Hi making 44 mag rounds to sell?

R

rude robert

New member
Hi I have a co worker who likes my reloads, How much should I sell them to him for? I am only looking to re coup my cost, I just hornady 240 gr with H110 and cci 350 primers any suggestions on how to figure this out
 
If anyone else answers you they will probably say don't reload for anyone besides yourself because the liability is to big if something happens.

If you still decide to do it I would probably charge similar to what off the shelf ammo costs. Time is money.
 
I'd be very concerned about selling my reloads do to possible liabilities. Maybe have him sign an agreement.
 
Legally you need a license to manufacture and sell ammo. I can't see you getting in trouble for making rounds for a friend, but if you are making money at it then liability concerns pop up.
 
I am only looking to re coup my cost, I just hornady 240 gr with H110 and cci 350 primers any suggestions on how to figure this out
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Pretty easy. You know how much bullets and primers cost apiece and you should easily be able to figure how many charges you get from a pound of powder, thus knowing how much each charge costs.

Like others, for liability reasons, I would not attempt to make a profit. Better yet would be to teach you friend to reload his own.
 
"Legally you need a license to manufacture and sell ammo."

NO YOU DO NOT.

This has been discussed multiple times here over the past couple of years and for some reason a significant number of people thing that selling even a single round of home-loaded ammunition requires a BATF license.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/person-who-reloads-ammunition-required-be-licensed-manufacturer

Note that BATF's explanation says that someone needs a license if they engage in selling reloads for livelihood AND profit. It doesn't say OR profit.

Technically it is, at best, a gray area in the law because there are no definitions for what constitutes livlihood and profit.

BATF would have to make the case that a license is required based on a comparative look at a lot of moving parts.

But does anyone really believe that BATF would be able to make the case that you'd need a license because you sold 100 reloads to a friend and made a whopping profit of, say, $10? What kind of livelihood is $10? Two Big Macs?

The same gray area exists for whether someone needs a license to sell firearms. What is the number of firearms sales that constitutes a business instead of churning a personal collection?
 
I appreciate your responses, I guess sell is not the correct wording lol. I actually said in the first message that I just want to cover the cost my time is fun. I have always taken people out with me but this guy wants to hunt with them and he shot the ones I gave him, I just don't want to keep paying for them so he can shoot he doesn't either. I just not sure how to break down the cost, like 50 primers, shells, powder and bullets. I have never actually ever tried to figure out how to break it down. How do you figure out the cost for powder? Bullets are kind of easy but the powder and primers will be a challenge. I buy primers by the 1000, and the powder by the pounds. I do think you for your advise, he is going coyote hunting thanks
 
Charge him enough to cover your legal fees if he has any kind of incident or accident after you take money from him for the first round (no matter if he's using your ammo or not, someone will claim he was). Here's what the ATF says about it:

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/person-who-reloads-ammunition-required-be-licensed-manufacturer

Is a person who reloads ammunition required to be licensed as a manufacturer?

Yes, if the person engages in the business of selling or distributing reloads for the purpose of livelihood and profit.

No, if the person reloads only for personal use.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a) and 923(a); 27 CFR 478.41]
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It's easy enough to calculate cartridge cost, break it down to each component:

Individual bullet cost = Price of bullets / quantity of bullets. Example = $39.99 per 50 = $39.99/50 = $0.80 each.
Individual case cost = Price of cases / quantity of cases. Example $24.99 per 50 = $24.99/50 = $0.50 each. If they're free, cost is obviously $0.00.
Individual primer cost = Price of primers / quantity of primers. Example = $38.00 per 1000 = $38.00/1000 = $0.04 each
Individual powder cost = Price of powder / pounds of powder / 7000 * cartridge powder weight in grains. Example = $180.00 per 8 pounds with 23 grains per cartridge = $180 / 8 / 7000 * 23 = $0.07 each

Add them together for your total cartridge cost. The example above would be $0.80 bullet + free case + $0.04 primer + $0.07 powder = $0.91 each.

Honestly, if you can't do the above, it's pretty scary to think that you're making your own ammo, much less giving it to other people.

mike irwin said:
But does anyone really believe that BATF would be able to make the case that you'd need a license because you sold 100 reloads to a friend and made a whopping profit of, say, $10? What kind of livelihood is $10? Two Big Macs?
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Only time you'd see the ATF charges would be when someone gets hurt trying to shoot the .308 you reloaded through a .270, or someone you sold ammo to accidentally shoots someone or gets shot (whether your ammo actually does it or not). Everybody with any involvement at all is going to be part of the lawsuit, I would hope that you wouldn't have to pay any damages, but lawyers aren't cheap.
 
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I agree fully on the liability part of this. I'd never sell any reloads to anyone. Now that I said that, here's an option. Have him come over and teach him how to reload and let him load his own on your equipment. If he's a good friend, you'll both enjoy the "guy time" together and he'll learn something. If your time is worth anything, so is his. Let's see how much he wants those bullets.
 
"Only time you'd see the ATF charges would be when someone gets hurt trying to shoot the .308 you reloaded through a .270, or someone you sold ammo to accidentally shoots someone or gets shot (whether your ammo actually does it or not)."

