Hey there, new guy with a question...

B

Brad09

Inactive
Hey everyone,

Firstly, I'm new here, so thanks for having me. I'm hoping you guys can help me with a couple of things.

Okay, so here we go. Firstly I'm Canadian, just waiting to receive my restricted firearms permit, the first step on the road to purchasing my first pistol.

Anyway, for those of you unfamiliar with Canadian gun laws, owning a pistol is pretty well just for kicks. I can't legally carry it with me, and using it for self-protection is pretty well impossible without a whole lot of legal trouble. I live in a pretty relaxed neighbourhood, so I wouldn't anticipate needing it for home protection(besides, I've got a shotgun for that). But what it would be used for is range shooting. A lot of range shooting. For comparative purposes, when I bought my first hunting rifle, I put approximately 200 rounds through it during the summer before my first hunting season, and since then, I've expanded my collection to two more rifles and a pair of shotguns. For those who are interested, my cabinet currently looks like this:

Ruger 77 .22 Long Rifle
Browning X-Bolt .308 Winchester
Uberti 1873 Lever .357 Magnum
Remington 870 12-gauge
Beretta Silver Pigeon 12-gauge

Anyway, I'd like a pair of pistols, a .22LR and a centerfire, for the range. Now, because the rifle range I use is public, I am unable to fire a handgun there(legally). However, there is an indoor pistol range in my area, with a max. shooting range of 25 meters(90ish feet). I'm not too concerned about size, I can't carry concealed. Nor am I overly concerned about centerfire calibers, although the 9mm comes to mind simply due to cost of ammunition compared to other calibers. Magazine capacity is limited to 10 rounds regardless, so that's not an issue. My primary concern is reliability, I'd rather not be dealing with jammed cartridges or feeding problems.

On that note, I feel it is important to mention that my local indoor range requires that I use their ammunition(I know, it's crazy). This is lightly-loaded stuff, and I have a friend with a Smith and Wesson(don't know the model) that jams constantly because of the ammunition(when he takes it to the outdoor range and fires full-power cartridges, it seems to do fine). As a result, I wouldn't mind something with a softer recoil spring. Anyway, I have no powerful brand loyalties, I just want something that does the job. I'd just like to hear some preliminary thoughts, some things you like and why. I'd like to stay away from oddball calibers and stick to something more common, and I would rather keep to an automatic over a revolver. Anything you guys could throw me would be nice.

Brad
 
Sounds like you should get a .357 to me. It won't care what power cartridge and you can practice with .38 rounds. If you do any camping or hanging out in the woods you might wanna go with a .44. Just my 2 cents, or 1.4 Canadian cents ;)
 
Welcome, and glad to have you.;)

On the 22lr pistol my suggestion would be the Ruger MK series.
When it comes to the centerfire, maybe a 9mm Beretta 92 series.

Let us know what you decide.
 
Interesting. I did not realize owning a handgun is that difficult in Canada, nor the requirement for using range ammo only at private ranges. My suggestions would be:

Centerfire:

Browning Hi Power 9MM
CZ-75 series 9MM

.22LR:

Ruger MK II (see if you can find a used MK II over a new MK III)
Browning Buckmark
 
owning one is not too difficult its just very restricted on where you can use it, as in, only at an approved range. (no hunting or carrying or anything other than range use)

Brad09, where in canada are you? I'm in manitoba myself, and i recommend that if you can you should find a different pistol-approved range. Having a requirement that you use their reloaded ammo is rediculous.

i also second the above poster who mentioned a Ruger MK series for the .22
 
Ruger .22 has my vote. I can't nail down a semi-auto with a reputation of handleing light loads well. I'm sure there's one out there. Ruger P series have a reputation of digesting just about any ammo from what I've read.
 
