I need a little help with an anti

E

Erratic

New member
I've got a guy I recently met that needs some education. I've already convinced him that you cant just go into any old gun shop and walk out with a machine gun the same as it was a bolt action hunting rifle. He and his wife both firmly support the "assault weapons" ban because they thought that this would outlaw machine guns. I told him that although they are not illegal, they are so tightly controlled that they may as well be.

The thing I have not been able to convice him of is this. He believes that if someone cannot for whatever reason buy a gun in his home state (he used NY as an example) that they could just order it from another state and have it shipped right to his door. He just wont believe me that this is not possible. I am correct, am I not? What I need is printable documentation of this. I suppose I could just go to any gun dealer's website and print out the sentance that says "all guns and recievers must be shipped to a FFL dealer" but I was looking for a little more than that. Thanks folks!
 
Indeed you are correct unless the person doing the ordering has an FFL. You can ship firearm pars, but not the bits that the ATF considers the actual firearm. I got my C&R a while back and can hence get C&R firearms shipped right to my house and skip the gun shop, but I had to get a background check to be able to obtain said license, and last I checked not too many murders were using WWII surplus rifles.

Here's a quote from the ATF's website:
(B7) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?[Back]

A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun.

[18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)]
Click to expand...
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm
 
That's perfect. Thanks a lot. We bet this guy a whole night of drinks! Looks like I win. This is the problem with these antis. They just don't know the laws already in place that don't work to fight gun crime. Thanks again.
 
You can use a C&R to ship across state lines, as chemgirlie said. If the person is prohibited from owning/buying in their home state, then they also could not legally obtain a C&R and have guns shipped to them.

They could always buy a gun illegally, but if we make more restricitve laws, eventually people will get tired of breaking them, right? :rolleyes:
 
You could have it sent right to your door

they could just order it from another state and have it shipped right to his door.
Click to expand...

There was a time in the US when you could do that. It ended in 1968.

For over fourty years, direct mail order sales of firearms has been against Federal Law. 40 years!

Hope your anti friend ponys up for the drinks. Imagine, not knowing something like that has been illegal for over 40 years! Wonder what else he doesn't know?

You might want to tell him about the drug laws passed back then, and more recently. Or maybe tell him about the fact that we landed men on the moon!
 
Show him a picture of a AR15, bet him $100 he cannot get on the internet and order one from any state or country and get it delivered to his home.....:)

(Easy Money)
 
Tell him that you will pay him 500% mark-up on every firearm he has directly shipped to his house;). It never ceases to amaze me how some people can be so oppinionated about things they know nothing about. Enjoy your night of drinks and leave your guns at home:D.
 
But the crook can walk into walmart and buy a muzzle loader rifle right off the shelf and if he looks over 18 won't even have to show ID:D....
Half inch projectile accurate to 200 yards is gonna leave a mark too!:rolleyes:
Brent
 
Right, muzzle-loaders aren't controlled by the Feds at all - you can have them shipped to your door. But muzzle-loaders are VERY slow to reload and take some serious practice to be able to operate reliably - you literally have to assemble each load as you go with the right amount of powder, the ball stuck in there properly and the percussion cap placed right.

Flintlock is even more annoying :).

There's one tiny loophole in all this left. You buy a percussion revolver, the sort of thing Wild Bill Hickock was into like the Colt 1851/1861, the 1858 Remington or Ruger's "Old Army" which is a semi-modern percussion "general old-timey replica" loosely patterned off the Remington.

You then get a cartridge conversion cylinder for it, to take light-loaded modern ammo.

In Arizona and likely New Mexico and Texas, you can't find used Colt 1851s in .36cal for love or money. They get bought by Mexicans, shipped south over the border in their original antique-replica condition and then converted to 38Special with cylinders built in small machine shops. The 38Spl is one of the calibers Mexican authorities consider "non-military" and hence the penalties for packing one (IF you're a Mexican national!!!!!!!!) are "lighter" (and many cops will let you slide with a small bribe).

But again, reload times vary from "slow" to "take the whole damned gun apart" depending on how good the conversion is - the Mexican El Cheapo conversions are of the latter type. Useful against one or two muggers maybe, that's about it.
 
Jim, But the modern ML is an easy albeit slow beast... Drop 3 pills of BP down the pipe followed by a sabot bullet combo rodded in and put your 209 primer in fire at "will" or what ever his name may be...
Brent
 
The guy's probably not an idiot.

What he is is a probably person who has tried to stay informed by watching the TV news and reading the papers, which is a pair of news sources that skew and obscure issues and facts based on political agenda

The guy is ignorant of the real laws and intents for them. Ignorance is not idiocy. Like most people, he believes that what he's told by the media regarding laws and crimes is true

When the USA hopefully wakes up, the Average Joe will understand that "the TV News" is an entertainment and sensationalist venue, and if he wants the truth on things like law, he should simply become familiar with what the law says
 
Try this:

Tell him that you will personally pay for any firearm that he can get shipped directly to his door through a legal purchase and you'll buy him a year's worth of ammo for it.

Then sit back and watch him try.
 
Now you too can become an instant guru of guns by taking the RONCO "I know everything I need to know" gun knowledge pills. Just 3 pills a day for a week and you too will be able to spout tactical nonsense at your local pub. Take one of the automatic weapons pills followed by the automatic handgun pill and one of the "make it all sound convincing" pills and lo and behold - you are an instant gun guru. Impress your anti-friends with your newly gained TRUTH knowledge.

(Warning: take these pills with the special FREE kool-aid enclosed with each order - that's the only way that they will work).
 
Wild Alaska's tag line (one of them anyway) is something to the effect of "You can't reason with people who's mind is closed to it."

Good luck getting your beer. :)
 
I've always joked that you should never argue with an idiot because the drag you down to their level, and beat you with experience.

The only problem with that is if we don't start educating these people, there will eventually be more of them than us. And then they get to call the shots, and our rights go away.

I say props to Erratic for taking the time to educate an anti.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top