Is the Ranger T all that?

G

Gunslick

New member
I came up on a few thousand Ranger T rounds in .45 acp and test them in gel too. HST in .45 acp is VERY aggressive so IMO I would rather just go with the HST especially since Ranger is hard to get a hold of unless you are L.E.O. HST does massive damage in every caliber especially .45 (sorry about the .45 rant with me lately, haven't really did a lot of extensive gel testing since recently with .45 acp). I have an expanded HST round that measures on the long side 1 and 3/16 of an inch; that is huge.
 
Sometimes I feel like you're just talking out loud to this forum. Like legitimately you ask a question I guess but this post is all about why the HST is better.

And rock on taking out loud. We will be a sounding wall for you.


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I like HST just fine but if I had ranger for cheaper and my guns fed it fine I would use it but I would not seek it out or pay a premium for it.
 
Funny you keep posting about the HST rounds (are you paid PR? :p ), most of my home defense and carry ammo is getting a little old. It is time to shoot it off and replace it. It has been a couple years since I last bought defensive ammo (most of mine is either Gold Dot or Hornady Critical Defense, with the exception being Winchester PDX1 in .45ACP). So, I have been researching the latest tests out there and HST seems to be among the most consistent, and in most calibers, one of the top choices. I may even go so far as to go to all HST in all calibers, and at least, I'm likely to at least go that way for 9mm.
 
HST is OK. My agency issues it, since it's on the state's lowest contracted bidder list..........

In any given situation, I will take whatever my pistol is loaded with that will poke holes in organs that the guy who's trying to kill me needs to make it until tomorrow...................
 
Our PD issued and trained with Ranger, Moonglum exposed the secret....winchester made a big noise about pulling Black Talon, scrubbed the paint off the bullet and put it in Ranger "Law Enforcement Use Only" boxes. Go to any gun show and civilians could buy it by the case, so much for security. Ranger seemed to be a more acceptable moniker as it did not receive the notority of B T.
 
t4terrific said:
This old wives tale has been around a while too.
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Which old wive's tale would that be?

In 1993 Winchester removed the ammunition from public sale,[12] but at no time was Black Talon ammunition uniformly prohibited by US law. Winchester's Ranger SXT line of ammunition is of the same basic design.

Current status Edit


Detail of 9mm Black Talon bullet
Winchester discontinued the Black Talon line completely in 2000. The “Ranger SXT” ammunition sold later by Winchester is very similar to the Black Talon though without the black Lubalox coating on the bullet. Among shooters, a running joke is that SXT stands for “Same eXact Thing", though the official branding is “Supreme eXpansion Technology”. However, there are differences in the anatomy of the bullets which become apparent when carefully examined side by side. The hollow point cavity dimensions and angles of the meplat were altered to enhance reliability of expansion, though the basic "reverse taper" design pioneered by the Black Talon was retained. This "reverse taper" refers to the bullet's jacket being thicker at the tip than toward the base, enhancing rigidity which allows the sharp petals to remain largely perpendicular to the wound path, unlike traditional designs where the expanding jacket petals would peel back almost completely behind the expanded lead mushroom. This difference is obvious after firing into ballistic gelatin.[13] In 2007 Winchester updated their Ranger SXT line and renamed it Ranger T-Series. Besides further dimensional changes to the hollow point for reliable expansion, the distinctive perpendicular petals were made longer yet more rounded at the tips to retain stiffness.
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I still have a decenst amount of Black Talon as well as Ranger SXT and HST. Right now my carry piece is loaded with Gold Dot. Whatever pokes holes in a BG and saves my bacon is fine by me. My HKs feed all without issues so all get used. If LEOs are using HST for a specific reason other than the low bid that works for me. They are putting it all on the line every day and IMHO should know what works and what doesn't. As with any cartridge shot placement is king. Well placed round ball will stop a man dead in his tracks if it is properly placed.
 
I carry the HST in 40

It does fantastic in "wet pack" (Poor Man's ballistic Gel)

I have had difficulty getting the Ranger T, but the HST is a devastating round
so..... my search was cut short
 
Moonglum said:
Which old wive's tale would that be?
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Your posted article explains the differences and the wive's tale aspects of the Black Talon being simply being recolored and renamed.

Cavity dimensions were changed. Petal shape was changed. Sounds like a different bullet.
 
t4terrific said:
Your posted article explains the differences and the wive's tale aspects of the Black Talon being simply being recolored and renamed.

Cavity dimensions were changed. Petal shape was changed. Sounds like a different bullet.
Click to expand...

Maybe I wasn't as clear as I could have been. The Ranger T is a redesign of the Evil, Nuclear Tipped Black Talon. Kinda like different model years of the same car.

The article says the Black Talon was redesigned and renamed as the SXT. Which was even called the Same eXact Thing. The SXT was redesigned and renamed as the Ranger T.

So, yeah I don't think it's inaccurate to say the Black Talon was the antecedent of the Ranger T
 
Gunslick --- I've not been visiting the forum recently but have seen a couple of references to your "testing." Unless it is through calibrated ballistic gel or similar medium, this means nothing.

That said, Ranger T in .45acp is fine ammo. There have also been a lot of tests done with standard pressure 230 gr. HSTs, Speer Gold Dots, and even Golden Sabers with very good results. My go to rounds are HSTs and Gold Dots but to each his/her own.
 
My tests are all done with 10% ordinance gelatin. That is the best I can do. I do like the synthetic clear blocks but they are on the spend side.
 
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