Ruger pistols have their limits when it comes to lightly loaded ammo - I made some light 9mm reloads that turned my P-89 into a single shot!
With the conditions you describe, I'd go with a revolver. How about a .45 Colt single action? Those are fun to shoot.
Automatics are fine with .22s. They can't reload those, so they'll be standard pressure.
 
by pistol i assume you mean semi auto. givin your criteria i would also recommend one of the ruger mk pistols in .22. nothing better available in my mind. the most affordable ammo of any kind is 22 so you get the most fun for your money. as for your centerfire pistol i would recommend the beretta mod 92 or the taurus pt-92 in 9mm. both good handguns, easy to use, big enough to be accurate and 9mm ammo is more affordable. they also make a good self defense gun if needed.

if revolvers interest you there are a number of good revolvers available in both single and double action. ruger makes a great single six that comes with a spare 22 mag cylinder and a variety of single and double action revolvers to fit your needs. s&w and taurus makes a number of nice rimfire and centerfire revolvers as well. a quick trip to your local gun shop will probably show you even more. a nice revolver in 357 mag will give you the ability to shoot 38 specials as well. i like the 22/22mag and 38/357 combo revolvers as you can see.
 
Ruger MK series is a very reliable 22 cal as is the Browning Buckmark series. You will not be disappointed with either.

As far as a centerfire pistol goes...my advice would be to go to your gun shop and handle many different brands and sizes. One of he most important things about a pistol is that the grip feels good in your hand. Most major brands these days are pretty reliable. Of note...there are a few that have less than stellar customer service or warrenty turn around times.

I'm not going to suggest a particular make or model of pistol as what is right for me may aweful for you. I will only tell you that from my experience, I have had good experiences with Sig Sauer, Springfield Armory, Browning, HK, S&W revolvers, and FN.

Now get out there and play with as many pistols as you can and make an educated decision. Best of luck! ;)
 
Welcome to TFL.

I know you would prefer a semiauto over a revolver. However, as you have already learned, once you buy a gun the tendency is to buy more. It would be a good idea to start with a revolver and then obtain a semiauto. The reason is, most people will agree that a revolver is harder to master.

Obviously, the wheelgun is easier to operate. (i.e. load/unload, point and shoot) However, they are more difficult to shoot accurately, manage recoil, load quickly. It has been my personal experience that people (myself, friends and some older LEOs) who started with revolvers have a much easier time learning to shoot semiautos than people who started with semiautos and then try to master a revolver. The best widely relatable comparision, that immediately comes to mind is learning to drive with a manual transmission. I learned to drive on automatic and years later had to learn a manual transmission. It was difficult (and I still hate driving them, except for sports car with very short clutches and shifts). However, everyone I know that learned the other way (manual then automatic) have no problems with with either. Basically, if you learn the harder skill set first, the other will be child's play when you do it.

The aforementioned stated. I would recommend a full size (or small snubnose if you like a real challenge) revolver chambered in .357 magnum or .38spcl. The .357 will chamber both rounds making it more versatile. However, if you option for a smaller size lighter weight revolver the .38spcl will be plenty of power, especially just for fun. My preferences for revolvers are
Smith&Wesson and Ruger depending on the style of gun. The other nice thing is ammo, you already have a .357 rifle and a pistol in the same caliber is just kind of a logical thing to own.

In regards, to the .22lr for plinking. You have alot of options. The most popular are the Ruger Mk series and the Browning Buckmarks for semiautos. Both would serve you well. My favorite .22lr is my GSG5. However, with your 10rd magazine limit, it wouldn't be as cool. A well made .22lr MP5 lookalike is jus fun. Don't feel bad because H&K sued them and yesterday was the last day they could be sold new (in gun stores) anyway. There are also some .22lr revolvers on the market but oddly I don't care for them because they just aren't as fun to me. My whole attraction to the .22lr is that you can
burn through lots of ammo for very little money. (550rds for $20USD)

If you absolutely want a centerfire semiauto as your first handgun, my favorite caliber is 9x19mm. It is a fast and accurate round. The other choices are .40s&w which is popular amongst LE. It is a good cartridge but IMHO it is not much/if any improvement over the 9mm, ballistically, to put up with its' snappier recoil. The .45 acp is a popular round, too. It is a large heavy round that compared to others is very slow. The recoil is harder than others but that is the price you pay to shoot a very large caliber round.

The full-size gun I suggest, is the Springfield Armory XD. It is a striker-fired pistol with an obvious similarity to the Glocks. The glock is a great gun as well. However, I like the ergonomics of the xd much better and reliablity has been repeatedly proven to be as good or occassionaly better than the glock. (The "better" part FWIW should be taken with a grain of salt but the "as good" I can personally verify.) Since magazine capacity is limited and you may find you prefer more traditional designs, one could say a person would be well served by a 1911 of good quality. This design excellent and held with high regard (alot sentimental) in the US and is a proven workhorse.

