In Honor and Remembering......

R

Rojoe67

New member
In honor and remembering the brave men and women of our armed services. The number as of this morning of those killed in action in Iraq War *1742. The number of troops wounded in action *6442. In Afghanistan 192 have been killed in action. The number wounded wasn't noted.


*www.icasualties.org

This site is new to me and I know little of it. I have used it only to locate a close number of brave men and women who gave all so others may live free. I relate a huge loss of this size to the total population of a nice town I lived in about 14 years ago. It is often hard to relate to such numbers until we put them into a picture that is part of our own life. As we reach this 4th of July, I ask you to please take a moment to reflect.

God Bless our Troops............ God Bless the USA
 
My oldest son is one of the wounded-he's okay and back in the fight. It is my deep hope and prayer the Iraqi people will earn the sacrifice of our losses and theirs, and make for themselves a good and decent country.
 
Do you want to help those guys?

Check this site. I've been involved for over a year and can tell you it's very much appreciated by our courageous people over there. Don't just talk the talk. Not only will it help them, it'll make you feel very good when you hear from your "adopted" soldier or Marine. Do it today.
http://www.operationac.com/
 
As a now-retired, two-decade active duty Naval officer, I have the greatest admiration for these young warriors, for their sacrifices, and for their families and friends who suffer along with the combatants. Along with virtually all Americans, I recognize that every casualty is a real loss and we all suffer from each fatality or serious battlefield wound/injury.

With this said, I want to emphasize the obvious, something SecDef Rumsfeld (and others) have been trying to do in recent days. War is a very difficult, very dirty business, which is why it should always be the final policy alternative. During my combat experience in Southeast Asia, we lost more than fifty-eight thousand KIA. In the Korean War, combat deaths exceeded thirty thousand, while in World War Two over four hundred thousand service members were killed. On 11 September 2001, our enemies murdered approximately three thousand Americans.

Every single one of these deaths is a national tragedy. Since the War Against Terrorism is cultural in its origins -- and “ethnic” conflicts are always longer lasting and bloodier than “nation state” hostilities -- I respectfully suggest we understand that this will be a long (many decades) and costly (I fear a minimum of hundreds-of-thousands killed) war. It is, however, one we must win to ensure our posterity enjoy the liberties, the economic advantages, and the political freedom we have benefited from.
 
I pray daily that everyone of these warriors, troops, and sailors get just what each of them ultimately want.

Peace.

Do I like this war? No
Is it neccessary? Probably
Was it handled right? No
Has there been too many killed? Yes
Should they ever be forgotten? NO
Do I support the government in this? NO
Do I support the troops? YES

At the end of the WW2 less than 100 troops were killed after the conflict. Why? We still had several million troops in place. We need to stop this needless dying, and honor those that have already died, or been wounded by wrapping this thing up.
 
Bravo...

You stated after WW2 numbers of deaths? Your statement is way off. I'm not sure if your missing some text or what happened but your statement is wrong beyond reason. Some battles in WW2 had hundreds lost in hours.... (D-Day, Midway, Iwo Jima, Pearl, Sicily and Africa just to name a few)

With respect I argue your statement of being for the troops and not the government. I should remind you that our troops are directed to duty by the same government you state that you don't support. You can't do both in reality anyhow. I admit a number of things aren't and weren't conducted in the best manner and mistakes have taken place at all levels. That in no means, directs that we stop and give up the blood that was spilled to this point in a noble cause. I respect anyone whom says get out and stop the fight but I ask them for what all lives and blood shed was given thus far? I understand as well as anyone with able mind functions knows the continuation of hostile acts against our troops will continue until we can train and hand over security and total police actions to the Iraqi military and civil authorities. Time lines are a total joke. Such public known plans both undermine all troops in country and help enemy forces plan attacks for future operations. When a time line is directed, it should be after Iraq has total control of it's own borders and affairs. It wouldn't be logical to expect that next month maybe not even in the next three years. I hope and pray but I consider myself a reasonable man. Do I look forward to serving there myself or knowing very well my son could be on his way to serve there someday soon? It worries me to no end and I pray for quick peace as well.
I might remind those in favor of pull out, to reconsider the Bosnia ordeal that still plays on today. Our forces are still there too. Did we forget that conflict? Should we jump out of there at this reminder too? I think not. I know a lot of those that hate Bush say we need out of Iraq now. Well, I am not a big Clinton fan but reality remains fact.......Bosnia isn't ready to be on it's own either. Stand strong and together as One Nation Under God....and if you have no God.......then One Nation Together Standing Strong......and supporting the efforts that aren't fairly reported in the daily newspapers or the evening news shows. Ok, I am ready for returning fire...... Go ahead and argue my simple text..... ;)
 
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Im for the troops 100%....

The Politicians in DC dont deserve one iota for the bumbling and ineptitude in Iraq. The Troops get 100% of the credit. Bush and Rumsfeld 0%.

Were locked in for the war....we cant have the Insurgents win this one. My question is how long do the troops have to pay for the ineptitude of the current administration. Its pretty clear that thier was no "after the war plan".

Cheney says the insurgency is on its last legs... Yet I still read about bombings even after the USMC cleaned out Fallujah. How long do we pay more and more for the same territory. If the enemy is able to attack at will that doesnt meet the definiton of victory/pacification to me to me.

The equipment that we have over there is deteriorating at a fast pace.... regular Humvees were not designed for all the armor they are carrying.

