Is it me or is it the ammo?

G

Geek-With-A-Gun

New member
I am a new handgun owner. I just bought a Ruger SR9 and have been to the range 5 times since I purchased it. I realize that I am new to this but the discrepancy in accuracy is puzzling to me. The first three times I went to the range I was hitting the bulls-eye on a human silhouette at about 5% or 5 bulls-eyes out of 50 shots. Most of the rest were in or around the the 8 zone at 7 yards. I felt that that was pretty good for a newbie. This was using Federal Champion 115 grain FMJ ammo. The fourth time at the range I hit the bulls-eye at 25% of the time or 25 hits out of 100 shots with most of the rest in or near the 9 zone at 7 yards. This was with Federal American Eagle 124 grain FMJ. Today I went back for a quick 50 and was back at 5% bulls-eye using Federal Champion 115 grain again.

I always check my first shot to see where it hit and when I was using the 124 grain, I sighted in at the bulls-eye and hit it dead center. Today, with the 115 grain, I sighted in on the bulls-eye and I was 7" to the left and down about 4". That seemed way off to me. Nothing else has changed that I am aware of. My stance was the same as was my grip and I sighted the target the same way. Why would my accuracy be so different?

I know that I am really new at this, so any help would be appreciated.
 
Some handguns "like" certain types of ammunition better than others. However, I doubt seriously that ammunition differences would account for the widely differing results you're obtaining. It's more likely that you haven't yet developed sufficient gun handling skills to get consistent results.

No reason to be concerned. I've been firing handguns for years and it took me quite a while before I could claim to be consistent. I still have "off" days at the range every once in a while as does almost anyone who shoots regularly.

You need to work on three things: grip; finding a consistent point of aim (POA); and trigger control.

How you grip the gun is extremely important to assuring good shooting. First, you want to work on gripping it the same way every time you shoot. Second, a high grip axis (top of your hand as close to the top of the grip as possible) seems to work for most people to assist in shooting accurately. Third, you want to make sure that your supporting hand works to steady the gun. A lot of the shooting literature tells you that 60-70% of the strength used to grip the gun should come from your supporting (non-shooting) hand. I've followed that advice and it works well for me.


POA is a matter of assuring that you line up your sights exactly the same way each time you shoot. Sounds easy and it's not really all that hard but it does take some practice. When you shoot, focus on the front sight. Ideally, when you sight down the gun's barrel the front sight should be in sharp focus, or as sharp as your eyes permit, even if the target beyond the sight is blurred. Practice putting the front sight on or slightly below the point that you want to hit. You may need to work on your breathing control in order to hold the gun steady.

Trigger control is critical!!! Even the most well aimed shots will be ruined by poor trigger control. You want to teach yourself to intuitively squeeze the trigger without pulling the gun away from your POA. For many learning good trigger control is the hardest part of shooting. I'm a good example of that, it took me years before I really felt confident about my trigger control.

I've fired a Ruger SR9. It's a fine gun, very accurate, and it doesn't take superhuman effort to discharge the trigger. Try putting your finger on the trigger so that the pad of the trigger finger is squarely on the trigger. When time comes to shoot, concentrate on squeezing the trigger slowly so that the discharge comes as a surprise to you.

If your gun allows dry firing (firing without ammunition), then do it -- a lot!!!! Check your instruction manual before dry firing, it'll tell you whether you can and what precautions you must take. If you can dry fire the gun then do it once or twice a day, a few minutes at a time. Concentrate on holding the gun absolutely steady as you pull the trigger. One way to check your skill is to dry fire in front of a mirror. If you see the front of the gun dipping down or pulling off to one side or another then you know you've got a problem you need to work to correct. Also, put a coin flat on the top of the barrel as you dry fire and see whether you can do so without the coin falling off.

Just remember, with shooting, practice makes perfect, and practice WILL make you a better shot.
 
