I need advice on ammo - Range & Home Defense

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Bullrock

New member
I've been away from shooting for a few years, and just got back. Man, things change quickly. I have always used Winchester (White Box) FMJ, 115Gr. So I've been to the range 4 times in the past two weeks still using Winchester. Then I read somewhere that it was crap. I don't believe that, but I need some up dating. I have two 9mm's.

What is recommended for Range shooting today, and Home Defense. I've been looking around on the internet, but I can't tell much from a box of ammo that's doubled in price, since I was shooting last.:eek::eek:
 
As of May 2014, the FBI went on record saying 9 Luger was its sidearm caliber of choice. For self-defense, look for a round that first and foremost meets the FBI minimum penetration criterion of 12 inches in calibrated, 10% gel, and expands reliably while doing so. Make sure that round feeds, fires, and ejects reliably in your gun. Then find a FMJ round for practice that has the same exterior ballistics.
 
If you are a typical working man with a budget then any reputable manufacturer's 115 or 124gr FMJ ammo works great for range practice trigger time. Winchester, Remington-UMC, CCI Blazer Brass, Magtech, Federal American Eagle... all of these work fine. WWB has gotten a reputation for being "dirty" and perhaps of less quality than in the past, most likely due to ramped up production because of the run on ammo & guns in the last handful of years.

Defense/carry ammo? Well, folks on gun forums -live- to debate this stuff ad nauseum, but most any premium product ammo on the market will likely serve you well. If it's around $1.50-$2 per round, you'll be getting the "cutting edge" ammo being offered by that manufacturer. HST, SXT, Critical Defense, Gold Dot, Golden Sabre, etc etc. A bonded hollow point of NORMAL weight and none of the goofy half-weight experimental ammo with the silly name like "Dead Right There" and you'll be fine.
 
I have heard some complaints about Winchester WWB but if it works for you I would not worry about it unless you experience problems.

I use the following range ammo with great results - anything Federal, Speer Lawman, PMC, Winchester Ranger, Blazer Brass, and Sellier & Bellot. I buy online typically at SGAmmo by the case and save a LOT versus buying locally. Shipping is usually $16 a case and fast from SGAmmo. They have name brand American made brass cased 9MM for under $200 a case of 1000 these days.

http://www.sgammo.com/catalog/pistol-ammunition/9mm-luger-ammo

For SD ammo in 9MM I use Speer Gold Dots 124 +P or Federal HST 147 +P but any Speer Gold Dot or Federal HST is outstanding. You can buy either online for around $26 a box of 50 or even less.

http://www.sgammo.com/product/feder...7-grain-hollow-point-le-ammo-p9hst4-high-pres
 
Winchester White Box is slightly more reliable than some others I could name...
But it isn't Premium Ammo by any stretch...great for the range, tho!
Worst case scenario at the range, you are practicing clearing jams, which is still good practice.

Like the guys above said, for SD use, get the good stuff.
Your EDC should be loaded with the Most Reliable Ammo, which hopefully you'll never have to use :)
 
Range... Most FMJ will work. Some may be a bit dirty, but most name brand stuff works well.


For defense, any of the modern hollow point designs should work well.

I personally use Federal HST 124gr... HST has been shown to be one of the most consistent available today. Gold dots (not the new version) The Hornady Critical lines, PDX1... these are all good options as well. I like the 124gr, as I tend to find it more available, and I like the recoil profile. Others like the 147gr stuff.

The main thing is to just make sure what you get feeds and runs well in your firearms... if not, there are a wide selection to choose from. But I would wager that a good quality pistol would feed any of them well.

With the modern designs, getting 9mm +p is not really necessary. The standard pressure stuff works just as well. In fact, standard pressure rounds tend to penetrate a couple inches farther than the +p stuff. All the brands listed above would average 15" penetration in standard loadings. They don't expand as much, but its only by a small amount, and the penetration is more important.
 
I think Sevens covered it. Close the thread. Still here? ;)

I like the the Winchester Train and Defend system for 9mm at least. The FMJ Train rounds can be had for 30¢/rd but feel and function very close to the JHP Defend loads. Both are 147gr. I use some cheaper stuff too for practice but like to run at least a few mags (or a whole box) of the Train load each session.
 
