Just bought a German P-1 P-38

C

cocojo

New member
I just bought a excellent condition P-1 P-38 from SOG. Nice pistol good condition came with two mags and holster. Gun is made in 1979 very little wear. It has post and dot sights and best of all it has the cross pin in frame. I ordered 8 lb springs for it from Wolfs and I will shoot it when I install the 8 lb springs. I don't know how old the springs are in the gun. I paid $425.00 a friend of mine with FFL orders me the guns at his cost plus S&H and I always throw him a sawbuck for his time. The gun is parkerized I wish it were blued but I am not complaining Earl's wants $895.00 for this model gun. Good bore too.:)
 
That's the price Century Arms is selling the guns for: $419, in excellent condition, extra mag and holster. So you got it for Century's dealer price (as you believed to be the case.)

They have some P-1s in GOOD condition for about $100 less, but no extra mag or holster.

The P-1 isn't really a P-38; it is the same basic design, but has an alloy frame and some minor differences (probably improvements.) Most wartime P-38s will sell for that price or much, much higher.

A new-in-box P-1 should go for about $650 retail.
 
To Cocojo: You made a wise move by installing extra heavy springs. The orginial springs that come with these guns allowed way to much rearward slide velocity. The aluminum frames soon started to disentigrate from loads that were of even standard velocity. I have owned serveral of these guns , none of them had the cross pin. I have not had much luck with these guns holding up for very long. Even with the extra power springs I would not shoot any hot loads through these guns, they have a tendency to shed their top covers with monotonous regularity. Of course the small internal parts under the top cover are rocketed off into never , never land and must be replaced. Use reloads that are under 1050 fps to be safe and to also avoid wear and tear on the soft aluminum frame. W.R.
 
Cocojo, which did you buy? A P1 or a P.38?

Last retail price of the P1/P.38 NIB was $900. You did alright.

Are there any marks on the right side of the forward part of the frame that have been overstamped?

Post-war P.38's had the alloy frame too.
 
Regarding the fragility of the post-war P.38’s frame and commonality of the slide cover popping off, none of this has been my experience - and I’ve been a P.38 collector and shooter for over forty years.

P.38’s are some of the most durable pistols ever made. They served Germany for over forty years, and have been the standard sidearm of numerous countries. I have a couple of P.38’s I bought well used, and each has over 5,000 rounds through it. The only repairs made were regular replacement of recoil and hammer springs as preventive maintenance. Both are still going strong. While I’ve had a couple of slides crack, I’ve never had a frame damaged.

P.38’s almost *never* shed their slide covers without user error. If a P.38 owner takes his slide apart and does not get the slide cover back on properly it will come off - but that’s not the fault of the pistol.

My experience, offered entirely FWIW....

Best regards,

Kyrie
 
Kyrie, I agree with you. I have read the hogwash on this subject in other threads. I have not been collecting for forty years, but have fired enough of them and own several to know that this just isn't so.

Even rebuilt a few too. I've never had one start shedding parts on me or anyone else I know. I'd be more worried about an early Beretta 92
shedding its slide than a P.38.
 
Kyrie, I agree with you. I have read the hogwash on this subject in other threads. I have not been collecting for forty years, but have fired enough of them and own several to know that this just isn't so.

Sorry Gentlemen but this has not been my hard learned experience. I bought a brand new and unfired P38 some years ago and test fired it earlier this year, it came out of my collection. It blew its top cover at 500 rounds of rather mild reloads. I have owned serveral WWII P38's and two almost unfired P1's. All of them blew their top covers.
As a matter of fact Walther actually made the newer P38's even worse than the WWII model by redesigning the top cover without the forward legs that helped hold the top cover on.
Also the German Army initially refused to adopt the aluminum frame P1 because it showed extreme wear after only a few hundred rounds of firing. Later they changed their minds and went ahead and adopted the aluminum frame version.
My own commercial P38 showes extreme gauling and wear after only 800 rounds of firing and accuracy has alread started to deteriorate. The frame is starting to wear severely both on the outside frame rails and also where the pistols locking block slams against the soft alumium frame. This is exactly why Walther later put a steel pin through the frame at this point in the pistols interior.
Walther was also aware of the troublesome top cover. They did away with this abortion in the p4 series of pistols and made futher modifications in the excellent P5 series of pistols. They finally conquered the P38's inaccuracy problems with a lug that was put on the forward portion of the P5's barrel. I have obeserved very little wear on my own P5 after shooting about 900 rounds throught it. I attribute this to the heavier slide and the steel cross pin in the frame.
I do not think much of the P38-P1 series of pistols. They were great in their day but Walther wisely decided to redesign this turkey and come out with a much superior weapon , the P5. W.R.
 
