Intoxication Void Defense Rights??

C

CelticWolf

New member
For example,
You are out with your buddys at the bar one night. Get dropped off at the end of the night and pass out. Shortly after you are woken up by someone breaking into your house.

Do you have the right to defend yourself to any means necessary?
 
Do you have the right to defend yourself to any means necessary?
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Yes but you will have a harder time articulating the need for deadly force.
They will have an easier time articulating that you were not capable of making a reasonable decision or what a reasonable person would consider a reasonable decision to use deadly force.
 
Probably depends on what state you are in. If you're in a state with a well defined castle doctrine you could probably polish off a fifth and the BG still wouldn't have an recourse. I know here that discharging a firearm under the influence is a felony (alot of hunters get busted on that) with the exception of self defense.
 
Well, if you got so drunk that you passed out, then somebody's breaking into your house is probably the least of your problems. :) If you were in a real stupor, you'd probably do a pretty lousy job of defending yourself or anybody else. However, I don't know of any provision in my state's laws that requires one to be sober when defending oneself or others. :)
 
Reality Impaired

Mr Miyagi say: "Best defense, no be there!"

If you are not in control of yourself, how can you control a weapon?
Best thing I can think of is stumble/stagger away as fast as you can, screaming at the top of your lungs:eek: Maybe you can get away. On the other hand, If an attacker gets his hands on you, you are fooked. If you blow him away, and you are too impaired to drive, you are probably fooked by the system. Better than dead, though.

Not a good situation, no easy answers. How about this, a designated defender. We have designated drivers, why not a designated defender?
Never fly without a safe, sane, and sober co-pilot. One you can trust.

otherwise, prayer might be your only option.

Remember, all prayers are answered. But sometimes the answer is no!
 
I am of the opinion...

....that if you go "out" once a week, and there is a possibility that you will get innebriated, than you shouldn't be carrying a weapon...it is the height of irresponsibility to be carrying a weapon when one plans on indulging in alcohol related activities.

I would really re-think your reasons for wanting a CCW; alcohol and guns...not a good mix.:(


And BTW...if you are drunk, and use a weapon in self defense, you should never be allowed to own a weapon again.
 
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UH1-D Rotorhead wrote:

....that if you go "out" once a week, and there is a possibility that you will get innebriated, than you shouldn't be carrying a weapon...it is the height of irresponsibility to be carrying a weapon when one plans on indulging in alcohol related activities.

I would really re-think your reasons for wanting a CCW; alcohol and guns...not a good mix.
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First off, he didn't say he was carrying WHILE DRINKING, simply that after you get home and pass out, later someone breaks in, and you defend yourself.

And BTW...if you are drunk, and use a weapon in self defense, you should never be allowed to own a weapon again.
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WHAT? Have you lost your good sense? Its statements like that that really twist my nads. So, for instance, you go out (weaponless), have a few drinks, and go home. Now for the sake of the LAW you are above the legal limit to operate a motor vehicle. As you sit at home, intoxicated, someone breaks in and attempts to kill you or your family......in your opinion, you can't defend your lives with a firearm? You should let them rape or kill family members simply because you have had a few drinks????

That is asinine.....
 
Alcohol and guns don't mix. Ever.

I have to agree with the Rotorhead on this one...

If you go someplace you are not allowed to carry (bars, sporting events, etc.) you are taking the chance you will be attacked at a place and time when you cannot use a firearm to defend yourself. Your choice. You pays your money and you takes your chances. Or you don't go to those places.

Getting drunk / inebriated / seriously buzzed is the SAME THING. You are choosing to go to a "place" where you cannot use a firearm to defend yourself. Different reasons but same result.

It is just too bloody easy to screw up badly when under the influence. How would you feel if you shot a "BG" who turned out to be your equally impaired (hence the banging around sloppy noisy presence) brother / girlfriend / roomie / KID coming home after a night like you've just had? Does anyone remember the news reports years ago about a guy who woke up in the night, saw "an intruder" over his bed, and proceeded to grab a gun and blow his own pecker right off?

Bottom line - if you are not up to clear-thinking, controlled action, do not grab a gun. The consequences of screwing up: legal, moral, and physical are just too likely and just too high.
 
"Does anyone remember the news reports years ago about a guy who woke up in the night, saw "an intruder" over his bed, and proceeded to grab a gun and blow his own pecker right off?"

For once, I'm at a loss for words.
 
For God's sake, RUN!!!!! Let the intruders have your house, your possessions, everything you've worked for. Let them have your wife and children to do with as they see fit - if you are intoxicated/buzzed, you have no rights!!!!
RUUUUUUUUUUUUN!!!!:barf:
 
Steelheart, I did not say to run out on your family. I did not say to offer up your daughter and wife to the intruders. I said "do not grab a gun".