Here's a good deal on bulk 115gr 9mm - $199.80 for 1000rds:
http://www.sgammo.com/product/speer/1000-round-case-9mm-luger-speer-lawman-115-grain-tmj-ammo-53650

I've had good luck with bulk Geco 124gr FMJ ammo for target practice and just ordered another case of this stuff -$225.00 for 1000rds:
http://www.sgammo.com/product/geco/...4-grain-fmj-brass-case-ammo-geco-made-hungary

For carry - I usually go with a 124gr Golden Saber:
http://www.sgammo.com/product/remin...en-saber-124-grain-bjhp-brass-jacketed-hollow
 
If you are near a Cabela's keep an eye out for Sellier & Bellot 115 gr. ammo. I was at the range yesterday and I shot 100 rounds of WWB and 100 rounds of S&B, and both types of ammo shoot great from my HK P30, but the S&B is a few bucks cheaper when Cabela's puts it on sale. And I carry the P30 with Hornady Amercan Gunner 124 gr.+P, reliable & very accurate shooting defensive ammo!
 
I still have a bunch of WWB 100 round value packs from back before the last panic. At the time, it was a good deal, as Walmart was selling it at case lot prices, and no shipping. From what Ive seen, it really didnt go up all that much either. I was buying a couple of boxes every other week, and before I knew it, had a number of cases worth.

Ive never had an issue with WWB either. Shot fine in anything Ive shot it in.


I dont think you need to go crazy with the SD ammo. SGAmmo usually has 50 round boxes of what most shops sell in 20-25 round boxes, and for about the same price. Pick one of the major makers and Im sure youll be fine.

To be perfectly honest, I really wouldnt have an issue using FMJ if need be. Its not like any of them are the magical Sword of Todd.
 
Like another poster stated, its tough to go wrong with Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST for defensive 9mm ammo, standard pressure or +P. I actually prefer the standard pressure loads, TNOutdoors9 has some great ammo testing videos on youtube. He found basically no difference in +P and non (same bullet and bullet weight of course), so I go standard pressure for slightly less kick.

Here's a nice summary:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuLoUzplbYQ

Definitely don't want to use 9mm FMJ for self defense. Way too much penetration (bad guys make a poor backstop for 9mm FMJ :p ).

For range ammo, I shoot pretty much in cheap crap I can get my hands on :p .
 
I've shot tons of WWB 9mm and 40sw and never had problems with them. In fact I'm stocking up on 9mm and 40sw Personal Protections. They showed good result with gel tests.

My carry loads though are Underwood and Hornady. It's what I'm already stocked up on.
 
There are better defensive choices for sure. With that said, your white box is just fine. I have yet to find one of these internet intellectuals willing to stand in front of a WWB round.
 
>What is recommended for Range shooting today, and Home Defense. I've been looking around on the internet, but I can't tell much from a box of ammo that's doubled in price, since I was shooting last<

For range, I buy the least expensive brass stuff available online, commercial reload or new, 1000 rds. or more at a time. I just bought 1000 rds. Fiocchi for $0.194 per round, plus what works out be 0.012 cents s/h per round; $0.2016 tot per round.

As for SD ammo, I use Hornady Critical Defense. I arrived at that about a year ago from watching a guy's Youtube channel in which he uses FBI protocols for testing ammunition for penetration and HP expansion.

A lot of expensive name brand HP ammo fails the FBI protocols.

Here's the URL:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAWFWuY7JafjZNE_dG8BshA
 
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If you are looking for self defense ammunition that has a training equivalent, you should try some of the offerings from Speer.

Speer Lawman is supposed to emulate Speer Gold Dots. I find that the total metal jacket (TMJ), lead-free primer variant of Lawman is very cheap online. If you are not stockpiling it, it is a good buy. It's also better for your health if you practice at an indoor range.
 
RAfiringline said:
A lot of expensive name brand HP ammo fails the FBI protocols.

Here's the URL:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCAW...afjZNE_dG8BshA
Click to expand...

Keep in mind that he's testing specifically in a 3 inch barrel commonly used in concealed carry guns; most of the ammo was developed for a 4" barrel commonly used in duty pistols.

That's an important distinction - if you're carrying, say, a Glock 19, you can be a lot less picky than if you've got an LC9 in your pocket.
 
>Keep in mind that he's testing specifically in a 3 inch barrel commonly used in concealed carry guns; most of the ammo was developed for a 4" barrel commonly used in duty pistols.

That's an important distinction - if you're carrying, say, a Glock 19, you can be a lot less picky than if you've got an LC9 in your pocket.<

My SD guns are a czp01 (3.8") and a G19 (4").

Ammo fired from a longer barrel might tend to overpenetrate, as compared to his test through a 3" barrel. However, his tests showed that Critical Defense expanded well and mostly stayed at the lower end of the desired 12"-18" window in the gel tests - probably little risk of overpenetration from my barrel lengths.

The problem is, I don't know of any other source of competent systematic testing that compares to what this guy has been doing that addresses ~4" barrels.
So, with the available info, I think Critical Defense tested as an effective SD ammo that minimizes the risk to innocent bystanders due to overpenetration.
 
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