Hey .357sig fans...

S

slojim

New member
sell me. I'm gaining interest. What do like/dislike.
I ignored this round earlier as an expensive niche round, but I'm seeing more about it. Do you think the cost is high because of manufacturing difficulty (so it will stay high) or lack of volume (and it may come down).
 
I don't have any experience with it, but on paper it looks very impressive. It's trajectory is extremely flat; it has superior feeding capabilities because it is necked down. I've heard that it's easy to reload for the cartridge.
 
There's a lot going for it. Ballistics are on par with .357 Mag (if you stick to 125 gr. projectiles) while being easier to shoot and having a greater capacity. My accuracy and the reports I've read have all been positive. Very reliable bottleneck cartridge. And you have the ability to swap out barrels and presto! you're shooting .40 S&W. If you already shoot/reload for .40, you can carry in .357 Sig configuration and practice with cheap .40 reloads. Saves cost of reloading another caliber.

Only downside is that factory ammo is not a "go down to Kmart type" situation. You'll need a gun shop or mail order.

Go on now, you know you want one. :)

Sub
 
Yeah, I want oone, but I want soooo much...
anyway, I've seen a few guns that will accept both .357 barrels and 9mm barrels, and 9mm can be 1/3 the cost of .357, so I started thinking...
 
I am not going to say it is the best, but give it a try.
I have HK, Sig and Glock in .357. I use the G31 for pins and it really clears them out quickly with authority.
It is really like having a .357 mag. in an auto.:)
Minus the recoil!
 
.357 Sig is one of those calibers where I'd settle for a 10 round magazine (something I'd not say for 9x19) I mean, I went to Dale Tolwert's stopping power page. There's one load of .357 Sig, an EXTREMELY high velocity 71gr bullet, that generates 700 foot pounds of muzzle energy. Man, what a cannon!

What pistols can you get in this caliber? I know there's a Glock and a Sig. Anything else?
 
Me too...

I have been interested in this cartridge myself. I currently shoot 40 and 45. I love the 45 but at most I carry 7 rounds +1 in the pipe. The 357 sounds appealing. Would you guys recommend a make as far as "best platform" most reliable, etc... What about recoil, I shoot the 40 from a compact polymer and I would prefer a little less kick.

regards, -Coop
 
357 sig

Nightcrawler:
I have a Para p-16 and I bought an Ed Brown Barrel w/bushing in .357 sig. Great combo. Hi cap, high energy, low recoil (relatively). Not my most accurate pistol, 3+/- inches at 25 yards with Speer. 2.5 with handloads. But, I am in the process of working up a better load. At my age, it's hard to see those little holes at 25 yds until you get them bunched together, so I have to get closer. Either to the target, or the shots closer to each other <g>.
Best
45Colt
 
.357 SIG

...sell you on .357 SIG? Okay, that shouldn't be too hard!

- unquestionably the most accurate pistol round I've ever shot
- bottleneck = reliable feeding
- one of the powder co's (Accurate Arms, I believe) lists .357 SIG as the most ballistically consistent pistol round they have ever experimented with.
- ballistics with 125gr bullets equal that of the .357 Mag
- accurate
- simple barrel swap gives you a .40 and .357 SIG in one pistol (also easy to convert to 9mm as well in some pistols)
- once you obtain brass, the .357 SIG is just as cheap to reload for as 9mm because it uses all the same components
- have I mentioned that it is accurate?!

If you don't reload, the .357 SIG is more expensive to buy factory ammo than 9mm, but the price of ammo continues to come down. I believe this trend will continue as more and more agencies continue to adopt the round, making it more popular. Right now, it is no more expensive than Lawman (or equivalent) .45 ACP ammo if you shop around. (ie: $10 - $11 per box of 50)
I enjoy reloading as much as shooting, so the ability to reload ammo for much cheaper than factory fodder further justifies my reloading hobby.

I shoot a lot of 9mm and .45, but the .357SIG is still my favorite caliber.
Give it a try.... I'm sure you'll like it.

UPDATE:
- just read that someone bought .357SIG Blazer 125gr ammo from http://www.natchezss.com for $8.83 per box of 50!
So much for the expensive arguement!


[Edited by Reg on 01-04-2001 at 01:22 PM]
 
.357 Sig not equal to .357 magnum

I like the .357 Sig (really .355 diameter) and I own a Sig P-226 chambered for this round. Great muzzle velocity from, in essence, a 9mm load. This said, however, I am weary of .357 Sig fans suggesting ballistics equal to the .357 magnum. It's simply not true.

The fact is the .357 Sig achieves roughly equivalent ballistics at the low-performance end of the .357 magnum spectrum. For example, 124/125 grain loads in both rounds tend to have muzzle velocities approximating 1350 FPS and muzzle energies approximating 510 foot pounds.

However, heavier .357 magnum loads clearly outperform the .357 Sig. To illustrate, Federal's 180 grain Cast-Core .357 magnum round provides 1250 FPS muzzle velocity and 625 foot pounds muzzle energy. I doubt there are any .357 Sig loads that achieve these ballistics.
 
Looks like a great cartridge. The Texas DPS switched to it some time ago and in the first 17 shootings got 100% OSS. The feed reliablity is excellent as well. They shot 300,000 rounds without one failure during training. I don't know of any since either. You cannot go from 9mm to .357. You can usually go .40 to .357 and .357 to .40. On some guns a reduction from .357 or .40 to 9mm is possible. The .357 blast is greater than a .40 and if you like a high velocity load check out the RBCD 25 gr .357 SIG at 2850 fps!!!!!
 
What about over-penetration? I'm sure a heavy fmj round will fly on through many a barrier, how about a lighter expanding round?
 