BULL.

Those are both civil/state issues, and would be dealt with as such.
 
One reason not to reload for others is the risk that there's something wrong with the other guy's gun, and if it goes boom, he blames you and your ammo.
Just a thought.
 
You do what makes you happy. I don't tell you how to live.
For myself,with few exceptions,I do not shoot reloads that I do not make,and I give (or sell) no one my reloads.
For myself,I distinguish between brother,or close and trusted friend,vs "co-worker"
I don't want to go into detail,but the workplace ,IMO,is a place to be careful.

Now,what I WOULD do,is mentor a co-worker shooter into reloading.
I might invite him to my loading room,or take a Lee hand press and makings,etc to his place.(This is a starter outfit easy for them to buy)
I would step-by step him/her through the process,loading manual,etc and they would be doing all the hands on . Then they are shooting THEIR OWN loads.
You can show them Midway,Natchez,Grafs,etc on line,and you can go with themto the LGS and spend their money.
Its the "give a person a fish vs teach themto fish"
Besides,do you really want to spend time at the bench loading for other folks at cost???
 
And I'll add one more vote for "Don't do it." As others have expressed, the liability factor is too great.

I also like the idea of introducing your friend to reloading. Invite him over, if you're comfortable allowing him in your shop, and show him how it's done. Explain to him that he can get into reloading ridiculously inexpensively. Lee single stage press kits and turret press kits can be bought for under $100. Add a set of dies, and he's got the basics. If he's looking for ammo to hunt with, he won't need high volume so a single stage press would be adequate and a turret press would be like mass production.

I don't give ammo to anyone. No matter how careful you try to be, mistakes are always possible. I've been reloading for more than ten years -- two weeks ago I had my first squib with my own reloads. Thinking back, I know what happened. But I wasn't trying to multi-task, I wasn't watching television or grooving to my favorite music while loading -- I was doing just that task. I encountered a slight snag, it threw me off my rhythm, and I ended up with one round that had a primer and no powder.

I was lucky, and didn't cause a kaboom. It could easily have happened. If it happens to me, I have only myself to blame. If I give ammo to a friend and it happens to him -- HE has me to blame, and that's a problem.
 
If you proceed with the project, have your friend first buy the components, but somewhat more than actually needed and the leftover will be yours. For example, to load 100 rounds, have him buy 100 cases, primers, bullets and a pound of powder. Then the remaining powder would go to you for your efforts, hardly enough to be considered a profit and livelihood amount.
 
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I load for my son and myself no one else . I will give a friend ammo if he ask but never sell it . That only goes for handgun ammo not rifle .
The problem you can have is just to much to even think about selling it .

You can control making the ammo but not what some one will do with it .
 
How much? Figure in a GOOD defense attorney's retainer fees to the usual cost of brass, powder, primers and bullets. One screw up on the buyer's part or your own and you can kiss life as you know it goodbye...our screwed up legal system with juries that figure a lawsuit is an excuse to make new millionaires is the problem. Rod
 
I hope this is not taken too critically, but I can't fathom you not being able to calculate what your direct costs are.


Primers and bullets are dead nuts simple as is brass.

That leave powder.

That's nothing more than converting a pound of powder to grains and then how many grains you put in a case. Divide that into the pound grains and you have a unit. 30 dollars a can of powder divided by your unit.

I am no genius, heck, I failed Algebra with a 40 % my first year of it (note I was a honor student eventually because I worked real hard not because I am smart) and got put in with the remedial match kids. Its not like I am tooting my horn or anything.
 
If you proceed with the project, have your friend first buy the components, but somewhat more than actually needed and the leftover will be yours. For example, to load 100 rounds, have him buy 100 cases, primers, bullets and a pound of powder. Then the remaining powder would go to you for your efforts, hardly enough to be considered a profit and livelihood amount.
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Lets put it this way, I agree the OP can do it if he wants, he has all the warning.

But I will vehemently disagree with what you posted as a way around liability.

The simple way to put it is "you touched it last, you own it" unless you can proves someone else touched it in a significant way (not handling).

That does not get you off the hook.

I know a guy who lost it all. In his brilliance he decided he could weld up a LST (Landing Ship Tank) that kept cracking all the way across the bottom.

Yep, she split wide open, went down like a rock and the crew (fortunately ) managed to get all off and rescued by close boat and calm water.

He got sued and lost everything. When someone gets hurt or suffers a losss, the knives come out.

Add in a couple who had a kid in daycare. She got her finger caught in something and lost a tip. Wonderful kid, adopted form a foreign country, lucky to be in the US.

Well of course we are going to sue!

Heck , I pushed the folding bed that cut off my brothers finger. Stuff happens and you then have to pray that they don't want damages.

He maybe could still sue me.
 
I reload for my dad and uncle which isn't very often. When I do, I just charge them the 'cost' of the components. As above, it is very simple to calculate. Then round up to the nearest dollar for a box of 50 and good to go.

That said, I do NOT load hot loads for them. Just normal target loads. No way would I load 'bleeding' edge cartridges. For example .357 cartridges are loaded like .38 Specials. Loads that I found that work good for me.
 
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