IDPA Classifying

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centralpadoug

New member
I shot first IDPA match in over two years this weekend. I am confused over the classification process for various guns. I am now shooting an H&K USP .45. I was expecting to be in the stock service category, instead they put me in the custom enhanced category.

The IDPA web sight isn't a lot of help (or maybe I'm just not looking in the right place?)

It's not real critical 'cause I simply like to add some pressure to my practicing, but it would be nice to have the straight skoop.

Thanks!
 
I believe if you start with the first shot being double action you can shoot SSP. If you start the first shot with the hammer back you move into the ESP class. You can shoot in either class depending on how you start your first shot.
This is just my understanding and if I'm wrong please someone tell me.
 
IDPA

Don't have the rule book here, but first round SA would, to me, seem to be CDP, same as a 1911. DA first stroke makes it SSP. ESP is single action autos in "medium" calibers like the 9 and 40.
 
If it is a stock gun and fired DA first shot or DAO or Safe action, it is in stock category. If you add a mag well or checkered the gun and shot it SA first shot and not a 45 or 10mm or .400 Cor-Bon, it is enhanced service pistol. If it's one of those caliber not in ESP, than it falls into Custom defensive pistol and you can only load 8 rounds in the mag. Stock and ESP are allowed 10 rounds.

HK USP45 fired DA first shot would be in Stock. If fired in SA first shot and loaded with 8 rounds, it is CDP.

A USP9/40 fired DA would be stock. Fired SA would be ESP.

1911's in 45 are CDP. 1911's in 9/40/38 are in ESP. Para-Ordanance LDA can be shot in stock and either ESP or CDP depending on caliber.

The rules can be found at http://www.idpa.com
 
1911's in 45 are CDP. 1911's in 9/40/38 are in ESP. Para-Ordanance LDA can be shot in stock and either ESP or CDP depending on caliber.
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The IDPA rule books specifically says the LDA can shoot in the SSP class but makes no mention of the LDA in either ESP or CDP divisions.

Why do you think it would qualify for ESP or CDP?
 
To shoot the LDA in either ESP or CDP depends on caliber and declaration. It is a situtaion similiar to Glocks. You can shoot either the 20 or 21 in either SSP or CDP. And the 17, 19, 22, 23, 34, and 35 in SSP or ESP if you so desire. Note, I did not include the model numbers for the .357 Sig chamberings, but they would be the same as the .40 S&W and the 9mm models.

Also, if you do any external modifications to the LDA other than sights, it just changed divisions depending on caliber to either ESP or CDP.
 
I looked at the IDPA division lists of qualifying guns again, and I guess it makes sense for an LDA to be able to fit the other classes -- since a GLOCK (safe-action trigger) can shoot the same...

(It seems to me, however, that ESP ought to be single-action only...)
 
If you take a look at the times for the IDPA classifier, both ESP and CDP have the lowest times. You can shoot a DA against SA, but you will be at a slight disadvantage. What's interesting is my HK P7M8 is technically a SA pistol, but I get to shoot it in stock since I have to cock the gun before it can be fired. It's probably the most expensive pistol that can be shot in stock class.
 
I am curious, in IDPA how are you required to use "cover"? Do you have to stand back from it like you should in a real firefight or does everyone crowd against the "cover" and use it as a support?
 
Use of cover.

You are required to use cover for reloads and as the COF descibes. Technically, if using cover during the engagement of targets, you are to cover 50% of your body. During reloads you are to cover 90% of your body. How you personally use it is up to you. I try to not crowd it, by that I mean, I do not project my pistol past it. Also, I will only use it for support if it is to my benefit, like for instance shooting over the top of a car at a target at 20 to 25 yds.
 
The use of cover varies from club to club, and they're apparently quite strict about cover usage in some of the regional matches.

When reloading, for example, 50% cover isn't good enough; its got to be 100%, or you'll get a procedural penalty. In some matches, a foot exposed is grounds for penalty, if you don't immediately correct it, when warned.

Some clubs/matches penalize you if you extend you weapon arm forward of the barrier, others don't. Some penalize you if you use the barrier as support, others don't. You cannot use the barriers as support in the classifier match, as it is explicitly disallowed.

(At our small IDPA club, most of our scenarios in matches are shot from cover -- partly from strong side, and partly from weak side. Shooting weakside from cover will make you a believer in practice, practice, practice.)
 
How are handicaped shooters accommodated? A friend of mine was born without a left hand, how would this be addressed on a CoF requiring a weakside draw and fire?
 
How are handicaped shooters accommodated? A friend of mine was born without a left hand, how would this be addressed on a CoF requiring a weakside draw and fire?
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One of our regular shooters and club member has a badly damaged left hand -- an ex-tunnel rat from VN who earned that hand the hard way.

At the local level, you're free to do what you want, and we simply don't have any weak-hand scenarios in matches when this guy shoots with us. We do them in practice sessions, though, and he handles the gun safely, if not rapidly.

There aren't a lot of handicapped shooters taking part, yet, but maybe that'll come with time. And when that happens, they'll start accomodating and adjusting.

In the meantime, I suspect your friend will just have to NOT shoot on any stages or strings that require actions that are negatively affected by his (or her) hadicap.

If he or she shoots for the fun of it, anyway, who cares?
 
You cannot use the barriers as support in the classifier match, as it is explicitly disallowed.
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Where did you get this info from? I've searched the classifier pages of the IDPA website, as well as the Red Book. Just curious, because everyone I know that has classified as a SS or better uses the barrier for support, including me.
 
The IDPA rule book committee must be made up of Members of Congress responsible for our tax laws. I think that I will just continue to shoot what I want when I want and let somebody else score me and put me in whatever class they think that I belong.
 
You may use barriers as support as long as you remain 50% covered. There is not much of an advantage to this method at 25 yards.
 
With regard to NOT using cover/barrier as a support, you wrote:
Where did you get this info from? I've searched the classifier pages of the IDPA website, as well as the Red Book. Just curious, because everyone I know that has classified as a SS or better uses the barrier for support, including me.
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Whoops. You're right and I'm wrong.

I was thinking of the barrels in the classifier when I wrote that, and you must NOT shoot across the top of the barrel -- it specifically says you must shoot from either side. The best you can do, then, is to lean against the barrel, and that can cause problems when the gun recoils.

Its been a common recurring theme at all of our local club matches and regional matches for the shooters and instructors to EMPHASIZE that using cover as support is bad practice.

(Incidentally, we have a number of sharpshooters in our club, and two others who will probably move to expert tomorrow night, when we have a classifier. None of them use cover as a support.)

Two nationally ranked shooters who have taught classes for our club, Bill Rudder (a four-gun master who came in 2nd in the nationals for SSR), and Larry Brown (a long-time internationally-ranked IPSC shooter, and now shooting IDPA) both emphasize avoiding the use of cover as support in their classes. In fact, when you watch them shoot you see that they tend to step BACK from cover to get better arm extension. It seems to be more helpful than support.
 
The reason you don't use cover as a support or stick your gun through a port is because you have to move the gun back before you can move. It's wasted time.
 
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