http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/03/04/wrape04.xml
It's good to be an American!
It's good to be an American!
Islamic Justice
- Thread starter DTQ
- Start date
Freedom of religion, that is a laugh! Certain segments of the American population have borrowed Marx, Lenin, and Stalin's
stance regarding religion and spent years removing God from our schools, and elsewhere. Like the ten commandment think on the Texas Capitol lawn.
Meanwhile letting Islamics flood this Nation, some of whom wish our downfall as a Republic, our "infidel" deaths and so forth. Not all of course but Islam settlers did not establish this Country and the majority of citizens prefer their Christian or Judeo upbring and worship.
Khruschev said, "We will destroy you from within" and they who have a like mindset are somewhat sucessful.
stance regarding religion and spent years removing God from our schools, and elsewhere. Like the ten commandment think on the Texas Capitol lawn.
Meanwhile letting Islamics flood this Nation, some of whom wish our downfall as a Republic, our "infidel" deaths and so forth. Not all of course but Islam settlers did not establish this Country and the majority of citizens prefer their Christian or Judeo upbring and worship.
Khruschev said, "We will destroy you from within" and they who have a like mindset are somewhat sucessful.
shootinstudent
New member
I'd like to take this opportunity to say something about the liberal response to Bush's pro-democracy push in the Islamic world. Pakistan has been corrupted to the core for decades now, and things are changing slowly under Musharraf. In the larger cities, like Lahore, the people are more modern and liberal than in the countryside where gross abuses like the one in this article occur regularly. Musharraf, you'll notice, wears western dress and is trying to stengthen ties between Pakistan and the USA. I support Bush in this plan, and I fume every time I hear some liberal attacking Bush for "supporting a dictator" or "ramming democracy down the throat of the Islamic world." People are people, and they suffer from rape, murder and injustice just the same no matter what their nationalities.
It's a mistake to blame what happened to that woman on Islamic law; I have no doubt that the judges who imposed the death penalty on her attackers were in fact correctly applying the law as it stands in that country. The problem is that judges are not at all protected, and they are routinely murdered (along with their families) by criminal gangs and tribal "governments." So lots of death sentences are handed out in Pakistan, but because of the risk to the life of the judges, they are virtually never carried out.
If I had my way, I'd see an enormous Pakistani army trained in the USA to be 100 percent loyal to Musharraf, and then sent off to destroy these tribal criminals, Bin Laden's friendlies in Waziristan included. I am 100 percent behind the plan to remove evil dictators and attempt to restore some modicum of human rights and representation to the Muslim world, and I believe that Bush is genuinely committed to that goal.
As far as I'm concerned, the far left in America today SUPPORTS this kind of torture by making excuses for the people that perpetrate it, and by constantly attacking Bush as a "war monger." If these so-called liberals were honest about standing behind human rights, then I think whether they disagree or agree with Bush's domestic agenda, they'd support the democracy and reform (by force when necessary) that Bush has insisted upon.
Rant over
It's a mistake to blame what happened to that woman on Islamic law; I have no doubt that the judges who imposed the death penalty on her attackers were in fact correctly applying the law as it stands in that country. The problem is that judges are not at all protected, and they are routinely murdered (along with their families) by criminal gangs and tribal "governments." So lots of death sentences are handed out in Pakistan, but because of the risk to the life of the judges, they are virtually never carried out.
If I had my way, I'd see an enormous Pakistani army trained in the USA to be 100 percent loyal to Musharraf, and then sent off to destroy these tribal criminals, Bin Laden's friendlies in Waziristan included. I am 100 percent behind the plan to remove evil dictators and attempt to restore some modicum of human rights and representation to the Muslim world, and I believe that Bush is genuinely committed to that goal.
As far as I'm concerned, the far left in America today SUPPORTS this kind of torture by making excuses for the people that perpetrate it, and by constantly attacking Bush as a "war monger." If these so-called liberals were honest about standing behind human rights, then I think whether they disagree or agree with Bush's domestic agenda, they'd support the democracy and reform (by force when necessary) that Bush has insisted upon.
Rant over
What would you expect from a culture
in which a woman's testimony is discounted by law and, in certain areas, woman are not allowed to be educated, to drive, to divorce their husbands or even walk unescorted?
At the risk of sounding jingoistic, and with full acknowledgement of past and present defects in our own judicial system, I suggest that the term "Islamic justice" is an oxymoron. :barf:
in which a woman's testimony is discounted by law and, in certain areas, woman are not allowed to be educated, to drive, to divorce their husbands or even walk unescorted?
At the risk of sounding jingoistic, and with full acknowledgement of past and present defects in our own judicial system, I suggest that the term "Islamic justice" is an oxymoron. :barf:
Check This Scary Cr*p!
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43166
What kind of JUSTICE is THIS?
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=43166
What kind of JUSTICE is THIS?
Garand Illusion
New member
Some SOB does that to my daugher and he'd better PRAY he gets put in a nice safe prison.
Sometimes Islamic-style justice has its merits....
I used to work with a guy from Pakistan, he told me that where he came from, when a woman or girl was raped, it was accepted practice for the males in her family to hunt down and kill the rapist. Normally there were no legal ramifications. That struck a pretty good chord with me.