Everything Stevie said, especially FOCUS ON THE FRONT SIGHT!! That was one of those "Holy Cow!!" moments when I was first learning to correctly shoot a handgun.
Don't focus at all on the target; just let it blur out in the distance. You'll still be able to see it just fine. Likewise, let the rear sights blur in the foreground. Maintain 100% focus on the front sight while you are shooting and you WILL be more accurate.
 
Everything Stevie said
Click to expand...

Think of it this way, from what you are describing-if you were shooting in self defense you would have done your job:D. Practice, practice, and practice some more. Remember shooting in a perishable skill.:eek:
 
Both you and the ammo. Impact point will be lower with the 115 and the recoil will feel different, you haven't fired enough rounds yet to be completely comfortable in your grip and this is where you need a coach to "Show" you how to grip the gun consistently and have him watch you to correct sighting and anticipation/jerking problems. Reading good advice is not the same as having a good shooter watching you and coaching. Get some snap caps and practice dry firing in the meantime.

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=376793&highlight=dry+firing

Post #7

http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/ayoob85.html

http://home.earthlink.net/~potomac008/Pistol Wheel.htm

Above chart gets posted a lot and I used it when teaching
 
I thank you all for the wonderful advice. I really think that my biggest problem is my trigger pull. I do practice at home by dry firing (Ruger says it is OK to dry fire this pistol as long as the magazine is in place). What I do is I assume the correct stance with my feet even with my shoulders and square with the target, arms extended but elbows not locked, grip with my thumb curled and high and tight on the gun grip. I then get the front sight in focus and directly between the rear sights and with the pad of my finger on the trigger I squeeze while aiming at a spot on the wall trying my best not to move the front sight from the spot on the wall all through the trigger pull.

All of that works great at home, but when I am at the range I forget about keeping the front sight steady during the trigger pull. I think that I am getting over anxious when I am actually live firing. I will continue to practice until I can get more consistent. The good news is that I always hit the target and have not had a flyer yet.

I think that I will get one of the coaches at the range to watch me the next time I am there so I can get some live help.

As Old Grump said,
Reading good advice is not the same as having a good shooter watching you and coaching.
Click to expand...
 
They are telling you right.... consistency in grip is important.

Down and left, if you are right handed, using means you are jerking the trigger when you shoot... and to check your grip again.
 
It's all about the front sight. Put the front sight on the target and focus only on the sight. Practice breaking the shot while watching the front sight. If it moves off of the bull you moved it. Relax. Dry fire a lot and concentrate on watching the front sight. You cannot hold it perfectly still. No one can. You can only reduce it to a very small amount of movement and break the shot when it crosses the bull. Just remember to relax and focus on that sight. You should be able to recall exactly where the sight was when the gun fired. Dry firing will show you if you're moving the gun left right or up or down. It doesn't matter at this stage where the shots are grouping as long as they're all going into the same place. When you get a nice group of shots clustered together then you can adjust the sights.
 
I was hitting the bulls-eye on a human silhouette at about 5% or 5 bulls-eyes out of 50 shots.
Click to expand...
Actually, that would be 10%.
That said:
While you may see variations in point of impact between different ammo types and weights, no factory ammo should vary seven inches horizontally and four inches vertically at seven yards.
I would attribute your experience to a need for more practice. Slow, careful practice. The "aim small, miss small" approach really works for me. I use a 3x5 index card with a 1" dot in the center as a target. Really forces me to concentrate on the task at hand.
 
You may be experiencing a little target panic. Keep practicing, and you will relax, just like the bullseye is the same as that spot on the wall.
 
I didn't look at the specs on that ammo, but the 115 grain bullet is probably higher velocity, which means it is getting out of the barrel faster. Remember that recoil begins when the bullet starts to move, which means that the gun is actually moving upward as the bullet moves down the barrel. Since the sights are set up so that the gun is pointing down when aimed at a target horizontal to the line of sight, that means the faster bullet will exit sooner, while the barrel is still pointing downward.

The amount of difference can be surprising. I have seen hot, light bullet loads print 12" below slow and heavy lead bullet loads at 25 yards. Even the horizontal difference can be explained the same way if the gun is being moved sideways or twisting in recoil due to the rifling twist.