We still have equipment in 2005 that doesnt have adequate protection against IEDS on the roads till Feb 2005 when a Centcom order was issued that vehicles were not properly armored would stay on FOBs

Some interesting reading for those inclined to do so.

http://www.sftt.us/PDF/article06232005a.pdf

let you draw your own conclusions.....

this is the same administrations Republicans who on the first vote turned down $2 billion additional aid to the VA while sending billions overseas.

Bush and Rummy are waving the flag...talk and picture opportunities are cheap the safety of our troops isnt.
 
agree........

I agree with you on that equipment issue. Red tape is bull**** esp. when the footdragers in DC could get the ball rolling a little faster. You know, I read that during the Civil War the DC folks could have got the troops of the Union outfitted better with repeating rifles quicker and less loss of life would have been worth it. Seems each and every war we have to learn a few lessons over and over. I don't love the DC boys much but the directions they feed our men and women in the service means something. I have read that upgrades of Hummers are tied up by the DC group and red tape.......In these cases if that is true, those same DCers will live with the blood on their hands............
 
Not only the DCers but the General Officers who are in charge of thier respective services...... who fail to speak out against the bumbling.
those guys are supposed to have the soldiers backs....

I have heard horror stories from one soldier who was there with the XX ID in Iraq. He said for a time the resupply was so bad that they were allowed a bottle of water per day an an MRE. This is not the only time I have heard it.

This same soldier was put in for a Bronze Star with a V device and was awarded a Purple Heart for his actions during an attack. His Bronze Star got downgraded to an ARCOM with a V device. I betcha some of the Battalion staff that didnt set foot outside the wire got Bronze Stars. I have even seen this at Ft. Hood when reading the post newspaper... Most of the staff getting Bronze Stars while you would see privates and junior soldiers getting an ARCOM with a V device and a Purple Heart.

So far Bush says he has a plan...... If he has a plan he should scrap it.

Rumsfeld jumped up and told Bush he wanted the Dept of State cut out Iraq operations meaning that he wanted Colin Powell cut out of it. That the DOD should have full responsibility for Iraq....

well Rummy what have you to say?

whats the plan man.....
 
Eghad....

I hear you and it frosts me too. A few great officers I served with in Italy during peace (Cold War) were out-numbered by marginals too. The Enlisted and the NCO's honest to goodness get 95% of the jobs done. The most of officer folks were college educated plan and statistics guys and gals. Is anything wrong or different with that in 2005 verse 1969? Well, I would like to say we all have gotten a little better over those years. As far as a story from a soldier about getting put in for a medal and getting it down stroked....... That stinks and that kinda crap has went on since day one of military and war. True enough too many career officers need file stacking material for the path toward trying to put on a general's star. If that is all they are about I pray the system of many, see it and weed the sucker out. Some have, do and will still slip through the cracks as they sip coffee in a high security bunker if they are even in hostile areas. Us good troopers past and present try not to let that crap get under our nails. The saying "Ours is not to question why? Ours is to do or die" has cement core meanings. Just as "The Few - The Proud", "An Army of One" and so on.... God speed and safety to all the troopers whom are never spoken of yet bleed and die, "So That Others May Live" (Air Force Para Rescue)
 
Posted by Rojoe67

You stated after WW2 numbers of deaths? Your statement is way off. I'm not sure if your missing some text or what happened but your statement is wrong beyond reason. Some battles in WW2 had hundreds lost in hours.... (D-Day, Midway, Iwo Jima, Pearl, Sicily and Africa just to name a few)
Click to expand...

The reference was to the European Theater, and pertained to after Germany surrendered. There were not the lingering attacks, and rebellion that is going on Iraq today. We still had several million combined forces on the ground there. The rotation home schedule was a mess, and took months to come to fruition. But the troops were there, and the equipment was in place.

This was my point. Put the man power, and equipment in Iraq to get this job done, and stop the needless killing that will go on for years at this rate.

Troops digging through trash for any kind of plating they can find, Men without ballistic vest. I am sure that you don't find this acceptable anymore than I do. I remember some of the first words from the Presidents mouth when we were sold this. "We will support the troops, and give them EVERYTHING they need to get the job done". I guess they might still be trying to figure out the "lives lost to cost of equipment ratio", and equate that into a timeline formula somehow.

After we had the real target hemmed up in the Tora Bora mountains, we dropped Afghanistan, and Bin Laden into the hands of the people that used to work for him, and walked out to start this front in Iraq. And you still think that I can't support the troops, and not the administration that pulled this.

If it would put an end to this any sooner I would dig the gear out of the foot locker, and pack off to Iraq. (even at my age) We have the desire, the ability, and the wherewithall to end this thing. Lets get it done. Stop the needless dying that still continues, and in that way we can honor those that have given all, and those that have given some.
 
True...

Good point and true also.........

I think Iraq today and Germany of 1945 are about the difference as earth in miles to the moon...... A lot of miles....

If we did just what you say.....and I agree it's how I would run the show, we would have to control the countries that border Iraq. We would have to secure the border very tight and use brute force on line jumpers. Would that fly in a world community we try to tread so lightly with? NO..... We would have to draft about 250,000 troops but since that isn't going to take place we have an issue of how to come up with a force large enough to carry out a quick and final step to put end to conflict. We would have a real problem trying to get all the factions and tribes within Iraq to agree on anything short of day and night..... The Islamic militants of today and the German Army of 1945 have a total different idea of life and what is after life. Why did so few American Troops die while we sat in post war Europe? I think that Germany was happy war was over and wanted to start over again. Well, that is what I was told by my Mom and grandma. They knew it because they lived it and pressed on for a new start and a new life.......
 
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