I hope that this was helpful to you. Give consideration to the advice you will receive from other people. However, the best advice I can give a person in your situation is to try as many different guns as possible before purchasing one.

Lastly, I am not encouraging you to try this yourself.;) It has been my experience that when shooting rentals or at places that require the use of their ammo, that if you buy a box or two of their stuff, my suggestion is to keep the empty boxes of the range ammo and dump your factory stuff in it at home. Be sure to buy a little ammo there every so often though. It is a private
facility and it is best to follow the rules. However, if it is the only place to shoot and you don't want to shoot ammo that causes malfunctions I can understand the situation.
 
Welcome to TFL.

I will add another vote to the Ruger MK series .22lr pistols. You can go with the all metal versions, or if you're into polymer, you can pick one up with a polymer frame.


For a solid range gun, you have a lot of options out there. My best advice is to make sure that it fits your hand. If you want a semi-auto, a 9mm sounds like a good option.

By the way, are you not allowed to defend yourself with a handgun, if someone breaks into your home?
 
+1 on the Ruger .22

If your range rents pistols, try out as many as you can. That's the best way to decide what handguns best for you.

If you're only going to be target shooting, then get a dedicated target pistol.
A lot of target shooters are using 1911 clones in 9mm.
Springfield Armory, Les Baer, and Colt customs would be worth a look.

BTW there are ranges in the states that make people use their ammo. It's about the money.
 
I think you're right on the money to be thinking 9mm. Cost is a factor when it comes to fun at the range if you don't reload. As far as 9mms go, first that comes to mind is the Glock 19. It is a compact version of the 17, yet almost full sized, which makes it a good range gun, yet gives you the ability to carry in case your country ever sees the light and changes it's laws on the matter. It can happen; we've trashed a lot of ridiculous laws in the past, though it's a real fight most of the time.:( The G19 choice is just one of the many, like SIG, H&K, CZ, Ruger, ad infinitum, but few would argue these as a bad choice. My all-time favorite auto is a 1911, and 9mm is great in that platform also, but many would argue that a 1911 is not a great first handgun. At any rate, if you don't go with a 1911, you'll probably wind up with one eventually. Lighter recoil springs are available if light loads are a must and reliability suffers.

On the .22, I can't help but echo the Ruger, especially the Mark II. I have a fairly early standard and a Mark II. Love them both. Browning Buckmark would be my second choice, but either one will serve you well.
 
I'd also suggest a .357 Magnum revolver. Specifically, I'd reccomend a medium or large frame, all-stell gun with a 4" or longer barrel. From a gun like a S&W 686, Ruger Blackhawk, or Ruger GP100, the recoil of a .357 Magnum is quite manageable and .38 Specials are downright mild. The revolver will not be sensitive to the power level of the ammunition and you'll be able to use the same ammunition as your Uberti. Also, with a single action revolver like a Ruger Vaquero, Colt Single Action Army, or any of the SAA clones from Uberti, Cimmaron, USFA, or Beretta, you would have a suitable gun for Cowboy Action Shooting (I don't know if that's popular in Canada). Finally, a .357 Magnum would be the bare minimum caliber considered suitable for defense against wild animals should you embark on outdoor adventures.

If you absolutely must go the semi-auto route, a CZ-75 9mm with the .22LR Kadet Conversion would be a good model to look at as you fill both your wants with one gun at a modest cost.
 
Quote Webleymkv:
“I'd also suggest a .357 Magnum revolver. Specifically, I'd reccomend a medium or large frame, all-stell gun with a 4" or longer barrel. From a gun like a S&W 686, Ruger Blackhawk, or Ruger GP100, the recoil of a .357 Magnum is quite manageable and .38 Specials are downright mild. The revolver will not be sensitive to the power level of the ammunition and you'll be able to use the same ammunition as your Uberti. Also, with a single action revolver like a Ruger Vaquero, Colt Single Action Army, or any of the SAA clones from Uberti, Cimmaron, USFA, or Beretta, you would have a suitable gun for Cowboy Action Shooting (I don't know if that's popular in Canada). Finally, a .357 Magnum would be the bare minimum caliber considered suitable for defense against wild animals should you embark on outdoor adventures.

