How to work up a load with minimal rounds

J

JTReloader

Inactive
Currently I work up loads for 223 and 40s&w by making groups of 5 or ten. Typically 5 for 223 and 10 for 40s&w. Let's say the range is 26-27 grains. I would go 26, 26.2, 26.4, and so on. Then I find a round that is the most accurate but shows safe in pressures. With each I have found two different loads to be similar so I load up more of those, then 5 eachof .1 grains up and down for each round that appeared accurate trying to find the exact load that works the best. To take human error out of the question I make up several batches and shoot several groups. Long story short I'm shooting a lot of test loads. I have a .300 wby mag that I want to load for and its not exactly the cheapest, even reloading. I can't afford to spend hundreds in just test loads. So my question,

How do you work a load up for a gun with minimum test loads?
 
Your description is a pretty frugal approach and basically resembles my approach (usually).

The bad news is that I think you're doing as well as you can. Loading isn't cheap.

The good news is that I think you're doing as well as you can. Take some comfort in knowing that your approach is already well thought out.

I don't like expending a lot of rounds to complete a work up either. For me, it's not so much the expense in components; it's the expense in time. I enjoy my time at the loading bench, but chronographing gets old after a while. And then there's the several trips to the range, etc. From mental concept to full scale production, most work ups take me several weeks, even going into months sometimes.
 
How do you work a load up for a gun with minimum test loads?
Click to expand...
I found it easier to find the sweet spot of accuracy in all my firearms from Max to Minimum.
Seems like the accuracy sweet spots were always closer to the Max end of published reloading recipes verses the Minimum of powder charges.
 
For my Creedmoor I usually load 50 rounds. 10 loads, 5 rounds each, more or less depending on min to max.

A few things I do to cut down on time (50 rounds, 5 minutes between shots = 3 hours 10 Minutes) I usually cut the bottom grain out, or do double to triple my normal increments. Instead of .2 or .3, the first grain or two I do in usually half grain increments. (Doesn't work for titegroup on 9 though, no room).

Switch to three shoot groups for the first batch. This will narrow down the node/nodes you have for you, then load 5 or 10 of the ones you want to find more info on. That way you blast less into the dirt and more into actually finding valuable information, and you'll end up probably shooting the same amount of ammo, but it will be more productive

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
The easiest way to work up a load with minimal rounds is to set a goal for the finished ammunition. "Best" is a qualitative goal and by definition cannot be made on a first attempt because there has to be a worst too.

So if you say "X" MOA @ 100 yards, that sets the accuracy goal. Now you decide what bullet you want again if you want the "best" you will have more work to do.
Then you set a velocity you want and do the research to see where you need to be. Note: if you don't pick a velocity that is at the maximum end of the load data you use, you won't have to work up to it.

If your goals are easy to reach the first combination you pick can fulfill them.
 
Regarding belted magnums: You want to set your die so that the cartridge headspaces on the shoulder, not the belt, when chambered. With any bottleneck cartridge, you want to minimize the "set back" to minimize the amount you stretch the brass, and it's even more important with a belt that can act as a stress riser.

I don't load the original .375 H&H, but that one has a tapered shoulder and probably does headspace on the belt. Someone more knowledgeable can chime in. For most rounds derived from it, however, the belt is just an artifact.
 
Last edited:
I have been testing five shot groups and testing the most promising later with ten or 20 shot groups. I need to post a picture of a real nice five shot group that turned out to be not so tight when turned into a 20 shot group.

I asked the number two Smallbore Shooter in the Nation how many rounds it takes before he has confidence in his lot tested match ammunition. He has access to a test facility and his ammunition is tested in his rifle and of course, he uses the stuff that shoots the smallest groups. But, the group size is around 40 shots. This shooter said when he has shot up a brick, which is 500 rounds, about then he has enough confidence in the ammunition to use the stuff at big matches.
 
Rifle, I load 3 each, 1/2 grain increments min to max. Once I find the sweet spot I may load up and down in .2 grain increments around that load, but most times I just call it good. Pistol I do the same 1/2 grain from min to max, but load 5 and I won't bother refining it once I find the sweet spot.
 
"...set your die to headspace on the shoulder..." Dies don't have headspace either.
"...minimum test loads..." You really don't need 10 for a pistol. Five will do. Like Nick_C_S, says I don't think you can get any less than you are. However, ignoring the whole off-the-lands stuff will help. That's a trial and error thing that really doesn't make much difference.
You can pick one powder(always found whatever powder is given for the accuracy load works well) vs a bunch of 'em.
 
