguns
pursuant to Section 12128.
(b) For a pistol:
(1) It does not have a positive manually operated safety device,
as determined by standards relating to imported guns promulgated by
the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms.
(2) It does not meet the firing requirement for handguns pursuant
to Section 12127.
(3) It does not meet the drop safety requirement for handguns
pursuant to Section 12128.
12127. (a) As used in this chapter, the "firing requirement for
handguns" means a test in which the manufacturer provides three
handguns of the make and model for which certification is sought,
these handguns not being in any way modified from those that would be
sold if certification is granted, to an independent testing
laboratory certified by the Attorney General pursuant to Section
12130. The laboratory shall fire 600 rounds from each gun, stopping
after each series of 50 rounds has been fired for 5 to 10 minutes to
allow the weapon to cool, stopping after each series of 100 rounds
has been fired to tighten any loose screws and clean the gun in
accordance with the manufacturer's instructions, and stopping as
needed to refill the empty magazine or cylinder to capacity before
continuing. The ammunition used shall be of the type recommended by
the handgun manufacturer in the user manual, or if none is
recommended, any standard ammunition of the correct caliber in new
condition. A handgun shall pass this test if each of the three test
guns meets both of the following:
(1) Fires the first 20 rounds without a malfunction that is not
due to faulty magazine or ammunition.
(2) Fires the full 600 rounds with no more than six malfunctions
that are not due to faulty magazine or ammunition and without any
crack or breakage of an operating part of the handgun that increases
the risk of injury to the user.
(b) If a pistol or revolver fails the requirements of either
paragraph (1) or (2) of subdivision (a) due to either a faulty
magazine or faulty ammunition, the pistol or revolver shall be
retested from the beginning of the "firing requirement for handguns"
test. A new model of the pistol or revolver that failed due to a
faulty magazine or ammunition may be submitted for the test to
replace the pistol or revolver that failed.
(c) As used in this section, "malfunction" means a failure to
properly feed, fire, or eject a round, or failure of a pistol to
accept or reject a manufacturer-approved magazine, or failure of a
pistol's slide to remain open after a manufacturer-approved magazine
has been expended.
12128. As used in this chapter, the "drop safety requirement for
handguns" means that at the conclusion of the firing requirements for
handguns described in Section 12127, the same certified independent
testing laboratory shall subject the same three handguns of the make
and model for which certification is sought, to the following test:
A primed case (no powder or projectile) shall be inserted into the
chamber. For pistols, the slide shall be released, allowing it to
move forward under the impetus of the recoil spring, and an empty
magazine shall be inserted. For both pistols and revolvers, the
weapon shall be placed in a drop fixture capable of dropping the
pistol from a drop height of 1m + 1cm (39.4 + 0.4 in.) onto the
largest side of a slab of solid concrete having minimum dimensions of
7.5 X 15 X 15 cm (3 X 6 X 6 in.). The drop distance shall be
measured from the lowermost portion of the weapon to the top surface
of the slab. The weapon shall be dropped from a fixture and not from
the hand. The weapon shall be dropped in the condition that it
would be in if it were dropped from a hand (cocked with no manual
safety applied). If the design of a pistol is such that upon leaving
the hand a "safety" is automatically applied by the pistol, this
feature shall not be defeated. An approved drop fixture is a short
piece of string with the weapon attached at one end and the other end
held in an air vise until the drop is initiated.
The following six drops shall be performed:
(a) Normal firing position with barrel horizontal.
(b) Upside down with barrel horizontal.
(c) On grip with barrel vertical.
(d) On muzzle with barrel vertical.
(e) On either side with barrel horizontal.
(f) If there is an exposed hammer or striker, on the rearmost
point of that device, otherwise on the rearmost point of the weapon.

The primer shall be examined for indentations after each drop. If
indentations are present, a fresh primed case shall be used for the
next drop.
The handgun shall pass this test if each of the three test guns
does not fire the primer.


--dan
 
It really doesn't matter what "hoops" you Kalifornians have to jump through. The reality is this: eventually, in the near future, the communistnazis who control all of Kalifornia's politics, courts, media, academics, many LEO administrators, etc., are going to outlaw ALL firearms, owned by the serfs and peasants. That's long been the Final Goal, and the communistnazis are close to achieving it.

It's just that simple. Step by step by step by step by step by step. Going, going, going, GONE! Their planned Great Final Solution for gun owning vermin, will be imposed in a blood bath unlike the world has seen for many years. Afterall, an "example" will have to be made of recalitrant vermin, in order to put the FEAR! of Big Brother into anyone who would dare resist Big Brother's Orders.

I lived in Los Angeles for 35 years and fought the communistnazis since late 1963, until I, and other fighters, were overwhelmed. I know the game, and I know what's coming, because today, the communistnazis make no secret of what they intend to do.

The Locomotives Continue Racing Toward Each Other.

J.B.
 
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