If you Only Had a .38 Spl For The Backwoods........

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Mike H

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The heaviest revolver I have access to is an old Smith Model 10 in .38 spl with a 4" Bbl, I bought it recently for $150, it used to earn its living in a cop holster and has the scars to prove it. I'm taking this gun on a hiking trip with my wife up into the Southern Pa hills next weekend (weather permitting). We get black bear, rattlers, and the occasional lesser spotted felon, although not too many of each. My autos (9mm and .40) just don't feel "right" up there, and I don't have access to a .357/.44 Mag, the only mod I've made to the gun was to put a full size soft rubber grip with finger grooves on it as it came with walnut, I have a couple of questions.

1. Bearing in mind that I could meet 2 legged predators just as much as 4 legged, what is the best load to carry, and is the Model 10 OK for +P rounds, I currently favor the 158 gr +P LSWC for dual purpose use, I would normally carry Nyclads for personal defence when my autos are out of commision for whatever reason, but feel that the extra weight of a 158 gr may be better for use against a small bear, lord forbid.

2. Just out of interest, does anyone know what police officers used as their street round in these guns when they last saw service ??

I stress that I can't get anything heavier otherwise I'd take a .44, comments appreciated.


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Mike H
 
Mike:

The old S&W Mod 10 is one of the great handguns of all time...IIRC, it started the long line of K frame revolvers and has been offered in several different configutations, finishes, etc.

In it's hey day, the Mod 10 was normally carried with the old 158gr LRN, a terrible round for stopping someone intent on terminating your existance and a notorious overpenetrator as well. The NYPD switched to a 158gr LSWC for a number of years before making the switch to semi-autos a few years ago.

IMHO, the best load you can carry for all purposes in a .38 is the 158gr +P LSWCHP, known at one time as the "FBI Load" prior to their going to semi-autos. If you (or someone you know) handloads, you might be able to check out the books and cook something up that will perform better. Federal used to make the 158gr LSWCHP +P load....don't know if they still do or not. BTW, I'd do anything I could to avoid having to shoot a black bear with a .38...it's strictly for a situation where you have no other choice.

Good luck....
Mike
 
Greetings, all. I too cannot praise the tried and true old Model 10. They just work.
As for the backwoods, I'd load the +P LSWCHP as suggested by others. Best.
 
Mike,

I agree with what the others have said, but with a little additional info. Take a look at Cor-Bon's 158gr +p SWCHP. They break an honest 1000 fps and are about as good as you are going to get in a .38. They aren't much fun to shoot, but the rubber grips you have installed should help a lot. Good luck and enjoy your model 10. It's a true modern classic.

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Mossyrock
I respect your right to your own opinions and beliefs
and will fight to the death to defend your right to them
regardless of how uninformed and ignorant they may be.
 
I have carried a Model 15 -4" in the woods. I used a 160 gr. semi-wadcutter bullet loaded into the red zone.(.38 +P level) Figure it this way: It is better to have to buy a new wheel gun than to face the alternative.
Happily, I never had to use my .38 in self-defense against dangerous game, and I wish you the same luck..
 
I second Mossyrock's recommendation of the Cor-Bon 158 gr. +P+ LSWCHP. This load is extremely accurate in my M-10. I think it has been discontinued by Cor-Bon, so it may take some effort to hunt some up.
 
When I last carried a revolver, it was loaded with 110 grain +p+ controlled expansion point (aka: hollowpoint) ammo. Years earlier when I wasn't carrying a magnum, we were issued with 110 grain +p for our Model 67s. I wouldn't go with a +p+ in your Model 10. It may be a mite too heavy for sustained firing. Contact S&W Customer Service and give them the serial number and ask about using +p. S&W won't BS you about their guns and your safety.

Given the choice, I'd also carry a +p 158 gr SWC. Mind you, it'd be for blowing out my own brains rather than get mauled by any bear. Call me a coward, but pain hurts. For the woods, I'd carry nothing smaller than a 10mm pistol and preferably a 44 Mag revolver.