The first step is to figure out where you "stop point" is. If you only have one brand of brass, primer, powder, and bullet, it can be pretty simple.

Do an optimal charge weight load workup. It usually identifies the "sweet spot" for powder charge in one go.

Then fiddle with seating depth if you must, 5 rounds at each depth you want to test.

Can't think of a way to do a decent load workup with less. The moment you start trying to compare powders, brass, primers, and bullets, you make your load workup much more complex.

Jimro
 
Can't think of a way to do a decent load workup with less.
Click to expand...

The easiest load development I have done was for pistol ammunition for IDPA/USPSA.

I figured out volume vs weight/density vs charge weight for different powders the started with the heaviest bullet (would wind up being the smallest charge and the powder that would be the smallest volume (don't have to run the powder bar back and forth, load to PF for heaviest bullet the swap to lighter bullet and keep going).

Fire one shot over the chrono and adjust up until safely over PF then crank out enough of the load for further testing and move to the next bullet/powder.

What had taken me months between various trips to the range in the past took around an hour and a half.

3533895716_0a7f11a958.jpg


That said the goal was easier than others.
 
For rifle I do a standard ladder test. I will load one round starting at the minimum listed charge an increase each charge by .2-.5 grains until I reach the max charge weight.

As a side note I will have use a sharpie and write the charge weight on each cartridge as I go along.

Then I go shoot at 300 yards 200 is minimum. I do this at one of my remote spots where I will be alone. I set up my tripod near the target, mount my iPhone to it, set it to video and hit record and go shoot each of the individual rounds from the lowest charge to the highest while using the same target and hold. Once done you should see a string of low shots a nice group of probably 3-5 rounds and then then a string of high shots. The group is your accuracy node. Once you review the video you will see the what sequence of shots were in the node and now you have a smaller range of charge weights to tune up to get max accuracy. But typically you can go with the middle one of the node and be good to go.

Also you tube ladder test and yo will get some good info and further tips.
 
For belted cases, a pretty well known method for setting the sizing dies is to expand the case neck up one caliber then resizing it back down incrementally checking the case in your rifle as you go. When the bolt just closes on the case, stop there. There will be a bump now that the loaded round headspaces on so that when fired, the shoulder will establish there without excessively stretching the case body ahead of the belt.
 
What a minimal round count to you ? For me I'm pretty happy if I can find a load in 50 or less rounds . That does not happen often though especially if you count the conformation rounds .

I had since I started reloading did what I consider a traditional load development . That is load 5rds each from minimum to max in .5gr increments . That would always result in a couple charges that shot good groups . I'd then load 20 of each charge that grouped well and go back and shoot two 10rd groups to confirm . This usually produced a pretty good load .

I have recently ( last year or so ) been trying the ladder method and OCW method . Both have resulted in finding an excellent load . How ever using different components they both have also resulted in me not being able to find something that works . So for now I'm not sure if I got lucky with the loads that work or what .

The one OCW test I did took 60+ rounds to dial it in while the one good ladder test only took 35rds . Then there's the hybrid traditional load development . As others have stated ,knowing what you are looking for or having a goal in mind helps .

I sometimes used to do a traditional load development but with a twist . If I know I'm looking for a longer range load 600+yds . Then I know it's unlikely I'd use any charge at the low end of the charge spectrum . Therefore I'll only load 1 or 2 rounds at the lower charges . These are just to make sure I'm safe and allows me to still start at or close to minimum charge . As I work closer to the higher charges I load more rounds per charge because I know the upper end is where I'm looking to find the load .

It looks something like this

hX3EoL.jpg


As you can see it's more like a hybrid of the traditional test . I saved 14rds worth of components doing it this way and really I could have just used 1rd at those lower charges and saved a total of 17+ rounds .

I should added that all that was speaking to rifle loading . I still do a pretty traditional test type for hand gun . Load ten each move up in .1 or .2gr increments .
 
I load in 1 grain increments if charges are 35-40 and up and 1/2 grains in smaller cases(less for handgun cases). Five rounds per increment fired over a chronograph while also testing accuracy saves time and components. If/when I find a charge that's giving suitable, consistent velocities, I work around that level in smaller increments.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top