How fast to push a 110 grain 38 cal XTP

B

black_hog_down

New member
I was given a bunch of 110 grain 38 cal XTP bullets.
I will be shooting these from a Ruger 77/357 with 1:16 rifling. I'll be using H110. Seems like I should be able to push these to 2400 fps fairly easily.
Will this bullet hold up to that speed? How about shooting a hog with this bullet?
 
That bullet might hold up going down the barrel and the trip down field...but it will act like a varmint bullet when it hits. If the pig is maybe 40 lbs or so it MIGHT be effective on a broadside shot. Otherwise.. you are barking up the wrong tree.
 
Flat point or hollow point...not that it makes much difference. Hogs are mean tough and get nasty when wounded with lightly constructed bullets , high velocity just insures a lack of penetration to vitals.
I wouldn't use them on hogs , no mater how fast they were going.
If you do use them make sure there is a tree close by....hogs are not good climber's and you can usually get away from them snapping tusks.
Gary
 
If you go to the Hornady web site and search for that bullet it will list the velocity spectrum-I believe they list the 110gr XTP at tops 1400fps.
 
I'll start by saying I'm not a fan of light bullets in general. But if/when I load 110's (I have Sierra and Speer 110's), I go with a fast or intermediate (at most) propellant. I don't drive them that hard. Also, I don't own a 357 carbine (wish I did), but if I did, it would almost always get a diet of 158's. Or even 180's.

As for hogs: I don't shoot things with a heartbeat, so I don't rightly know. But it's my understanding that they're pretty darn tough and a lot of penetration is important for a humane stop. To me, that means 158's or 180's. I bet Hornady's 180 XTP's exiting a carbine would be great for hogs.
 
In a word, DON'T. You are looking at duplicating if not exceeding .357 Maximum handgun velocities and the bullet simply will not penetrate. You want 140gr minimum; 158/180gr preferred.
 
Are you loading vitamins in the powder? I must be missing something. Hornady 9th, p784 lists the max at 1100 in a 38 spcl and max of 1550 in a 357 on p789. Hodgdon has 2078 as max. So not sure how or where you are obtaining 2400fps. Odds are performance and pressure will show up long before that and even be possibly dangerous unless I am missing something.
 
Qrz,

Part of the "vitamin" in this case is having an 18.5" barrel in the Ruger rifle rather than the 8" Python you are reading numbers for, and a small part is having no barrel/cylinder gap helping bleed pressure down. However, you are right that 2400 fps is way too optimistic. 300 fps of increase is a more likely difference from the maximum revolver numbers, though it depends on the powder.
 
However, you are right that 2400 fps is way too optimistic. 300 fps of increase is a more likely difference from the maximum revolver numbers, though it depends on the powder.
Click to expand...

2400 fps is POSSIBLE; not likely with H110 but each gun is a law unto itself....see Speer # 12. I could use one or two other powders that weren't listed and get there but there are trade offs like throat wear. Lil Gun has a reputation for being less than cool in the temperature department.
 
What about this?


From Hodgdon for an 18.5" rifle barrel:

110 grain XTP, Winchester case, Winchester SPM primer:
22 grains H110 2291 fps
23 grains H110 2398 fps
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The thing is, Hornady only rates the 110gr .357" XTP to 1400 fps. That doesn't mean it can't or shouldn't be pushed faster but simply means that impacting beyond that speed the bullet will probably break apart badly upon impact and that means very very limited penetration....which is very bad for something like hog. It doesn't have much weight to begin with either, again not good for anything above small game.

They also rate their 158gr XTP to 1400 fps but it would be a better choice because it's heavier and will penetrate better. They rate the 140gr XTP, a personal favorite of mine, to 1600 fps. I would not go below 140gr if you hope to get adequate penetration.

Now if you want something explosive for smaller pests and what not sure a 110gr would be fine pushed to the extreme.
 
black hog down see my first answer. Just because you can drive the bullet that fast doesn't mean you 'should' drive it that fast.

You asked... we advised. Whether you chose to listen is up to you. I've only been doing this since 1990.
 
SHR970 said:
black hog down see my first answer. Just because you can drive the bullet that fast doesn't mean you 'should' drive it that fast.

You asked... we advised. Whether you chose to listen is up to you. I've only been doing this since 1990.
Click to expand...
Yup. I was out on this idea after I saw that Hornady only recommends them to 1400 fps.
I was just pointing out that (according to Hodgdon) you can push them to 2400 fps.
I like the 158gr flat point XTP for hog. I will say that they are not as tough as most people think. Especially if you neck shoot them. I think a 110 would work just fine for that. If your gonna try to shoulder shoot them a 110 would never get through the shield on a big one.
Thanks for all the input everybody.
 
Pistol bullets aren't meant to go over 2k, generally speaking, unless they are designed for it. Right now, our pistol bullets have been worked down to perfection, as long as you are shooting at jello, and pushing bullets meant for handguns to rifle velocities and using them on game isn't a good idea. I have a box of 110 grAin Sierra bullets that literally turned themselves inside out at only one k velocity

I know of several things that I would suggest instead, but you could just go back to hornady and use what they call the flat point. You might be better off moving up to a full 180 grain bullet and settle for far less velocity, or at least go with a 158. Extreme velocities with light pistol bullets are not the best way to hunt medium game. I've seen small game literally peeled apart with the lightweight pistol bullets pushed beyond the speed that they were designed to take. I just suggest that you follow the leads that you've received in earlier posts and abandon light, fragile, high speed.
 
The purpose of the 110gr bullet is to be light enough to achieve enough velocity for consistent expansion at 38 special, short barreled revolver pressures.

For the purposes asked about, it would be about as effective as prefrag ammo, and not a practical choice for hunting, except may small varmints that you aren't planning on eating.
 
Black Hog Down,

You can quote Hodgdon data, but not show their copyrighted graphics without their permission. Please read the board policy on posting copyrighted materials.

It's interesting that QuickLOAD is showing both those loads to be substantially compressed, the first 105%, and the second one 109%, which is hard to do with ball powder and not bulge the case, but Hodgdon isn't showing it compressed at all. I haven't measured that powder's density for a long time, but I know spherical powder bulk density can vary over a span of 10%, and since QuickLOAD's density matches Lee's VMD, I'm wondering if Hodgdon had a denser lot to work with. Quickload shows the case full under the bullet at about 21 grains (and that is after adjusting the case capacity to match the water capacity of actual cases; the default case capacity is about a grain short).

The 300 fps gain number was based on extending 1550 fps from an 8" revolver based on Hornady data, which does not include H110/296. If I ignore the compression and match the load by performance in QuickLOAD by tweaking the case capacity just slightly, I find the 8" Python used by Hornady should get 2100 fps from it, and a 4" revolver should get almost 1600 fps. It all seems a bit optimistic. It would be good to hear some measured results from someone who has experimented with this combination.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top