The best way to remove the human element is a machine rest, but a good sandbag rest (rest the forearms, NOT the gun) will usually show if the problem is the gun/ammo or shooter.

Jim
 
You need to be realistic about how much practice is required: five trips to the range is just getting started so don't be too disappointed now. Also, with some DAO pistols the trigger pull will get a little bit smoother over time, which may help a bit with trigger control.
 
Recoil?

Welcome to the forum and welcome to firearms.

Front sight, finger position, etc. All good advice so I won't repeat it. I will just start with my additions.

First of all, you are doing well. The SR9 was not intended to be a target pistol. If you can afford to purchase a second gun right now, get a Ruger Mark III target pistol (or Mark II) and switch off between the two guns. You will have more fun and 22 ammunition is a lot cheaper.

Get larger targets. Don't bother trying to put the rounds in the bullseye. Just aim at one point all the time. If you have a tight little bunch of holes (a "group") you are doing well. If it is 16" off to the left, don't worry. You are doing your part on the hold and the trigger. As long as you group is tight. To move the group over to where you want it, may require adjusting the sights, practising your sight picture or other ergonometric adjustments (you may be unconsciously holding the picture wrong or using the wrong eye, or even holding the gun so that you shoot left). The important part is that you are consistent. A shooting coach (professional instructor or just a friend who can watch your technique, or you could review your own shooting via the convenience of videotape) should be able to advise a different grip, stance or finger position on the trigger.

How does the recoil feel to you? After a few rounds of my friend's 500 S&W (or even moderate power .357 Magnums) I have to concentrate to avoid "anticipating" the recoil. (That is one reason to practice dry firing a lot). You can also diagnose if you are becoming recoil sensitive by loading a magazine with a dummy round (also known as "Snap Caps", available in most gun shops, or you could have one made up by anyone with reloading capabilities by simply putting a new bullet into a fired case with no gunpowder and a dead primer.)

Put the dummy round in the magazine followd by an unknown number of live rounds (have a friend do it or try to forget how many rounds there are). When you get to the dummy round it will be obvious if you are flinching or anticipating the recoil. If you test yourself at the beginning of a range session it will tell if you have ingrained the habit or not. If you test yourself at the end of a session it will tell if you are in the process of developing the habit. It is most telling if you run this test after you have been shooting for a while, because fatigue will make all your bad habits worse.

Which is your "master" eye? For a right-handed shooter, the right eye is "normal". There are plenty of left-eyed right handed shooters out there who do quite well, but the body's geometry is such that right-handed shooters should sight with their right eye and left-handers should sight with their left eye. That 7" to the left and 4" down mght be the result of switching eyes. Find out which eye is your master eye and then stick with it. If you can choose, choose the same side as your gun hand.

Always shoot with both eyes open. You can see threats with your peripheral vision better and closing one eye can affect the way the other eye sees, particularly if you tend to squint. If having both eyes open confuses your "sighting at the target" brain function (as you practice more, this will go away) put a piece of clear, frosted plastic on the lens of your shooting glasses (you do wear eye and ear protection, right?) that will make that eye unable to see the sights or target, but does not reduce the amount of light coming to the eye. This will force your master eye to really be the master eye.

Another possible explanation for shots low and left is that you may be tightening your fingers or jerking the trigger. See this diagnostic target
http://www.m1911.org/technic30.htm
or if the link does not work, paste this into your web browser:
m1911.org/technic30.htm

This target is for diagnosing right-handed shooters' problems. Left-handers should use its mirror image.

Breathing: You should not hold your breath. Rather, press the trigger while between breaths. Shoot during the time when your air flow is stopped, but don't close your airway. When you breathe, your rib cage is moving, making your shoulders and arms move. Shooting accurately from a moving platform is more difficult. Of course you would not do this in a defensive shooting situation, but the practice is good and will soon become an unconscious part of your trigger "kata", which can only improve all types of shooting. Some target shooters are even said to shoot between heartbeats because even your heart pumping causes slight movements in your body.

Good luck and good shooting,

Lost Sheep.
 
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