In my area, 9mm ammo is $8 a box, and .40 is $10 a box, and 357 Sig is $10 a box, comparing the same brands.

I don't know where people get the idea that .357 Sig ammo is so expensive, but that is not true where I am.
And, if you cannot get it cheaply where you live, then buy it over the internet by the case. It is only a couple dollars more per box than equivalent 9mm ammo, and the same price as .40.
The .357 Sig is growing in popularity, shown by its drop in price and it will be more available in the future (It has become easily and cheaply available where I am). Furthermore, you can always drop in a .40 (or 9mm) barrel if the .357 Sig goes the way of the dinosaur, which I highly doubt wil happen.


Also, I just started reloading .357 Sig today. It is quite easy. The only difference is lubing the case mouth before you start. And, it is CHEAP because 9mm bullets are cheap. Also, it is really easy to find my brass at the range :)

It is no lie that this is an extremely consitent, accurate, reliable round. My stock Glock 32 is among the most accurate guns I have ever owned. And, it puts out well over 550 foot pounds of energy from a very short barrel, with no lacking in penetration. A 125gr bullet moving at almost 1450fps does just about everything anyone wants in a defensive pistol.

Regarding the .357 Magnum comparison, this seems to be brought up over and over. The 125gr .357 Sig OUTPERFORMS all the factory .357 Mag loadings that were so well proven on the street. The goal of the .357 Sig was to match the velocity of the proven 125gr .357 Magnum loads that are known to work well in street shootings. The .357 Sig EXCEEDS this goal. Out of the same barrel length, using facory 125gr bullets, (even with the advantage going to the revolver due to the fact that it's cylindar is not included in the barrel length) the .357 Sig puts out HIGHER velocities than the .357 Magnum. Yes, the .357 Mag is a bit more versatile in the heavier bullet weights and yes you can handload it hot, but since I am not hunting with my .357 Sig, and it is only for defense, I only care about personal defense ammunition. The .357 Sig handles the light and medium/heavy (even up to 147gr) loads as well or better than the .357 Mag, and it has MUCH less felt recoi and more capacity, smaller platform etc.


.357 Sig:

Power, accuracy, reliability, versatility, consistency, and proven stopping power. What more could you want from a compact pistol?



[Edited by jdthaddeus on 01-06-2001 at 04:53 PM]
 
G32-1450fps-125gr?

I need your recipe. Went out and chronyed my loads for my new 32 and the most I am going to get is 1450fps with 115gr. As far as recoil there is no comparision to 9mm+ or 9mm+P+. I am not recoil shy;but, this is going to take some getting used to. At least for extended strings.
 
Just another way to skin the cat, not necessarily a better way?

Texas DPS thinks the 125 357SIG/Mag beats the 45. CHP (a much bigger PD that shoots more people) thinks the 180/40 is better than the 125 357Mag they used to use. Border Patrol thinks the 155/180 40 beats the 125 Mag too. Who trumps who?

Reliability? Georgia SP fired 500,000 40s without a problem.
Accuracy? Tighter groups shooting slower on paper; none in Q scores or tactical courses that I can see. Both are good enough.

In the gelatin?

125/357 GD (SIG226): 15/.61
165/40 GD (Glock 22): 13.7/.74

FBI test series, the better 40s penetrate as well and get bigger while doing it too (avg 18/.55 v 16/.60). Speer 357SIG GD after cloth: 19/.54 (SIG P226). Speer 165 GD: 16/.60 (SIG P229). Dumping 425 ft lbs into 16 inches is as good as dumping 520 into 19 inches?

Into water jugs at my range:

125 GD 357SIG: in 5th jug at .58
165 GD 40S&W: in 3rd at .68

After cloth:

357S 5/.49
40S&W 4/.60

I like em both, I still like the 40 better.
 
Sense I work on a tight budget, I like reloading the 357 SIG a lot more than the .40 and .45. Reason: it's a heck of a lot cheaper to reload with 9mm bullets. I bought a very large bulk order which comes out to $27 per 1000 "plated" bullets. Even at no discount, you can buy high quality plated/jacketed 9mm bullets for $45 to $50 per 1000. I don't have to use the gooey, messy, smoky lead bullets, or the more expensive plated/jacketed "large" caliber bullets anymore. I'll leave spending more money to the menly men. :)

Currently, Natchez has a sale in their brand new catalogue for Blazer ammo at around $8.63 per box of 50. It doesn't quite match my excellent reloads at $3.72. But it's getting better all the time.

Regarding recoil:

It depends on the pistol model and size. A glock 31/22 handles perceived recoil nicely. The Glock 32/23 and Glock 33/27 start to get noticeable in recoil, but one can get used to it pretty easily with practice. Obviously, the smaller pistols will kick more than the larger ones, duh.

The heavy Beretta Cougar 357 is a very mellow gun to shoot based on what I've heard from two different Beretta groups. They claim it's the softest shooting 357 SIG on the market.

I shoot the Steyr M357 and I believe it is the softest shooting "light" pistol on the market -- very sweet.

And dang it, I must be talking to myself. BUT, the 357 SIG is supper mellow to shoot regardless of pistol model when using light to moderate loads. It's true that the only light load that's coming out that I know of is from Triton. But if you folks speak up, the demand can help drive the market. I realize not everybody reloads like I do.

If you can remember anything about the 357 SIG, then remember "9mm flexibility (greater bandwidth than the regular 9mm pistol)", "inherent accuracy" and "continuing to catch on". Heck, if you want to, you can even put in a .40 caliber barrel and shoot heavier, fatter bullets :)

cheers,
pete

[Edited by petej88 on 01-05-2001 at 05:52 PM]
 
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