I used to work with a guy from Pakistan, he told me that where he came from, when a woman or girl was raped, it was accepted practice for the males in her family to hunt down and kill the rapist. Normally there were no legal ramifications. That struck a pretty good chord with me.
Did he also tell you that it's generally deemed
the girl's fault and that she has "shamed" her family by being raped? Or that she is then deemed tainted and unsuitable for marriage?
Ask about those exciting clitorectamies (usually performed by some medicine woman with a paring knife) and "bride burning" if the dowry isn't enough...... :barf:
the girl's fault and that she has "shamed" her family by being raped? Or that she is then deemed tainted and unsuitable for marriage?
Ask about those exciting clitorectamies (usually performed by some medicine woman with a paring knife) and "bride burning" if the dowry isn't enough...... :barf:
shootinstudent
New member
I have never heard of anywhere in the Islamic world where this is standard practice besides some parts of Africa. Pakistan? Maybe it happens somewhere...but I sure never have heard of it...
You're right about shame and marriage though. It's common for a woman to be assaulted and disfigured for any number of offenses to a husband, or even to an arranged husband before the wedding.
cls12vg30, I'm with you there. I can't think of anything more appropriate for a scumbag rapist.
Rich Lucibella
Staff
Somebody should look up the origin of "Rule of Thumb" in Western Civilization and post it here. We may be a couple hundred years more "civilized", but we can hardly make the claim of being more "evolved".
BTW, I predict 20 years from now the Western practice of male circumcision will be seen for what science and medicine is already proving it.....pure barbarism.
Rich
BTW, I predict 20 years from now the Western practice of male circumcision will be seen for what science and medicine is already proving it.....pure barbarism.
Rich
FirstFreedom
Moderator
Scary. More argument for a strong separation of church and state everywhere, IMO, and ESPECIALLY separation of fundamentalist Islam and state. Thankfully, with the internet and other information technologies spreading truth throughout the world, this kind of injustice will eventually end for the most part - I'm optimistic of that - though it make take a number of decades or even a few hundred years to shine the light of day on these fruitcakes, and cause them to change internally.
Ohio Annie
New member
Rule of thumb, etc.
Here is the origin of the term "rule of thumb" and it has NOTHING to do with wifebeating:
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000512.html
On the subject of Islamic justice, in Ohio some cities are beginning to allow legal disputes to be settled in accordance with Sharia law, much to the horror of the Moslem women who moved here to get away from it.
Here is the origin of the term "rule of thumb" and it has NOTHING to do with wifebeating:
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/000512.html
On the subject of Islamic justice, in Ohio some cities are beginning to allow legal disputes to be settled in accordance with Sharia law, much to the horror of the Moslem women who moved here to get away from it.
Rich Lucibella
Staff
Ohio Annie-
I may stand corrected on Rule of Thumb (that is was referred to by English Law as the maximum size of a stick that a man might beat hois wife with).....I insist on being corrected by my betters at least once each day; humility requirement. However, there seems to remain a fair amount of controversy regarding Sommers claims and the original Blackstone cite.....no-one seems to have researched it. http://research.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/ruleofthumb.html
I think we have a resource person here to get to the bottom of it, though (tyme). In the meantime, I hold the concept as Urban Legend until further documentation is delivered.
Rich
I may stand corrected on Rule of Thumb (that is was referred to by English Law as the maximum size of a stick that a man might beat hois wife with).....I insist on being corrected by my betters at least once each day; humility requirement. However, there seems to remain a fair amount of controversy regarding Sommers claims and the original Blackstone cite.....no-one seems to have researched it. http://research.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/ruleofthumb.html
I think we have a resource person here to get to the bottom of it, though (tyme). In the meantime, I hold the concept as Urban Legend until further documentation is delivered.
Rich
Rich Lucibella
Staff
mtnbkr-
If you're referring to the preliminary Botswana study, I can only state that it's still being debated. Anyone remember Radical Mastectomy? It got "into the literature" and remained the treatment of preference for nearly 30 years before being debunked.
Besides, HIV is an individual behavioral problem; not a universal foreskin issue. It is correctly argued that making handguns illegal for Law Abiding Citizens will decrease the level of firearms accidents.....but we each ask the operative question , "At what cost?".
Rich
If you're referring to the preliminary Botswana study, I can only state that it's still being debated. Anyone remember Radical Mastectomy? It got "into the literature" and remained the treatment of preference for nearly 30 years before being debunked.
Besides, HIV is an individual behavioral problem; not a universal foreskin issue. It is correctly argued that making handguns illegal for Law Abiding Citizens will decrease the level of firearms accidents.....but we each ask the operative question , "At what cost?".
Rich
Ohio Annie
New member
"However, in Blackstone, as Sommers notes, there's no mention of the rule of thumb. We do find the following discussion: "The husband also, by the old law, might give his wife moderate correction . . . in the same moderation that a man is allowed to correct his apprentices or children. . . . But with us, in the politer reign of Charles the Second [1660-'85], this power of correction began to be doubted; and a wife may now have security of the peace against her husband.""
Anyway, a pox on Islamic justice.
Anyway, a pox on Islamic justice.