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Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt
 
Thanks for the advice, we just got back home safe and sound. I loaded out with Winchester's 158 +P LSWCHP and felt pretty comfortable knowing they were around along with that sweet old Mod 10, light on power or not. Mercifully they stayed in the chambers for the whole trip, so my wife didn't have to flame me for drawing on a squirrel in the middle of the night.

Regards and thanks

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Mike H
 
Mike H--

Glad your trip went well, and hope you have the opportunity to make similar excursions in the future. You pose an interesting question, though, by this time, I trust the hiking is well under way. It is nostalgic, because I've faced exactly the same question several times in the past. The settings have been woodlands and the prairie, the national forests of NM and CO, and the high deserts of Texas, NM and AZ. The single handgun available has varied widely, but each time, it was merely a matter of adjustment of mindset to the current situation.

One Easter trip with my later-bride, I covered a lot of Otero County, NM, carrying a old S&W Military & Police which had been converted from .38 S&W ctg to .38 Special. I had only 158 RNL and 130 FMJ for ammo. I shot a rattler one morning, and later backed up my mother-in-law-to-be when she dealt with a pair of trespassers.

Your previous choice of the 158 LSWCHP is probably the best choice if stuck with factory ammo. I kinda like Remington's version but at least two other companies do the same load.

If bears might be a problem, and If you have hand loading facilities, I suggest a sharp shouldered full weight LSWC, cast very hard, or the Hornady thick jacketed silhouette bullet, loaded to full Plus-P velocity. I'd carry three of the hollow points up first, and then three of the deep penetrators. Just recall all you ever learned about non-violent dispute resolution and confrontation avoidance. If all else fails, it becomes a matter of coolness, precision and placement. I know a retired RCMP horsebacker who got one leg, and his rifle, pinned beneath his mount back in the 60s. He used the fifth round from HIS Model 10 to kill a grizzly, and saved the decision as to what he would REALLY do with the sixth round. (4V50 GARY's comments noted.)

There was a time when a lot of then-cops carried the light weight (110 and 125 gr.) JHP bullets, supposedly loaded to super duper velocities. In actual testing, they seldom exceeded 900 fps from a 4-inch barrel. There were some notable failures of penetration with many of these, and the wheel turned back to the heavier bullets, along about the time the .38 SPL became passe'.

I do hope all your subsequent hiking trips go well, with only enough adversity to enhance the experience.

Best,
RR

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---The Second Amendment ensures the rest of the Bill of Rights---
 
Mike,

Glad to see you made it back in one piece with no rabid squirrel attacks. :) Now that you are back, you may want to consider taking your Model 10 down to your favorite firearms emporium and look into trading it towards a used Smith & Wesson Model 19 or 66 .357 Magnum. There are literally thousands of these on the used market from the mass exodus from revolvers to autoloaders by various police departments. My recommendation would be for the Model 66. For backwoods use, it can be loaded with 180 grain .357 Magnum ammo for max penetration, or 148 gr .38 Special wadcutter ammo for very accurate plinking, target work or small game hunting. It may be worth looking into. As good as the .38 Special is (and the Model 10 is one of my favorite revolvers), the .357 Magnum is better.

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Mossyrock
I respect your right to your own opinions and beliefs
and will fight to the death to defend your right to them
regardless of how uninformed and ignorant they may be.
 
Rocky Road/Mossyrock,

Thanks for 2 good replies, just thinking about that RCMP bear encounter gives me SEVERE cold sweats, RR are you saying that the bear took out the guys horse before going on for the entree, I'm afraid I have little love for things that would steal from me or eat me (some 2 legged Pittsburgh inhabitants will happily do both).

Mossyrock, it's confession time, I'm afraid I don't like shooting .357's I find them snappy and difficult to shoot well, you're quite right of course, they are a much superior weapon when things with teeth appear but I could never satisfy myself in respect of my own performance with them, higher powered semi autos strangely never affected my shooting, guess it's a "head" thing.

Stay Safe

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Mike H
 
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