Hi Wild Romanian,

The only thing I can say is my experience is the direct opposite of yours. I’ve had exactly three P.38’s shed their slide covers on me. One was due to a slide cover I’d not latched down properly (which was fixed by properly installing it), another was due to a worn slide cover (fixed by replacement of the slide cover) and last was due to an insanely hot reload. This last also bulged the chamber and cracked the locking block. The entire barrel was a complete loss, but the slide and frame continue in service.
Regarding frame wear, I have *never* had a frame show excessive wear. I’ve had three slides crack, but have never lost a frame.
Regarding accuracy, the P.38 is easily as accurate as any other service pistol. When my eyes were up to it I could easily kick around a soda can at 100 meters with a P.38.

I have to say I’m at a loss to understand why your own experience is so different from my own, and from all the other P.38 owners here. Perhaps you have been using up all your bad luck with P.38’s :-)

Regarding the post war German army initial refusal of an alloy frame, I regret to say you are mistaken. Walther wanted to produce a steel frame P.38 for the German army. It was the German Army that required, from day one, an alloy frame. The initial run of a few hundred post war Walther P.38’s with steel frames are highly sought after by P.38 collectors.

Best regards,

Kyrie
 
To Kyrie:


I also forgot to mention the trouble I have had with P38 extractors blowing out. Many of the early extractors had a gentle slope to them that allowed the extractor to walk out from underneath the extractor plunger. I was able to secure a late model extractor with a step in it from a Walther dealer. I have since had no more problems with the extractor constantly blowing out.
I used to carry a large powerful industrial magnet in a wooden box. I did this for safety. When my extractor would blow out along with the plunger and spring I would sweep the magnet over the suspected imact area and suck up the missing parts. I even found other P38 parts that were not my own that were lost by other P38 owners.[

I also quote from Gene Gangarosa's book "The P38 Automatic Pistol.
I]Because postwar P 38's suffered cracked frames afer extensive firing, their manufacturers have since reinforced them with a hexagonally-shaped steel pin in the frame at the point where the locking block stops the recoiling barrel.
[/I] On careful observation of the internal frame before firing began on P38 pistols I owned that were new or near new that had aluminum frames the extreme wear on these frames expecially where the locking block strikes the frame is readily apparent by observing the black anodizing being worn away along with the rounding and scraping of the aluminum frame.
The exteme frame wear started almost immediately and naturally progressively got worse the more the pistol was fired.
The P38's weak dual springs were one of its main failings coupled with a very light weight open top slide. I have shot P38 pistols with very weak loads that functioned perfectley in P38 pistols but the same loads would not even function in most other types of 9mm pistols. The loads had to be increased in other 9mm to even get the slide to lock back. The point I am trying to make is that the lightweight slide of the P38, its weak dual springs and its aluminum frame were all a perfect prescription for early frame failure. This is why Walther abandoned the open top slide and inserted the hexagonal steel pin in the frame of the later P4 and P5 models of their new pistols. The heavier enclosed slide of the P5 slowed down rearward velocity and also did away with the troublesome sheet metal top cover. Walther also abandoned the P38 type extractor and redesigned the extractor in their P5 model pistol. The did this because of the problems that they had with the P38 extractor system.
To my knowledge the P38 is no longer being manufactured and it amazes me that the P38 lasted as long as it did. W.R.
 
Might be best if we all just agreed to disagree on this topic.

We don't doubt that you've experienced these problems first hand. It's just that none of the rest of us have, much less hearing about anyone that has, except for yourself.

I'm outta here. I will continue to enjoy my P.38's and P1's as long as they make ammo for them.
 
The Walther I bought is a P-1 with the cross pin. The guns date of manufacture is 1979. The gun is in excellent condition. I took the top plate off and the parts look new. All parts are matching including the lug with it's serial number. I can't wait to shoot it I am just waiting for the 8lb springs to come in.
The only thing that worries me is the cover popping off. It seemed to pop into place tightly but you never know. I take it from what I have read is to stick with standard velocity ammo and no +P or +P+ ammo. Anyway I really like this gun maybe because of heritage or whatever but it's a keeper I own five walthers now.
P-5 is my fav gun.
:)
 
To Wild Romanian,

I don’t know Wild Romanian - everything you describe is like no experience I’ve had, nor any had by anyone I’ve known, or the other posters here. While I’m more than willing to take your reported experience at face value, you might consider doing the same of all the other posters. You’re doing something no one else is to be having the experiences you report.

All of the symptoms you have reported (early slide failures, slide covers shed, blown out extractors) are what I’d expect if a steady diet of badly over-pressure ammunition was being used, or the bores were constricted or partially obstructed. You might check those “mild” handloads to see if they are really mild and not grossly excessive, and check the bores for debris.

Best regards,

Kyrie
 
I also have a P1. It is dated 1980. It is in what I would describe as excellent/unfired condition. (although that is no longer the case after this weekend ;) ) It is a decent shooter. I even have carried it as my CCW weapon for a weekend!!!!

Kyrie: If I have not already said so, welcome to TFL, and thanks for being the cavalry comming over the hill!!! ;)

WR: I agree. Walther did address all of the concerns of the P38 whth the P5. That is why I carry it!!! :) The P38 is a safe pistol to shoot , however!!!!
 
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