If you absolutely must go the semi-auto route, a CZ-75 9mm with the .22LR Kadet Conversion would be a good model to look at as you fill both your wants with one gun at a modest cost.”


Welcome to TFL.
I agree with Webley.
I would go with Ruger Mk II or Mk III for my .22 caliber. For my center fire I go with either a S&W 686 or a Ruger GP100 .357 Magnum revolver.
 
By the way, are you not allowed to defend yourself with a handgun, if someone breaks into your home?
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strictly following the letter of the law a handgun when being stored at home must be unloaded, trigger or cable locked, and locked in a case or safe. if displayed it must be trigger or cable locked, and secured in some way to the wall or a non portable structure.

so if someone breaks into your home and you beleive your life or the life of another is in danger then you can defend yourself, just gotta unlock everything and load the ammo first :P


now a shotgun, on the other hand, is a lot less restricted for storage and display, and can be kept pretty close on hand and loaded up pretty quickly. :)
 
***!!!!! :mad: I can "understand" how the government can restrict the guns you own BUT to try and tell a person how to store them in their own home is WRONG for so many different reasons that it is sickening to me.:barf:

The concept is such an Orwellian idea that maybe people should re-evaluate the amount of power given to their government.
 
Hey everyone,

Thanks to all for your replies, and the advice given. Firstly, I'd like to reply to Adamx, I am in Alberta, and while there is an outdoor pistol range(club-owned) where I can shoot whatever I want up to 500m, it's a good 2-hour haul from me, and the club fees are absolutely ridiculous. Therefore, I'm stuck with either the indoor range with watered-down handloads, or illegally shooting at the public rifle range.

Secondly, I am grateful to EdInk and his remark about autos vs. revolvers, and revolvers being more difficult to master. I would have thought this was the other way around. Therefore, I may well make my first purchase a revolver and move to automatics later. And shooting something chambered for .357 Magnum makes sense, to use .38 as training ammo. So, who the heck makes a high-quality full-sized .357 revolver? The first name that occurs to me is either Colt or Smith and Wesson, but I'm not overly familiar with pistol manufacturers and their quality for either automatics or revolvers. According to Canadian law, any pistol must have a minimum barrel length of four inches, so please keep that in mind.

After having gone to the range and spoken with a couple of buddies(all pistol shooters), all of them, except one, owned a Ruger Mk II, and thought they were great. As I've already got a Ruger .22LR rifle, and like it quite a bit, and nearly everyone here mentioned the Ruger Mk II, I think that settles that.

In regards to the home-defense remark, Ed, I agree whole-heartedly. However, my Remington pump is a really nice gun for home-defense, and I'd be worried about overpenetration from a centerfire pistol anyway. I'm also fairly adept with shotguns, and the layout of my home makes for minimal problems securing with a longer weapon. Besides, I like having a flashlight on my shotgun for home protection, and finding handgun attachments in my area is problematic(relatively few pistol owners, so not much for markets for accessories in this area).

Finally, I looked into that range ammo-box business. Because the range is a recreational facility and offers supervision for unpermitted individuals, they're pretty tough about letting people leave with ammunition, because they don't want someone leaving with ammunition that isn't supposed to have it. It's a great idea, but I don't know that it would fly.

Anyway, thanks to all that offered their opinions, it was quite a bit of information to absorb in only one day. I also appreciate the lack of childish argument that seems to plague so many other forum sites, especially with such an opinion-minded question. I'll certainly pass on my final decision, and I'll be posting somewhat regularly as I have questions that arise.

Brad
 
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So, who the heck makes a high-quality full-sized .357 revolver?
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Smith and Wesson and Ruger are the two main makers of double action revolvers. Colt no longer makes them. So unless you buy used those two are the main ones.
If you want a single action gun, then your options open up a lot.

I also appreciate the lack of childish argument that seems to plague so many other forum sites,
Click to expand...

Start a 9mm vs .45acp thread and you can see some childish stuff. But mostly this is a pretty adult crowd.
 
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