Is it me?

P

Pond James Pond

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I can think of plenty of "safety-less" striker fired guns, but not many (if any) hammer fired.

Is that the case and, if so, why do you think/know that is?
 
Any number of DA/SA pistol pistols, HK LEM, SIG DAK, Walther PPX, Beretta has DAO models, S&W had the DAO option for the 3rd Gen series, and of course the Kahr pistols.
 
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But to be fair DA/SA pistols do have that heavier first pull as a "safety". The closest comparison would be the DAO options I mentioned but they never really took off like striker fired safe-action pistols did, and that's a good question there as to why that was the case.
 
Having a hammer means a "true" DAO trigger pull, which most people don't like. All of the striker fired guns that I'm aware of are either true single action or are partially cocked and have a much lighter, smoother DAO trigger pull.
 
Having a hammer means a "true" DAO trigger pull
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Not necessarily true. HK LEM is partially cocked as well, so is the PPX if I remember correctly. Not sure about the S&W 3rd Gen series "DAO" option but I know they don't have double strike capability so it makes me think it is partially cocked too.
 
Although many striker-action pistols call themselves "DAO" and are even classified as such by the ATF, I have yet to encounter one that has as long a trigger pull as that of a hammer-fired DAO pistol or revolver. The Kahrs would come the closest in that regard, but the trigger pull is still shorter than a "real" DAO.

Some DAO hammer-fired pistols might have a lighter trigger pull than some striker-fired pistols (although the reverse is usually true). For example, the DAO SIG P250 has a lighter pull than a Glock with the "New York trigger". But the DAO hammer-fired pull is still longer.

None of the DAO pistols that I am familiar with have external safeties. Certainly Beretta DAOs don't, nor do SIG-Sauer DAOs or DAKs. There are also many traditional double action (DA/SA) pistols that do not have an external safety. None of the Beretta G models do nor do hammer-fired SIGs (although they do have decockers).

Many, if not most shooters regard safeties on traditional double action pistols to be superfluous. If the pistol is carried with a round chambered and decocked, the longer and usually heavier DA trigger pull for the first shot is considered to be the "safety".
 
Characterizing striker-fired guns as "safety-less" is generally not fair. Most striker-fired guns have a number of automatic safeties (drop, striker blocker, etc.) that protect against accidents and misadventure.

What current striker-fired guns generally lack is a type of safety mechanism to prevent, or at least discourage, a user from pulling the trigger. It is worth noting that striker-fired guns were originally generally single-action designs (i.e. FN 1910, Savage pistols, Lugers, etc.) that did have manual safeties.

When double-action designs were applied to hammer-fired semi-automatics, manual safeties could be dropped because a long, heavy trigger pull acted as a safety mechanism, just as it did with double-action revolvers.

Credit Gaston Glock's marketing genius with the elimination of manual safeties from most striker-fired guns. Glock's design allowed his pistol to be called a double-action to satisfy police administrators (and lawyers) while providing a relatively light, although still somewhat long trigger pull that users liked.

At one time, it was axiomatic that a 5-pound or lighter trigger, which happened to be the weight of single-action triggers, needed a manual safety. It was also generally accepted that a 10-pound or heavier trigger, which happened to be the weight of double-action triggers, provided enough margin of safety to dispense with a manual safety. Once you convince yourself that a lighter "double-action" trigger is safe, it is easy to rationalize further reducing the trigger pull weight.
 
I can think of plenty of "safety-less" striker fired guns, but not many (if any) hammer fired.

Is that the case and, if so, why do you think/know that is?
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There are decock only hammer fired DA/SA guns.

Ruger had some safety-less, decocker-less hanner fired DAO autos, in their P-series iine.

Umm, ummm, umm. Sig P250. another example.
 
Hammer fired and safeties... Often times it's single action designs. Many DAO have no need for one, and DA/SA often are decocker types.

I'm guessing a safety adds a little extra protection if the pistol drops on the hammer. And I guess during holstering a safety is handy on a SA.

Modern use of a safety gas is disengaged on the draw, but that is a newer thing, I believe originally, you would draw, point, and then disengage.
 
I'm guessing a safety adds a little extra protection if the pistol drops on the hammer.
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For earlier designs absolutely. Today many designs incorporate or have had firing pin blocks added to them which should make that concern a little bit less.
 
Safeties and non-safeties are in the eyes and handling of a firearm. If you like the trigger and trigger break in your practice, a safety or not becomes your muscle memory and is easily taken off before you put your finger on the trigger. I like the safety on my LC9s because I always keep my chamber loaded. The LC9s Pro does not have a safety, but for a finger on the trigger. It's all about preference, and practice at the range.
 
pblanc said:
Although many striker-action pistols call themselves "DAO" and are even classified as such by the ATF, I have yet to encounter one that has as long a trigger pull as that of a hammer-fired DAO pistol or revolver. The Kahrs would come the closest in that regard, but the trigger pull is still shorter than a "real" DAO.
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I think the Walther P99 used to have a true DAO variant (now discontinued).
 
Independent George said:
I think the Walther P99 used to have a true DAO variant (now discontinued).
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Yep. It was offered in DAO and also QA (quick action). Now only the more popular AS which is a unique striker fired DA/SA with a decocker. I actually have the QA version of the P99c. It's a preset striker like a Glock. None of them have an external safety.

Most Sigs are hammer fired with no safety. Many HK models are also available without a safety. Some DA only S&W hammer fired have no safety. Some Berettas are decocker only (type G). Walther PPX as well.
 
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