I will say it again. If you are not capable of using a gun wisely and well and effectively, then use something else.

Is a gun the ONLY means of self-defense you have at home? NO layered defenses at all? Sic the dogs on 'em while you herd your family out the back door. Set off the panic switch on the alarm to summon the local SWAT team. Throw furniture at 'em while your kids flee.

Just don't grab a gun, because by getting drunk you have ensured that you will only succeed with it if you are lucky. Yes, you have the RIGHT to grab the revolver you keep under your couch pillow, but it would be a phenomenally stupid thing to do. In a moral universe, you are responsible for how you exercise your rights, and I'm suggesting that once you are too impaired to use a gun safely and effectively, you have set yourself up for disaster, and SHOULD not (not "must not" or "may not") try.

Let's get back to the original scenario: you wake up from having passed out drunk when you got home, iirc. Are you seriously telling me you'd wake up from a drunken pass-out ready to make split-second, life-and-death decisions and then act on them efficiently?

If you knew there was a real chance you'd get attacked or your home broken into, would you do something deliberately that diminished your capacity to fight back effectively? Then why drink to incapacity?

It is not just about "rights". Life is also about "choices". If you choose to drink to the point where a gun in your hand is more dangerous than helpful, you've made a bad choice. I pray that it never bites you hard.
 
Unfortunately Derius...

....it's scenarios like these that make for ugly press, further eroding the inroads made by 2nd Amendment activists. Going out and coming home"snookered", in and of itself, is irresponsible, opening you up to more scrutiny...if, as you say, you have wife and kids that need "protecting", than more the reason NOT to go "out" with the boys, and get chit faced.

When one is privileged to have a CCW, along with this privilege come additional responsibilities...to yourself, your family, your neighborhood, and the community at large...being wasted on occassion risks the loss of that privilege, along with putting family, self, and the community itself in danger.

Having a CCW is like growing up, or atleast what you think it will be like when you grow up...you are free to do without mom and dad looking over your shoulder, but there are constrainsts placed on your new found status...as a grown up you are now responsible for everything that was once the responsibility of mom and dad; likewise, a CCW means you have additional responsibilities that may put you out, but nevertheless, are self imposed requirements, such as staying out of bars while carrying, or staying away from school zones, etc. A CCW comes, like adulthood, with a price...and some of the asking prices are never on sale.;)
 
Then why drink to incapacity?
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Exactly. There's never a guarantee that on any particular night, some thug/thugs won't decide to kick in your front door - so the thing to do is to never get so hammered that you can't "repel boarders."

I have done so on a couple of occasions in my misspent youth, but I have come to realize that a person who drinks till they pass out or can't remember events has a problem on their hands. Not only is drinking to this point dangerous, it's stupid.

My sarcasm (RUUUUUUUUUN!!!) was not directed at you, but at the school of thought that once you have had a drink or two, your right to self defense with a firearm goes out the window.

I went on a drinking spree a week or so ago - two glasses of wine in the comfort of my own home (woo-hoo!!!:D ) I was pretty buzzed, but if some thug would have kicked in my door, I could have shot accurately enough to stop him - and I would have, if he refused to lay down quietly on his own and await the arrival of the police.
 
OK. We agree.

It is not the question of "a drink or two", it is a question of incapacity. I said what I did because the thread started with a drunk passed out.
 
I do not carry a weapon while out partying. Not even my gerber. This thread brought up some extreamly valid points. As many of you probably guessed I am still kind of young. Almost 22. I do not support people who are intoxicated and handle firearms. I also understand of the butcher job the media does to the decent people making tough decisions when their are guns involved. I am not looking to give the 2nd amendment a bad name. Resorting to firearms would be the absolute last thing in my mind with a home invader while intoxicated.
 
Drunk or sober my house is my castle
If you enter it with malicious intent I will be well within my rights to defend it with whatever means at my disposal.

If one or more assailants are coming in I have no intention of throwing furniture or hoping the 911 guys get there in time.

I agree with Derius (imagine that) the theory that someone who is intoxicated in his own home losing his rights to self defense is offensively arrogant.

A good shoot is a good shoot, drunk or sober clean or dirty.
 
This whole scenario seems a little far fetched.
How many folks here have ever had their door broken down by a would be aggressor while they were intoxicated anyhow? I must be livin' in the right neighborhood.
It seems it wouldn't matter where you got corked. Just that you were impaired while contemplating the use and actually firing the weapon.
At that point does it even matter. Of course if really sh&!tfaced you probably missed anyway and you're just another victim of the bottle.:)

Rimrock
 
In my opinion, if you're not responsible enough to know your limits and not get drunk, you're not responsible enough to own a gun. Have a drink or two and enjoy, but don't drink with the purpose of getting drunk. That's just irresponsible, and irresponsible people should not have guns. Again, just my opinion.
 
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